Do you think Bill Belichick still trusts Urban Meyer (and his players for the draft)?

[Shockt327]

I'm kinda surprised the media hasn't picked up on this angle, hear me out....

Sure they've rightfully pointed out all the arrests the Gator's had experienced under Meyer. That's all fair game; he's open to criticism. But what you don't hear? Well -- and it's just a guess on my part -- but don't you think Urban Meyer would've given his seal of approval on a guy like AHern, since Bill Belichick, a good friend, drafted him? I know there was a lot of criticism of Hernandez pre-draft. Rightfully so. But the Pats took a chance on him. But I have a hard time believing that Belichick would do this if Urban didn't say he approved of AHern, right? So, Bill wasn't just rolling the dice. He was -- or so he thought - making an educated-decision when drafting AHern. Right? I mean, he had a more stable connection to AHern, through Urban, than the other teams did. You'd think that would equate to more info, thus, a better decision....or so one would think.

So, do you think Urban really told Bill everything he knew on AHern? Or do you think he kinda stayed quiet on some stuff? And do you think Bill will believe Urban in the future (by drafting lots of Ohio State players)? Or will Bill even trust him at all?

Or, am I just over-thinking all this? I mean, Belichick wrote a letter to a judge about Dennard, and look how that turned out. Honest mis-judgement, right? So, could Urban have made the same kind of honest misjudgment on AHern, pre-draft, maybe?

 

[Jimke]

Re: Do you think Bill Belichick still trusts Urban Meyer (and his players for the dra

Belichick is still bosom buddies with his pals in the coaching profession.
The trouble is the relationship with his own scouting department. If
BB doesn't trust them, he should clean house and replace them with former
coaching buddies.

 

[bresna]

Re: Do you think Bill Belichick still trusts Urban Meyer (and his players for the dra

The Patriots have always drafted good players that they feel can play on their team. Bill Belichick gets good insight into Meyer's team through their close relationship. Of course he's going to use that.

Now if Meyer were to say, "Yeah, this kid is good but he murdered somebody last year", then I think Bill might back away. Meyer would probably redshirt him anyway.

 

[RelocatedPatFan]

Re: Do you think Bill Belichick still trusts Urban Meyer (and his players for the dra

It all depends on what Meyers told BB and how far off from the truth the player turned out to be. Problem is, we'll never know what was said and/or recommended.

Besides, I'm a passenger on the draft brigade. So whatever I may think has little to do with what/who we get . Though the last time BB did ask me my opinion, I told him to go with a lineman.

 

[DarrylS]

Re: Do you think Bill Belichick still trusts Urban Meyer (and his players for the dra

Are fans forgetting that aside from the recommendation of Meyer or any coach, there is reliance on security personnel from inside the organization...

No one could have predicted with Hernandez did, not even Urban Meyer.. most of what happened did so in a very concentrated period of time, and coincided with him getting a boatload of cash..

I suspect that BB will value the opinion of Urban Meyer in the future, this is not Meyer's fault.

 

[Shockt327]

Re: Do you think Bill Belichick still trusts Urban Meyer (and his players for the dra

Are fans forgetting that aside from the recommendation of Meyer or any coach, there is reliance on security personnel from inside the organization...

Yes, but they aren't going to have the inside-info that a friendship w/ the coach would produce. Just saying...

No one could have predicted with Hernandez did, not even Urban Meyer.. most of what happened did so in a very concentrated period of time, and coincided with him getting a boatload of cash..

Except it really didn't. Not saying anything about meyer, here, but We've been hearing about AHern getting questioned in regards to a shooting way, way back during his college time in Florida. Also, we know of an alleged shooting that happened in 2012, before he signed that contract. So it goes way back.

I suspect that BB will value the opinion of Urban Meyer in the future, this is not Meyer's fault.

Ok, fair enough.

 

[DarrylS]

Re: Do you think Bill Belichick still trusts Urban Meyer (and his players for the dra

Yes, but they aren't going to have the inside-info that a friendship w/ the coach would produce. Just saying...

Except it really didn't. Not saying anything about meyer, here, but We've been hearing about AHern getting questioned in regards to a shooting way, way back during his college time in Florida. Also, we know of an alleged shooting that happened in 2012, before he signed that contract. So it goes way back.

Ok, fair enough.

Being questioned and charged are two completely different things..

Do you think that the Patriots were not aware of the Florida shenanigans?? He was cleared in the Florida incident(verified by the police there), and the shooting in Boston is still under investigation..

There is a lot of conjecture about AH, and most of which is proven not true.. there is no gang affiliation, this is a small group of thugs who went over the edge and did stupid, heinous things.

 

[Run DMC]

Re: Do you think Bill Belichick still trusts Urban Meyer (and his players for the dra

I know one thing, the majority of these UF players have been total busts or hardened criminals. Fail.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Re: Do you think Bill Belichick still trusts Urban Meyer (and his players for the dra

We don't know what Meyer told Belichick about guys like Spikes and Hernandez. For all that we know, he informed Bill that they were exceptionally talented and projected well to the pros, but were also potential headcases.

Nobody saw the Hernandez murder charge coming. Belichick obviously didn't, so why would he hold Meyer accountable for the same failure? I will grant that, if UM assured him that Spikes and Hernandez were good guys who would definitely clean up their acts, then that's problematic. All that it would really mean, though, is that his evaluations of players' character and maturity aren't the best.

 

[Brady6]

Do you think Bill Belichick still trusts Urban Meyer (and his players for the d

I'm kinda surprised the media hasn't picked up on this angle, hear me out....

Sure they've rightfully pointed out all the arrests the Gator's had experienced under Meyer. That's all fair game; he's open to criticism. But what you don't hear? Well -- and it's just a guess on my part -- but don't you think Urban Meyer would've given his seal of approval on a guy like AHern, since Bill Belichick, a good friend, drafted him? I know there was a lot of criticism of Hernandez pre-draft. Rightfully so. But the Pats took a chance on him. But I have a hard time believing that Belichick would do this if Urban didn't say he approved of AHern, right? So, Bill wasn't just rolling the dice. He was -- or so he thought - making an educated-decision when drafting AHern. Right? I mean, he had a more stable connection to AHern, through Urban, than the other teams did. You'd think that would equate to more info, thus, a better decision....or so one would think.

So, do you think Urban really told Bill everything he knew on AHern? Or do you think he kinda stayed quiet on some stuff? And do you think Bill will believe Urban in the future (by drafting lots of Ohio State players)? Or will Bill even trust him at all?

Or, am I just over-thinking all this? I mean, Belichick wrote a letter to a judge about Dennard, and look how that turned out. Honest mis-judgement, right? So, could Urban have made the same kind of honest misjudgment on AHern, pre-draft, maybe?

I don't think Hernandez was only drafted or even over drafted because of their relationship. The 4th round is exactly where he was projected to go. It doesn't appear that Urban was campaigning for BB to draft Hernandez.

I have to point out that if you're questioning whether BB trusts Meyer anymore, than you'd really have to ask the same question about whether Kraft trusts BB anymore. In both cases my opinion is yes.

 

[SHOWTIME15]

Re: Do you think Bill Belichick still trusts Urban Meyer (and his players for the dra

I know one thing, the majority of these UF players have been total busts or hardened criminals. Fail.

Spikes has been good and tebow has the chance to contribute.

 

[mgteich]

Re: Do you think Bill Belichick still trusts Urban Meyer (and his players for the dra

No team can afford to have top coaches and former coaches as scouts.

If BB doesn't trust them, he should clean house and replace them with former
coaching buddies.

 

[belichick010405]

Re: Do you think Bill Belichick still trusts Urban Meyer (and his players for the dra

I voted no because I think that while he may listen to Urban Meyer, the level of trust is probably gone. In my view, he will listen to Nick Saban long before Meyer for a number of reasons starting with off-field issues (Hernandez and Spikes) or the Jeff Demps debacle of signing a six figure signing bonus and never showing up in New England.

 

[PittPatriot]

Re: Do you think Bill Belichick still trusts Urban Meyer (and his players for the dra

I voted no because I think that while he may listen to Urban Meyer, the level of trust is probably gone. In my view, he will listen to Nick Saban long before Meyer for a number of reasons starting with off-field issues (Hernandez and Spikes) or the Jeff Demps debacle of signing a six figure signing bonus and never showing up in New England.

AHern
Demps: wasted money, seemed to openly extend a middle dinger to the organization
Spikes: sex tape, PEDs,seems to only do what he wants ands hasn't fully bought in
Cunningham: suspended for PEDs, kind of sucks
Chad Jackson: wasted pick, kind of sucked
Five picks from the same program that just don't seem to fit the Patriot mold. I think the PittPatriot no longer trusts Urban Meyer.

By the way, I am moving to Columbus area this Fall...was looking forward to seeing the Patriots potential farm team (OSU), but not so much now.

 

[PatsFanSince74]

Re: Do you think Bill Belichick still trusts Urban Meyer (and his players for the dra

This is a "Training Camp can't get here fast enough" thread.

Bill Belichick is a grown up. He knew the risks he was facing and he made a professional judgment that it was OK to take them.

None of us were in the room when Urban Meyer gave his "Bottom Line" view on Hernandez or anyone else, but we'd have to be very naive to think that it didn't include a recitation of his problems and ended with words to the effect that "He's a great talent, but you have all the facts and you have to make up your own mind about the other stuff."

In the final analysis this is a decision that the Patriots made with all the pertinent information on the table. Trying to say that Belichick or anyone else in the organization is immature or unreasonable enough to suggest that Meyer is remotely responsible or accountable for it turning out to have been a mistake is ridiculous.

 

[Kontradiction]

Re: Do you think Bill Belichick still trusts Urban Meyer (and his players for the dra

I know one thing, the majority of these UF players have been total busts or hardened criminals. Fail.

Chad Jackson and Jermaine Cunningham have been busts. The latter of which every UF fan here saw coming when we were advocating the team draft UF's other DE available in the draft that year (who has been unspectacular in his own rite). Chad Jackson was a moron that was originally brought in under Ron Zook, and not Urban Meyer, so your point fails there as well.

Hernandez and Spikes were and are both very productive players who came in and immediately filled holes at positions of extreme need coming out of the 2009 season. Nobody, including Meyer, saw Hernandez possibly committing a double homicide.

After you read those first two paragraphs, keep in mind that I am no Urban Meyer fan anymore.

 

[PittPatriot]

Re: Do you think Bill Belichick still trusts Urban Meyer (and his players for the dra

Chad Jackson and Jermaine Cunningham have been busts. The latter of which every UF fan here saw coming when we were advocating the team draft UF's other DE available in the draft that year (who has been unspectacular in his own rite). Chad Jackson was a moron that was originally brought in under Ron Zook, and not Urban Meyer, so your point fails there as well.

Hernandez and Spikes were and are both very productive players who came in and immediately filled holes at positions of extreme need coming out of the 2009 season. Nobody, including Meyer, saw Hernandez possibly committing a double homicide.

After you read those first two paragraphs, keep in mind that I am no Urban Meyer fan anymore.

I agree with with your post - except on 2 points:
1. Zook recruited C. Jackson but Meyer still coached him for his final season at UF - that is plenty of time to get to know one of your "star" players and give enough advice to a close friend of whether he should be traded up for in the draft.
2. Everyone who uses the "no one saw murder on the horizon for AHern" argument is correct to some degree…but the bottom line is, AHern fell almost 2 and half rounds in the draft based on off-field questions that teams were not comfortable with. That IS the red flag. No one saw the murder coming - but there were plenty of data points, rumors, "dropped charges," etc that made AHern a very high risk investment. The guy loved guns…somehow he was able to get into fights, shoot people, and probably even carry weapons all this time but NO ONE seemed to know. Regardless, SOMETHING kept him off certain draft boards and kept other teams away. One can argue the Patriots had the MOST intel on AHern based on the close relationship with UF and Meyer. Drafting him is one thing, but then giving him the King's Ransom (my NEP standards) BEFORE he has even played out his first contract is the larger, less forgivable error.

Obviously, this is all hindsight…and I was a huge AHern fan who still can't believe these events. And still in a sick, absurd way, I hope he is some how going to be able to get his life back.

 

[Salva135]

Re: Do you think Bill Belichick still trusts Urban Meyer (and his players for the dra

My vote is yes. These coaches' relationships with each other go well beyond one or even a few players. Belichick has relationships with a lot of college coaches and it has more to do with coaching philosophy than it does recommendations of players for him to draft.

 

[belichick010405]

Re: Do you think Bill Belichick still trusts Urban Meyer (and his players for the dra

Thank you for reminding us about Chad Jackson....

Here is a better question - Do you think that Bob Kraft and BB have had a discussion regarding Meyer and his relationship with the Patriots as to the players that have not had a positive impact on the Patriots franchise?

 

[Claremonster]

Re: Do you think Bill Belichick still trusts Urban Meyer (and his players for the dra

I'm kinda surprised the media hasn't picked up on this angle, hear me out....

Sure they've rightfully pointed out all the arrests the Gator's had experienced under Meyer. That's all fair game; he's open to criticism. But what you don't hear? Well -- and it's just a guess on my part -- but don't you think Urban Meyer would've given his seal of approval on a guy like AHern, since Bill Belichick, a good friend, drafted him? I know there was a lot of criticism of Hernandez pre-draft. Rightfully so. But the Pats took a chance on him. But I have a hard time believing that Belichick would do this if Urban didn't say he approved of AHern, right? So, Bill wasn't just rolling the dice. He was -- or so he thought - making an educated-decision when drafting AHern. Right? I mean, he had a more stable connection to AHern, through Urban, than the other teams did. You'd think that would equate to more info, thus, a better decision....or so one would think.

So, do you think Urban really told Bill everything he knew on AHern? Or do you think he kinda stayed quiet on some stuff? And do you think Bill will believe Urban in the future (by drafting lots of Ohio State players)? Or will Bill even trust him at all?

Or, am I just over-thinking all this? I mean, Belichick wrote a letter to a judge about Dennard, and look how that turned out. Honest mis-judgement, right? So, could Urban have made the same kind of honest misjudgment on AHern, pre-draft, maybe?

So, Urban knew that AHern was a sociopath? Really?