To Belichick It's About the Player Not The Position

[PatsFans.com Article]

To Belichick It's About the Player Not The Position
By: Christine Roy

As we know, Belichick has shown that just because your name has "QB" or some other position next to it on the roster, that doesn't mean that's where you'll play....

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[pdangle]

Sheesh. The first two pages of the "Pats sign Tebow" thread had deeper analysis than that found in this article. Good post though.

 

[borg]

Sheesh. The first two pages of the "Pats sign Tebow" thread had deeper analysis than that found in this article. Good post though.

I gave up years ago expecting to gain any insight from one of these homegrown articles. The quality is embarrassing

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

How in the world is 6'3 236 lb Tebow, who has never played the TE position, supposed to fill in for the extremely talented 6'6 265 lb Gronk? Wouldn't the 6'7 255 lb Sudfeld, who has actually played the position be a better fit, or Fells for that matter, or Hooman, or Brandon Ford or any number of currently unemployed TEs who have the requisite size as well as experience playing the position.

 

[RayClay]

Patriots Sign New Long Snapper | The Onion - America's Finest News Source

 

[BTTA]

I gave up years ago expecting to gain any insight from one of these homegrown articles. The quality is embarrassing

Yeah, feel the same way, although am trying to be supportive and patient...it's a process, and it's our Board.

 

[voluntarysaftey]

How in the world is 6'3 236 lb Tebow, who has never played the TE position, supposed to fill in for the extremely talented 6'6 265 lb Gronk? Wouldn't the 6'7 255 lb Sudfeld, who has actually played the position be a better fit, or Fells for that matter, or Hooman, or Brandon Ford or any number of currently unemployed TEs who have the requisite size as well as experience playing the position.

How did a smaller Julian Edelman, who never played any position except QB turn into a decent backup slot receiver his first year?

I have no idea whether Tebow will succeed in an non qb role here; but I think its worth a shot -- there's not much downside and a lot of upside if it happens. And he seems to have the physical and mental traits such that it could happen.

 

[Gumby]

The over-arching point of the article is valid - BB will find ways to use guys if they are talented and work hard.

But the parallels are very BADLY stretched.

Edel-dude was DRAFTED with the INTENTIONS OF BEING SOMETHING ELSE. Nobody wanted him as a QB. Pats included. The last 5'10" QB to make it in the league was Doug Flutie (and I think he was actually 11") and DL and OL both avg about 4" more in height since his day. Tebow was a college, was an NFL STARTING QB, and wants to still be one. You cant compare the two situations.

The Brown move onto D was somewhat a move of desperation on BB's part. The only desperation in the Tebow-signing is on Tebow's side as his possible last chance to make it in the league and rebuild his rep from what the Jesters did to him.

That a guy who has exactly 4 live-Game snaps (and only 1 comp) should be considered as having the "HEIR-APPARENT" role LOCKED UP is similarly absurd. Tebow may have a LONG, LONG, LONG way to go before he bumps Mallett on the depth chart; but that isnt to say that if the right bidder comes along at end of TC or mid-way through the season and Tebow proves to be not that much of a difference from Mallett in BB's eyes that BB doesn't cut bait on Mallet for a healthy pick from a desperate suitor ( and save a roster spot in the process). But he has a lot to prove as generally Mallet has to be considered to have a lot more upside at 6'6" compared to Tebow's 6'3". But if Tebow can learn playbook and anyone sees evidence he actually did FIX his technique issues down in FL w/ Weinke-Testaverde -- then Mallet should start worrying.

Agree as well w/ previous poster [armchair] about Tebow as a TE. Certainly not as a traditional TE and to put him on active 45 roster for a Vrabel EZ only role is pretty absurd as well.

I think the most important thing right now to BB is he upgraded the #3 QB on the cheap. Along with that BB got some significant skill sets for the scout QB position (he probably does a pretty good Rothlisberger impression for tackling purposes).

IMO The other roles he might be able to fit in on are:
- ST (he already did the punt protector / fake punt guy role, but could also play on coverage-return teams)
- team leadership /mentorship/attitude off the field and in training (he is lauded for this everywhere he has been).


But I dont see him converting to wr or te or rb anytime soon (and dont even discuss D - is he our new in-the-box S ) so folks should stop trying to wish sow's ears into purses.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Flutie was just over 5' 9" nowhere near 5' 11"

 

[Gumby]

Flutie was just over 5' 9" nowhere near 5' 11"

Thanks.

I couldn't remember, I remembered at least one year he had a magical-mystery .75 inch on his chart (he was like 5' 9.25" and was listed one year as 5'9" and next as 5'10" [using your #s]) but couldnt remember where it was in that ballpark.

 

[RelocatedPatFan]

IMO The other roles he might be able to fit in on are:
- ST (he already did the punt protector / fake punt guy role, but could also play on coverage-return teams)
- team leadership /mentorship/attitude off the field and in training (he is lauded for this everywhere he has been).

If he has any talent as the receiver/TE type, he could fill in for Hernandez when he ends up lining up in the backfield. However, why wouldn't you want Hernandez in over Tebow? Only time would be an extended Gronk absence for that style of play or to save Hernandez some reps/abuse.

and that's so thin that even Twiggy (or maybe Calista Flockhart for a more modern comparison?) would be saying it's anorexic.

All we can do is sit back and see how it plays out. No real downside unless BB can't keep the media levels within an acceptable range.

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

How did a smaller Julian Edelman, who never played any position except QB turn into a decent backup slot receiver his first year?

I have no idea whether Tebow will succeed in an non qb role here; but I think its worth a shot -- there's not much downside and a lot of upside if it happens. And he seems to have the physical and mental traits such that it could happen.

Edelman's the exception, not the rule.

If TT is on the roster to play TE, wouldn't someone who played the position in college and has TE size be a better alternative? He's not much of a QB and an extreme long shot at any other position, If he's not here to play QB, the downside is he's likely taking the roster spot of someone more deserving with a very small chance of it actually working. He is undersized, inexperienced and not very good at the position he currently plays, the upside is actually very low.

 

[patsfanincleveland]

I gave up years ago expecting to gain any insight from one of these homegrown articles. The quality is embarrassing

Based on the consistent brain dead level of your posting; you should be the first "contributor" banned from evaluating article content quality.

 

[spacecrime]

How in the world is 6'3 236 lb Tebow, who has never played the TE position, supposed to fill in for the extremely talented 6'6 265 lb Gronk? Wouldn't the 6'7 255 lb Sudfeld, who has actually played the position be a better fit, or Fells for that matter, or Hooman, or Brandon Ford or any number of currently unemployed TEs who have the requisite size as well as experience playing the position.

by this logic, any JAG TE would have been a better choice as TE than Antonio Gates.

Stop think position and think football player. Think Edelman. Played QB in college. Wouldn't it be better to have someh who actuallky played the position, like someone who played WR well in college, like Chad Jackson, Bethel Johnson, Taylor Price,etc?

Like Edelman, Tebow is a football player.

The fact that he hasn't played the position yet doesn't mean he cannot. Bruschi never played MLB until he did. Maybe before converting DL Bruschi to LB, we should have kept Monte Biesel?????

What is it with people?

 

[patsfanincleveland]

Edelman's the exception, not the rule.

If TT is on the roster to play TE, wouldn't someone who played the position in college and has TE size be a better alternative? He's not much of a QB and an extreme long shot at any other position, If he's not here to play QB, the downside is he's likely taking the roster spot of someone more deserving with a very small chance of it actually working. He is undersized, inexperienced and not very good at the position he currently plays, the upside is actually very low.

The NFL is going toward having 5 (or 6) "skill players" on offense and 7-8 "playing in space" guys on defense.

It wasn't that long ago that the concept of a "two TE" offense was as inconceivable as unicorn farms. Ditto things like "RB by committee" or interchangeable safeties.

Furthermore, you need to understand the sheer number of snaps this offense has during the course of a year.

In 2012, the offense had 1237 official snaps. That's huge.

It's a much different concept of where things are going vs the past.

 

[Concerned_Citizen]

How in the world is 6'3 236 lb Tebow, who has never played the TE position, supposed to fill in for the extremely talented 6'6 265 lb Gronk? Wouldn't the 6'7 255 lb Sudfeld, who has actually played the position be a better fit, or Fells for that matter, or Hooman, or Brandon Ford or any number of currently unemployed TEs who have the requisite size as well as experience playing the position.

The same way a lot of basketball guys get drafted into Tight end positions who have had little prior experience as a Tight End.

It's doable, and Tebow is athletic and strong enough to pull it off depending on his catching skills. Plus, one he has the ball in his hands in the secondary.... I think he'd actually do well. Doubt he'll be anywhere as good as Gronkowski, but I disagree with this idea that he can't make a change in position to TE.

It doesn't even have to be a permanent change. Tebow could be a versitile player.

 

[Sfpat]

Basketball players get drafted as TE's because 1) they're big, bigger than 6'5", 2) they're use to catching balls (rebounding) with their hands and 3) they're experienced running "routes" (while different than FB routes the principles are similar). The conversion isn't that difficult and most of them probably played FB in high school.

 

[Palm Beach Pats Fan]

the downside is he's likely taking the roster spot of someone more deserving...

We've had 3 open roster spots ever since signing him, reduced to two open spots today by signing the Cincinnati UDFA RB.

So how is someone being derived of a chance, when there are open roster spots?

Never mind that if someone better is out there and willing to sign, a signed player will be jettisoned in like 5 minutes. This has always been a stupid part of the argument- that any player on an unguaranteed contract with no bonuses at all is somehow depriving us of looking at someone else who may be better.

It's a boogeyman that simply does not exist.

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

by this logic, any JAG TE would have been a better choice as TE than Antonio Gates.

Except Gates was an All State TE in HS who spent his freshman year as a redshirt TE on the Michigan St football team before choosing to play basketball instead. Gates also has the requisite size for an NFL TE and obviously has the physical skills. He was a TE from day one and was only signed after a tryout.

Tebow does not have the size, 6'3 236 to go along with 31' + arms, does not have any experience playing TE and I would be hard pressed to list what skills he would bring to the TE position.

Stop think position and think football player. Think Edelman. Played QB in college. Wouldn't it be better to have someh who actuallky played the position, like someone who played WR well in college, like Chad Jackson, Bethel Johnson, Taylor Price,etc?

Edelman had transferable skills for the WR position, size, speed and elusiveness. He also was able to return kicks/punts. He also didn't spend 3 years playing another position in the NFL. Again, I don't know what Tebow will bring to the TE position.

The fact that he hasn't played the position yet doesn't mean he cannot. Bruschi never played MLB until he did. Maybe before converting DL Bruschi to LB, we should have kept Monte Biesel?????

Transferring from DLine in college to LB (Dane Fletcher, Ron Ninkovich) in the pros is a fairly common practice, much more common than QB to TE. Bruschi was too small to play DL in the pros. He started out with the Pats as a pass rushing DE transitioned to OLB then inside. Bruschi was 10 years into his Patriot career and 6th playing ILB/MLB when the Pats signed Biesel so I'm not sure what the point of bringing that up is.

What is it with people?

What is it with people indeed?

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

The NFL is going toward having 5 (or 6) "skill players" on offense and 7-8 "playing in space" guys on defense.

It wasn't that long ago that the concept of a "two TE" offense was as inconceivable as unicorn farms. Ditto things like "RB by committee" or interchangeable safeties.

Furthermore, you need to understand the sheer number of snaps this offense has during the course of a year.

In 2012, the offense had 1237 official snaps. That's huge.

It's a much different concept of where things are going vs the past.

Actually all those things existed in the past to differing degrees. The Pats already have 7 TEs on their roster, what exactly would Tebow bring that the others wouldn't?