The 2013 NFL Combine Thread

[Hercules Rockefeller]

If there was going to be a surprise pick for the Pats, I think Gavin Escobar might be it. I think he's a better prospect than Ertz and maybe even Eifert. He measures really nicely too:



https://twitter.com/MoveTheSticks/status/304619428170059776

For tight end I really like Travis Kelce from Cincinnati as a later selection in round 4 or 5 if he's there. I feel he may rise up the boards a little bit. He's an athletic former quarterback, late bloomer at the position but can really block and catch and has great size. I would love for the Pats to add him later on.

 

[manxman2601]

For tight end I really like Travis Kelce from Cincinnati as a later selection in round 4 or 5 if he's there. I feel he may rise up the boards a little bit. He's an athletic former quarterback, late bloomer at the position but can really block and catch and has great size. I would love for the Pats to add him later on.

I like him too but he WILL rise up the boards. Can't see him going later than the 3rd. I'm a Nick Kasa fan - Gronk size and athleticism but will likely go 4th to 5th because he's new to the position.

Gavin Escobar is really good though. I saw someone suggest he'll be the best TE of the class eventually and I think they may be right.

 

[Hercules Rockefeller]

I like him too but he WILL rise up the boards. Can't see him going later than the 3rd. I'm a Nick Kasa fan - Gronk size and athleticism but will likely go 4th to 5th because he's new to the position.

Gavin Escobar is really good though. I saw someone suggest he'll be the best TE of the class eventually and I think they may be right.

That's been my concern is that he will rise up---when I first saw him play this year I couldn't find him on any lists, and I just checked and now he's in the top 75 on NFL.com . We're on the same page, I love Kasa too. He has tremendous size and can block, and got to play against high level competition on a bad team so he's undervalued. I'll have to look into Escobar, not familiar with him. There's a number of nice TE prospects in the mid rounds of this draft, and I hope BB notices and takes advantage. The 2 TE offense is great, but it needs to have two productive players. Having Gronk, Hernandez, Ballard and a rookie would allow them to save a little money with no Fells/Hooa and be more productive than they were this year.

 

[manxman2601]

Wisconsin tackle Ricky Wagner met with a Patriots scout last night.

https://twitter.com/jeffphowe/status/304683588006330368

 

[Sciz]

I like Wagner. Could definitely be a starting RT candidate as a rookie if Vollmer moves on.

 

[manxman2601]

One of my favourites:

Cahokia native Terron Armstead (306 lbs) expects to run 40 in the 4.7 range and get at least a 35-inch vertical. #STL #NFLCombine

https://twitter.com/Ron_Clements/status/304705405399998464

Since 1999, only one OT has had a vert greater than 35" and that was only 35.5". and only two have run in the 4.7's (Bruce Campbell and Joe Staley).

Something to keep an eye on.

By the way, this is an excellent resource for tracking previous results in an easy to access format.

NFL Combine Results - Historical NFL Scouting Combine Data

Just click on NFL Combine Data at the top of the page.

 

[Kontradiction]

manx, do you have any intriguing RG prospects that I should be keeping my eye on?

 

[manxman2601]

manx, do you have any intriguing RG prospects that I should be keeping my eye on?

Well for the Patriots, an OG is likely to be a OT in college. Bakhtiari of Colorado is certainly a possibility because he can play all 5 OL positions (and we've interviewed him) and I wouldn't look far beyond Armstead because of his athleticism. Brian Winters also looks like he might be a fit; has the nasty the Patriots like. Also keep an eye out for good beards

Whilst it's not definitive, a vert of around 30" or better seems to be a fairly consistent indicator so I'd be looking for an OT with a good vertical jump.

 

[manxman2601]

manx, do you have any intriguing RG prospects that I should be keeping my eye on?

How about Hugh Thornton of Illinois. He's a ex-wrester which is familiar:

Offensive linemen are expected to take on and fend off 300-pound rushers on each snap. And for Illinois' Hugh Thornton, his wrestling background has helped develop his physical ability on the football field.

“I think wrestling definitely has an influence on how I play,” Thornton said. “It's physical, it's one-on-one, it's domination, and it's why I play the offensive line.”

Thornton was a two-time Idaho state heavyweight wrestling champion as a sophomore and junior in high school. He moved to Oberlin, Ohio, for his senior season of football and also finished third in the state of Ohio in wrestling at heavyweight.

2013 Combine notes: Bakhtiari latest Colorado offensive line product - CBSSports

 

[Sciz]

https://twitter.com/MoveTheSticks/status/304761562827223040

According to several sources, Azusa Pacific OT Luke Marquardt won the weigh-ins… Heard comparisons to Ivan Drago and Sid Vicious (wrestler)

He's my favorite late-round OT, but that might be changing if his stock increases too much. Had Jackie Slater as his OL coach.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Well for the Patriots, an OG is likely to be a OT in college. Bakhtiari of Colorado is certainly a possibility because he can play all 5 OL positions (and we've interviewed him) and I wouldn't look far beyond Armstead because of his athleticism. Brian Winters also looks like he might be a fit; has the nasty the Patriots like. Also keep an eye out for good beards

Especially ugly red ones.

 

[Get it shawtaay]

I like Wagner. Could definitely be a starting RT candidate as a rookie if Vollmer moves on.

Good call. While his athleticism has been called into question, he could be a run blocker of "Wagnerian" proportions.

 

[Sciz]

Pats tackle a problem | Boston Herald

Colorado’s David Bakhtiari had a formal meeting with the Patriots last night, while Wisconsin’s Ricky Wagner and Syracuse’s Justin Pugh are among the tackles who had earlier interviews with Pats scouts.

Already knew about the first two, but Pugh is new. Like Bakhtiari's connection with Solder, Pugh went to school and presumably practiced head to head quite often with Chandler Jones.

The article also brings up a good point about Bakhtiari's versatility being a big asset if he were to not end up starting, as he could in theory be a better version of McDonald as a four or five position backup.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

One of my favourites:



https://twitter.com/Ron_Clements/status/304705405399998464

Since 1999, only one OT has had a vert greater than 35" and that was only 35.5". and only two have run in the 4.7's (Bruce Campbell and Joe Staley).

Only one at the Combine, of course:

Vollmer turned in times of 5.13 and 5.16 seconds in the 40-yard dash and also had a 36 1/2-inch vertical and a 9-foot, 3-inch broad jump.

 

[manxman2601]

Been having a look at Combine scores and Patriot draft picks (and some Free Agents) to see what correlation there is and whilst this isn't an exhaustive or scientific piece of research, at least for OL and WR's there's a pretty clear combine rquirement.

For OL it's the Vertical Jump which measures lower body explosiveness. The cut off point seems to be 30" - there have been some drafted with a vert of under 30 but ithen only just:

As ctpatsfan77 notes above, Solder had a 36.5 vert at his pro day. In addition:

Logan Mankins (31.5)
Kyle Hix (32)
Nate Solder (32)
Nick Kazcur (31.5)
Marcus Cannon (30.5)
Thomas Welch (29)
Dan Connolly (28.5)
Greg Robinson-Randall (26.0)
Ryan O'Callaghan (25)
Dan Koppen (28.5)

(Can't find anything on Matt Light)


As for Wide Receivers, we all know about the 3-cone. Again it's very noticeable:

Tiquan Underwood (6.62)
Greg Salas (6.65)
Deion Branch (6.71)
Chad Jackson (6.74)
Taylor Price (6.82)
David Givens (6.82)
Jabar Gaffney (6.87)
Anthony Gonzalez (6.65)
Jeremy Ebert (6.7)

So it seems to apply even for some FA's (not Wes Welker interestingly @ 7.09).

This might not be an exhaustive list but I'll be pretty much taking any OL off my board if thet have a Vert lower that 27-28 and any WR's with 3-cone higher than 6.9 (fingers crossed for Markus Wheaton )

Edit: And if we're looking at possible FA WR's this year, you might not want to look too much past Brian Hartline with a 3-cone of 6.65. And I just want to credit the beast that is Julio Jones. 6'3" and he puts up a 6.66 3-cone. wow!

 

[manxman2601]

Just had a look at CB's. Only three that I can see had a slower 40 time than 4.45: Eugene Wilson (drafted to play safety), Alfonzo Dennard (value) and Asante Samuel. Eugene Wilson and Samuel were the only ones to have a 3-cone slower than 6.85.

Edit: Also look for a 10 yard split of 1.50 or better for CB's.

 

[chevss454]

Pats tackle a problem | Boston Herald


Already knew about the first two, but Pugh is new. Like Bakhtiari's connection with Solder, Pugh went to school and presumably practiced head to head quite often with Chandler Jones.

The article also brings up a good point about Bakhtiari's versatility being a big asset if he were to not end up starting, as he could in theory be a better version of McDonald as a four or five position backup.

Joeckel and Eric Fisher are on everyone's top 10 list & will be long gone by 29.

Ricky Wagner is built like a T, (6'6", 305, 33.5" arms) & played LT for Wiscy but projects to RT in the NFL. He isn't your typical road grader that Wisconsin is known for sending the NFL. He's a projected 5-6 round choice.

Bakhtiari (RT) & Solder were team mates at Colorado. Bakhtiari is undersized at 6'4", 300lbs. (Bock T' are EE) has a lot riding on his physical measurements at the Combine today. If his arms are short he projects to move inside to G but he'll have to add mass to fight with the huge DTs he'll face. If his arms measure well, he stays at OT. Note: Colorado runs double TE sets which means Bakhtiari almost always had help against edge rushers. He's a projected 2-3 round pick.

Justin Pugh went head to head quite often with Chandler Jones in practice at Syracuse. Pugh lacks ideal arm length for an NFL OT (31.5). Most analysts are projecting him at OG. As a G, he projects to the 3rd round.

One guy I hope the Pats interview is Menelik Watson. Watch for him at the Combine. He's 6'5", 320 lbs and super athletic. He played JUCO ball at Saddlebrook in California along side Kyle Long, Howie's son who transferred there from FSU after getting kicked out for DUI arrests. Many recruiters had Watson rated better than Kyle Long b/c of his outstanding athleticism. Watson transferred to FSU on Long's recommendation & played 1 yr for FSU where he performed very well.

Imo, Scar could make this guy a star in no time. He projects as a 2-3 round pick but many analysts say his upside is the same as top picks Joeckel & Fisher.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

As for Wide Receivers, we all know about the 3-cone. Again it's very noticeable:

Tiquan Underwood (6.62)
Greg Salas (6.65)
Deion Branch (6.71)
Chad Jackson (6.74)
Taylor Price (6.82)
David Givens (6.82)
Jabar Gaffney (6.87)
Anthony Gonzalez (6.65)
Jeremy Ebert (6.7)

So it seems to apply even for some FA's (not Wes Welker interestingly @ 7.09).

This might not be an exhaustive list but I'll be pretty much taking any OL off my board if thet have a Vert lower that 27-28 and any WR's with 3-cone higher than 6.9 (fingers crossed for Markus Wheaton )

Edit: And if we're looking at possible FA WR's this year, you might not want to look too much past Brian Hartline with a 3-cone of 6.65. And I just want to credit the beast that is Julio Jones. 6'3" and he puts up a 6.66 3-cone. wow!

You forgot Edelperson's 6.62.

In any case, though, Welker's 3-cone wasn't elite, but his short shuttle time of 4.01 is pretty impressive, and even Madden knows he has elite acceleration.

 

[Wilfork#75]

Two of my favourite guys:

Justin Hunter 6-foot-4 196 with arms over 33inches
Love his length but will need to bulk up a little bit. Should blow up the drills.

Matt Barkley 6-foot-2 1/2 227lbs.
I think this can officially end the poor measurable argument against him. He is bigger than Geno Smith, Ryan Nassib and Tyler Wilson.

 

[patsinthesnow]

Ace Sanders 5'7 173 pounds

Get him in the 7th bill!