New Look Secondary, with Chung off the bench

[rookBoston]

I'm really pleased to see the secondary playing with so much spirit and pop.

The biggest shock for me is that Chung was playing with the 2nd stringers against Houston, and didn't see the field at all until the 2nd half long after the game was pretty much decided. Arrington, too, didn't really play until Talib went down... and then when he finally got on the field, he was fired up.

Great improvement against a great passing attack. But who would have thought our go-to starters would be Gregory, McCourty, Dennard and Talib? Give credit to Belichick the GM for completely re-working the secondary.

 

[Hael]

Dennard/Talib/McCourty/Gregory is the pure cover group. Arrington is sorta ok in the slot, and Chung is your blitzer/Run stopper/In the box safety.

Chung is a great player, but you simply can't keep him out there all game. His lack of cover skills are eventually exposed, and he ends up hurting himself.

Wilson is still developing, but I like his upside.

All in all, the talent is there. You don't have elite man to man shutdown corners, but you can expect an above average team D group if they keep on improving and play smart.

 

[leehanu]

Secondary keeps improving for the last couple of weeks. Hopefully continues the progression.

 

[Armchair Quarterback]

Dennard/Talib/McCourty/Gregory is the pure cover group. Arrington is sorta ok in the slot, and Chung is your blitzer/Run stopper/In the box safety.

Chung is a great player, but you simply can't keep him out there all game. His lack of cover skills are eventually exposed, and he ends up hurting himself.

Wilson is still developing, but I like his upside.

All in all, the talent is there. You don't have elite man to man shutdown corners, but you can expect an above average team D group if they keep on improving and play smart.

Arrington has been better than sorta ok lately and Chung is far from a great player.

 

[mayoclinic]

Great improvement against a great passing attack. But who would have thought our go-to starters would be Gregory, McCourty, Dennard and Talib?

I would. We've been discussing it for 6 weeks now:

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...ass-defense-about-go-terrible-very-good.html

 

[Off The Grid]

But who would have thought our go-to starters would be Gregory, McCourty, Dennard and Talib?

This guy: MayoClinic: Pats Pass Defense is About to go from Terrible to Very Good!!

And this guy: Fanatical Yankee: Ripple Effect: The Aqib Talib Trade Just Significantly Improved 4 Positions!!

I hope you don't mind, Brother Mayo: You don't do much bragging about your Prescience...so I sort of feel obliged to do so for you!!

Give credit to Belichick the GM for completely re-working the secondary.

Well said, Brother Boston!!

 

[Off The Grid]

I would. We've been discussing it for 6 weeks now:

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...ass-defense-about-go-terrible-very-good.html

Ok...maybe a little bragging!!

 

[TyronePoole]

A little concerned about injuries to Talib, Dennard and Arrington in that game. All three left and didn't return though the latter two left after the game was well over so that's probably nothing. I think Talib probably has a bruised hip rather than anything pulled or strained based on how he landed which is good in terms of recovery time but bad in terms of being able to play through it before it's 95% as a CB.

 

[RayClay]

Seems like Gregory isn't getting credit for playing very well.

 

[mayoclinic]

Seems like Gregory isn't getting credit for playing very well.

I thought he played a terrific game. He was very active throughout, he wasn't out of position. He made a nice saving tackle on Johnson that prevented a potential big gain, and he showed much better awareness of what was going on than previously. Thing seem to be coming together nicely.

As I stated in the "prediction" thread about the secondary, I felt that improvement would be due to 3 things:

1. Upgrade in personnel: the move of McCourty to safety, the acquisition of Talib at one CB spot and emergence of Denanrd at the other, and the return of Gregory at the other safety position.

2. Continuity/cohesion: not changing personnel every week with injuries and dealing with inconsistency has helped considerably. You can see that players are beginning to understand the schemes and their roles, and McCourty is acting as the ringleader of the secondary.

3. Synergy with the front 7. That also has been clear, with much more aggressive play up front. Mayo has been let lose, there has been more blitzing, and more aggressive play in general now that the coaching staff seems comfortable that the secondary is more solid than tissue paper.

It seems to be evolving nicely. Colin Kaepernick and the 49ers will be another good test - a mobile QB, a team with a good rushing attack, and a big play TE who can pose difficulties. But I feel that the defense has the playmakers to handle most offenses, assuming they are able to get on the field.

 

[RayClay]

I thought he played a terrific game. He was very active throughout, he wasn't out of position. He made a nice saving tackle on Johnson that prevented a potential big gain, and he showed much better awareness of what was going on than previously. Thing seem to be coming together nicely.

As I stated in the "prediction" thread about the secondary, I felt that improvement would be due to 3 things:

1. Upgrade in personnel: the move of McCourty to safety, the acquisition of Talib at one CB spot and emergence of Denanrd at the other, and the return of Gregory at the other safety position.

2. Continuity/cohesion: not changing personnel every week with injuries and dealing with inconsistency has helped considerably. You can see that players are beginning to understand the schemes and their roles, and McCourty is acting as the ringleader of the secondary.

3. Synergy with the front 7. That also has been clear, with much more aggressive play up front. Mayo has been let lose, there has been more blitzing, and more aggressive play in general now that the coaching staff seems comfortable that the secondary is more solid than tissue paper.

It seems to be evolving nicely. Colin Kaepernick and the 49ers will be another good test - a mobile QB, a team with a good rushing attack, and a big play TE who can pose difficulties. But I feel that the defense has the playmakers to handle most offenses, assuming they are able to get on the field.

He's no superstar, but he's around the ball and wraps up and stops guys. What a difference from last year when I struggled to find a safety on the field on big plays. McCourty's got more big play ability, but Gregory's putting the safe into safety.

Always around the ball in the Jets laugh fest too.

It's noticeable that we haven't had those "of ******" plays with four players right there failing to stop a big 30-40 yard play. Tells me we have some good communication back there.

If Chung's healthy, he offers a different set of skills. I like to see players have to work for snaps, builds character.

Also, as I said before, Denard and Talib look like corners while the rest of our secondary look like defensive backs. Just became more obvious in this game. That ability to stay relaxed while reacting to the receiver, route and QB can't be taught, though there are successful players who just outwork others, as well as natural cornerbacks who squander their ability because they're meatheads (Asante Samuel).

 

[WhiZa]

Chung is a great player, but you simply can't keep him out there all game. His lack of cover skills are eventually exposed, and he ends up hurting himself.

He is not good in coverage. Pairing Gregory with him was really a bad idea to begin with since they both are weak against the pass, but better against the run. Adding McCourty made up for it though so now we can have a true center fielder that can go out and get the ball.

 

[BradyManny]

I think we're learning that Pat Chung is not a very good safety and Devin McCourty is.

The injuries that occurred in the secondary* last nite are hopefully minor, because I do not want to go back to a secondary with Chung in the backend and McCourty at corner (not that he was bad there, but I like him as our rangey safety).

*Justin Francis needs to have a talking to for taking out his own teammate on one of the dumber NFL football plays I've seen in my life.
**Talib looked OK, looked like he was playing it safe.
***I didn't see Dennard's injury.

 

[PatsFan2]

I'll say this I love seeing Chung on the Bench.:singing::rocker:

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

It seems to be evolving nicely. Colin Kaepernick and the 49ers will be another good test - a mobile QB, a team with a good rushing attack, and a big play TE who can pose difficulties. But I feel that the defense has the playmakers to handle most offenses, assuming they are able to get on the field.

If you're referring to Vernon Davis, he's been invisible for a couple months now other than 1 game. I think if we put a spy on Colin and handle the run game (which we normally do quite well) we'll be fine even if Dennard has to miss time with the hammy.

I think an injury can be overcome given the lack of a potent offense on the remaining schedule, but the hard part IMO about the injuries is that the D was really starting to gel and this might disrupt our momentum. If Dennard has to miss time I think I'd prefer just replacing him with Cole and keeping DMC at FS and Arrington at nickel back, instead of moving one to starting corner. Try to keep things aligned as much as possible.

 

[brdmaverick]

Chung is a great player, but you simply can't keep him out there all game. His lack of cover skills are eventually exposed, and he ends up hurting himself.

.

sometimes the word 'great' gets used too loosely

 

[BradyFTW!]

Dennard/Talib/McCourty/Gregory is the pure cover group. Arrington is sorta ok in the slot, and Chung is your blitzer/Run stopper/In the box safety.

Chung is a great player, but you simply can't keep him out there all game. His lack of cover skills are eventually exposed, and he ends up hurting himself.

Wilson is still developing, but I like his upside.

All in all, the talent is there. You don't have elite man to man shutdown corners, but you can expect an above average team D group if they keep on improving and play smart.

He definitely isn't. At his best, he wasn't especially good, and he was far from his best before he got hurt this year. I can't take credit for knowing what the solution was ahead of time (only a few people here can, namely mayoclinic), but it was abundantly clear that Chung was part of the problem.

TBH, I was relieved to see him playing with the scrubs. In the back of my mind, I was a little worried that he was still dinged up, and would have a more prominent role once healthy. Playing him in the 4th quarter last night suggests that he is healthy, but Belichick recognizes that he just isn't good enough to have a significant role.

 

[Patjew]

Chung had a great penalty late in the game. That's about the only greatness I've seen from him since 2010 or so.

 

[BradyFTW!]

If you're referring to Vernon Davis, he's been invisible for a couple months now other than 1 game. I think if we put a spy on Colin and handle the run game (which we normally do quite well) we'll be fine even if Dennard has to miss time with the hammy.

I think an injury can be overcome given the lack of a potent offense on the remaining schedule, but the hard part IMO about the injuries is that the D was really starting to gel and this might disrupt our momentum. If Dennard has to miss time I think I'd prefer just replacing him with Cole and keeping DMC at FS and Arrington at nickel back, instead of moving one to starting corner. Try to keep things aligned as much as possible.

Who spies on Kaepernick in that scenario? Mayo seems like the most likely candidate, maybe Hightower?

 

[BradyFTW!]

Chung had a great penalty late in the game. That's about the only greatness I've seen from him since 2010 or so.

Don't forget the great fumble on that fake punt that he called for, possibly costing us a playoff game against the ******* Jets.

Seriously, if that play had been called and executed by someone that didn't already have an unwarranted reputation for being one of the "good" guys, people would still be talking about it today. Imagine if it had been Meriweather.