Marshall Faulk thinks Brady is the MVP over Peyton

[SVN]

Frankly Luck should be considered for MVP if they really mean MVP.

 

[Avenger]

Peyton is certainly comeback player of the year,but MVP.....not so sure about that.

No, AP deserves it

 

[Ring 6]

Marshall Faulk and a common sense argument does not compute. It's been a pleasure knowing most of you on Patsfans. I'm going to see about those Mayan prophecies.

A broken clock is right twice a day.
I didn't look at the clip, but I saw Faulk discussing this on Sunday. At one point he says "special teams: there kicker missed a FG to lose the game against Baltimore, so they have no special teams either". Ironically this was right after the special teams helped destroy the Jets, not long after both KO and punt returns for Tds, and with coverage units that I do not remember giving anything up all year. What a tool.

 

[Ring 6]

Only in the minds of those who don't take the time to actually think about it. And "forgiving" the ints is the same as saying "I'm completely biased and looking for excuses".

As is the argument that Manning is more relied upon. That in and of itself is meaningless, unless they are AS GOOD OR BETTER.
Doing as well with a lesser supporting cast is an argument, doing worse while blaming a lesser supporting cast is an excuse.

 

[Sparetire]

No, AP deserves it

AP deserves both.

 

[borg]

As is the argument that Manning is more relied upon. That in and of itself is meaningless, unless they are AS GOOD OR BETTER.
Doing as well with a lesser supporting cast is an argument, doing worse while blaming a lesser supporting cast is an excuse.

Good stuff. Guess you really believe Manning is doing worse.
But lets add a little context to the "Manning Comes to Denver" story.
Denver 2011 vs Denver 2012

Passing 2011 vs 2012
Passing yds/game....152 yds vs 283 yds
Passing TDs/game...1.25 TDs vs 2.42 TDs

Rushing 2011 vs 2012
Rushing yds/game 164.5 yds vs 103 yds
Rushing TDs...11 total vs 6 YTD

Points 2011 vs 2012
19 points/game vs 29 points/game

Wins 2011 vs 2012
8 Total vs 9 wins with 4 to go

These stats alone is why Manning will walk away with the award. The D and skill players are mostly the same as 2011, but Denver should increase wins by 3-4 games by scoring 10 points more /game than 2011........the Manning Effect.

Brady 2011 vs 2012

Brady throwing 32 yds/game fewer than 2011
Brady on pace to throw 6 fewer TDs than 2011
Wins... 13 vs 9 YTD with 13 being the possible top

Brady didn't win the MVP in 2011 with those stats....yet you expect him to get the trophy with lesser numbers.

Then.....factor in the improved 2012 rushing of NE....+30 yds/game this year with 19 TDs YTD vs 18 for all 2011.

Lastly...here's the list of the last 5 MVP winners...Rodgers, Brady, Manning, Manning, Brady. I see a list of winners that carried their team despite below average running attacks. You may not agree, but voters heavily factor in the disproportionate amount of offense these players had to contribute. Will Brady get votes for leading a balanced attack?
When its all said and done, one guy will be a viewed as elevating his team while our guy will be viewed as maintaining his consistently high level of play.

 

[goheels22002]

Most likely to win MVP: Peyton Manning vs. Tom Brady - NFL Videos

That video is like watching two armless guys play Rock-Paper-Scissors.

 

[BradyManny]

Good stuff. Guess you really believe Manning is doing worse.
But lets add a little context to the "Manning Comes to Denver" story.
Denver 2011 vs Denver 2012

Passing 2011 vs 2012
Passing yds/game....152 yds vs 283 yds
Passing TDs/game...1.25 TDs vs 2.42 TDs

Rushing 2011 vs 2012
Rushing yds/game 164.5 yds vs 103 yds
Rushing TDs...11 total vs 6 YTD

Points 2011 vs 2012
19 points/game vs 29 points/game

Wins 2011 vs 2012
8 Total vs 9 wins with 4 to go

These stats alone is why Manning will walk away with the award. The D and skill players are mostly the same as 2011, but Denver should increase wins by 3-4 games by scoring 10 points more /game than 2011........the Manning Effect.

You are ignoring who their QB was last season - a guy who can't even beat out Mark Sanchez. Not to mention you ignore that Manning brought a bunch of Indy talent and scheme with him.

Funny how Peyton Manning adds 10 points to what was a joke of an offense under Tebow and it's the reason he shouldn't win MVP. No one seems to mention that the Cassel-led offense scored 11 less PPG without Brady in 2008, everyone focuses on the 11 wins (which BTW, is 5 less than Brady provided).

Ignore the noise. Peyton hasn't done anything deserving of the MVP yet. He might. But all he's really done so far is tear apart terrible defenses yet get soundly beaten by the good teams while trying to make it look close with some late garbage work.

If he loses in the first round of the playoffs and wins the MVP award, then it will be another classic prototypical Peyton season.

 

[Uncle Rico]

Good stuff. Guess you really believe Manning is doing worse.
But lets add a little context to the "Manning Comes to Denver" story....

...
When its all said and done, one guy will be a viewed as elevating his team while our guy will be viewed as maintaining his consistently high level of play.

Good argument, and this debate will go on til the end. (And I'm sure a new thread will pop up approximately every other day until then ...)

There are so many standards people might think of when voting. But when Manning was winning it with the Colts, I always heard "the Pats can win without Brady, Colts can't without Manning, so Manning is most valuable to his team." By that standard, I'd point out again that Manning improved a team that was very young last year and still made the playoffs with Tim "The Jets wouldn't bench Buttfumble Sanchez until I was inactive" Tebow. Brady, meanwhile, has increasingly become the key figure in the Patriots' ongoing success.

I do think Manning moved ahead a bit (I'm surprised how some analysts are so impressed with the win over the Bucs after the fact; I seem to recall every one saying beforehand Manning would pick that secondary apart). Brady has a chance to elevate himself in this race with strong outings against Houston and SF. Then again ... he'd be just as happy if the Pats went into championship mode and ran more in those games.

 

[Deus Irae]

Good stuff. Guess you really believe Manning is doing worse.
But lets add a little context to the "Manning Comes to Denver" story.
Denver 2011 vs Denver 2012

Passing 2011 vs 2012
Passing yds/game....152 yds vs 283 yds
Passing TDs/game...1.25 TDs vs 2.42 TDs

Rushing 2011 vs 2012
Rushing yds/game 164.5 yds vs 103 yds
Rushing TDs...11 total vs 6 YTD

Points 2011 vs 2012
19 points/game vs 29 points/game

Wins 2011 vs 2012
8 Total vs 9 wins with 4 to go

These stats alone is why Manning will walk away with the award. The D and skill players are mostly the same as 2011, but Denver should increase wins by 3-4 games by scoring 10 points more /game than 2011........the Manning Effect.

Brady 2011 vs 2012

Brady throwing 32 yds/game fewer than 2011
Brady on pace to throw 6 fewer TDs than 2011
Wins... 13 vs 9 YTD with 13 being the possible top

Brady didn't win the MVP in 2011 with those stats....yet you expect him to get the trophy with lesser numbers.

Then.....factor in the improved 2012 rushing of NE....+30 yds/game this year with 19 TDs YTD vs 18 for all 2011.

Lastly...here's the list of the last 5 MVP winners...Rodgers, Brady, Manning, Manning, Brady. I see a list of winners that carried their team despite below average running attacks. You may not agree, but voters heavily factor in the disproportionate amount of offense these players had to contribute. Will Brady get votes for leading a balanced attack?
When its all said and done, one guy will be a viewed as elevating his team while our guy will be viewed as maintaining his consistently high level of play.

Broncos with Tebow: 7-4
Colts with Luck: 8-4

Manning's been completely replaced in Indianapolis, and he's not done much more than replace Tebow in Denver. Manning doesn't even belong in the top 5 in the MVP vote.

Brady
Luck
Peterson
Ryan
Watt
RGIII

all should be ahead of Manning in the MVP race.

 

[UK_Pat37]

AP deserves both.

If the Vikes make the playoffs, it'll be a crime if he doesn't get MVP!

 

[BananaRepublican]

Frankly Luck should be considered for MVP if they really mean MVP.

Valid point. I think we've never seen such good QB play across the league like this year. It may have to be a co-MVP and I would not be unhappy with that. When it's that close it doesn't make sense to award it to only one guy as if the other guy never existed. It hasn't happened often because "everybody loves a winner" but both guys (or maybe three) are winners, and having outstanding years.

Four games is a long way to go though. Tom needs to bring his "A" game Monday to obliterate memory of whatever Peyton or Luck will do Sunday.

Luck ... jeezuz ... that kid is going to be something. OROY is good enough though. MVP will have to go to a team with a divisional championship (at least.)

Tom did "beat" both of them (although I'm not a believer in one QB beating another - a bullcrap comparison that makes no sense.) I only mention this because some voters will swallow the bullcrap story that Tom "beat" the others. How about an arm wrestling contest? Then I'll believe one of them beat the other.

Unless it's a two hour draw.

 

[BananaRepublican]

Manning MVP? Absolutely NOT. He's getting sympathy votes just because he was hurt and came back.

So he's not playing lights-out NFL QB - on a new team, even?

Forget the injury and forget sympathy, just look at his stats, his lack of running game, the fact that he designed their offense, etc.

 

[shmessy]

You are ignoring who their QB was last season - a guy who can't even beat out Mark Sanchez.

Game-Set-Match in just ONE sentence!

 

[Deus Irae]

So he's not playing lights-out NFL QB - on a new team, even?

Forget the injury and forget sympathy, just look at his stats, his lack of running game, the fact that he designed their offense, etc.

He didn't design their offense. He brought the Indianapolis offense with him, thereby lessening his need to adapt. How is that a plus?

 

[shmessy]

Have to admit, Manning IS pretty funny.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Mp59nuBwIg

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

No, AP deserves it

Reggie Wayne is also certainly in the running for MVP...he is the lifeblood of that Colts offense and Luck would be out of Luck if Wayne was injured.

 

[Silver Blue&Red]

Let fivehead have the MVP, who cares. I want TB to get the FRA. (Four Rings Award).

 

[ausbacker]

Peyton is certainly comeback player of the year,but MVP.....not so sure about that.

Adrian Peterson has to be CPOTY. He just has to.

 

[Ring 6]

Good stuff. Guess you really believe Manning is doing worse.

Patriots 430 points Broncos 349. Of course he is doing worse.

But lets add a little context to the "Manning Comes to Denver" story.
Denver 2011 vs Denver 2012

Passing 2011 vs 2012
Passing yds/game....152 yds vs 283 yds
Passing TDs/game...1.25 TDs vs 2.42 TDs

You are going to compare his passing statistics to Tim Tebow in a discussion about MVP? Wow, that is the most misplaced argument I have ever seen.

Rushing 2011 vs 2012
Rushing yds/game 164.5 yds vs 103 yds
Rushing TDs...11 total vs 6 YTD

Points 2011 vs 2012
19 points/game vs 29 points/game

What does the rushing yards of a rushing offense compared to a passing offense have to do with anything?
Why are you comparing ppg to Tebow instead of Brady who's team is scoring almost a TD more a game?
Manning is a better passer than Tebow. You proved that well.
But we are talking about MVP not best Bronco Qb since 2010.

Wins 2011 vs 2012
8 Total vs 9 wins with 4 to go

Tebow 7-4
Manning 9-3

These stats alone is why Manning will walk away with the award. The D and skill players are mostly the same as 2011, but Denver should increase wins by 3-4 games by scoring 10 points more /game than 2011........the Manning Effect.

2 more wins and 1 less loss than the worst QB in the NFL with as you say mostly the same team is hardly MVP-esque.

Brady 2011 vs 2012

Brady throwing 32 yds/game fewer than 2011
Brady on pace to throw 6 fewer TDs than 2011
Wins... 13 vs 9 YTD with 13 being the possible top

Brady didn't win the MVP in 2011 with those stats....yet you expect him to get the trophy with lesser numbers.

You can't be that ignorant.

Then.....factor in the improved 2012 rushing of NE....+30 yds/game this year with 19 TDs YTD vs 18 for all 2011.

The Patriot running game is because of how teams defend them because of Brady.

Lastly...here's the list of the last 5 MVP winners...Rodgers, Brady, Manning, Manning, Brady. I see a list of winners that carried their team despite below average running attacks. You may not agree, but voters heavily factor in the disproportionate amount of offense these players had to contribute. Will Brady get votes for leading a balanced attack?

Again, you ignore the very basis of my comment.
You are arguing that an offense that scores less points is a better job by the the QB simply because they call fewer rushing plays.
Your argument is horrendous.

When its all said and done, one guy will be a viewed as elevating his team while our guy will be viewed as maintaining his consistently high level of play.

The MVP is not based on improving over last season, it is based on who has the best season. Again, your argument is horrendous.
Are you telling me that you feel Manning has outplayed Brady this year? Really?