3-4 and 4-3

[AzPatsFan]

3-4
We seem to have plenty of personnel for all positions and backups using a 3-4, 2-gap.

4-3
If Mayo, Spikes and Hightower are our starters, who are the backups. Ppatriots.com lists Rivera and White. In a 4-3 it seems that we have 11 linemen and 5 linebackers, including Rivera and White.

I suppose if one of the starters were injured, Scott or Ninkovich would be the backups.
===============

Hand the man, the kewpie doll. You can also add Cunningham and perhaps Jones too.

 

[Ring 6]

No doubt. It will be interesting to see how they come out on Sunday, though even then it may not be terribly representative of the norm. They're likely focusing on the run more this week, where against a better pass offense they might look totally different.

I will bet we see 3 300lbs on the DL for at least 10-15 snaps. Of course the score may have a lot to do with that.
I thnk we saw it zero preseason snaps.

 

[AzPatsFan]

Carter from Jones doesn't change anything. The big change is from Ellis/Deaderick to Ninkovich at left end.

In simple terms, that left end spot was filled by a big DL but is now filled by a small DL.

In slightly more complicated terms, the left end spot went from a player who is a 3-4 DE, 4-3 DT, or 4-3 Under LE to a 3-4 OLB, 4-3 DE, or 4-3 Under Sam.

It won't be a common Defensive formation, but I can see the hybrid Safety/LB playing occasionally with Chung, Ebner and or Dennard assuming the hybrid role too. Don't forget Tarpinian was a S in college, until he outgrew the position and they moved him to LB, too.

 

[12ClutchFactor]

I found this post over at Profootballweekly.com and I thought I'd stick it in this thread since I can't start a new one yet.

ProFootballWeekly.com - Patriots CB Arrington continues to surprise

For the third season in a row, Patriots CB Kyle Arrington earned a starting spot despite heated competition. This year, he fought off second-year CB Ras-I Dowling, whom many expected to win the job when he was healthy in the spring. secure a "starting spot" this year.

 

[Shockt327]

Last year we would often split the D so that it it was half-4/3 and half-3/4. Of course, often doesn't mean every down, cause we'd mix it up quite a bit with different guys playing different gaps/techniques.

Here's a good Grantland article by Chris Brown; the guy that runs the "Smart Football" blog, and easily knows more than any of us...

 

[IcyPatriot]

I'm still trying to figure out why this matters. We were in the nickel 65% of the time last year ...

We're a 6-5 team 65% of the time ... that 3-4 and 4-3 stuff is old school.

 

[celticboy04]

I'm still trying to figure out why this matters. We were in the nickel 65% of the time last year ...

We're a 6-5 team 65% of the time ... that 3-4 and 4-3 stuff is old school.

Greetings,
Yeah, I would think more along the lines of 3-3-5 and 4-2-5.

Celticboy04

 

[Ring 6]

I found this post over at Profootballweekly.com and I thought I'd stick it in this thread since I can't start a new one yet.

ProFootballWeekly.com - Patriots CB Arrington continues to surprise

I think we should wait until Sunday to see if this is accurate.
And btw, he was not a starter at the beginning of 2010

 

[Ring 6]

I'm still trying to figure out why this matters. We were in the nickel 65% of the time last year ...

We're a 6-5 team 65% of the time ... that 3-4 and 4-3 stuff is old school.

Because a 43 with 2 260lb DEs may take some of the nickle snaps away.

 

[jah]

I think the reason we're seeing 5 LBs and 6 DEs on the roster right now is because Ninkovich and Scott could play LB if needed. While it looks like there is little depth at the linebacker position both in quality and quantity, BB might categorize it as 4 DE, 2 DE/LB, and 5 LB. Nobody would be worrying right now if Ninkovich were listed as a linebacker. Then we would have 5 DE and 6 LB.

This also assumes the 4-3 personnel grouping that we've seen all preseason (not that I said grouping and not formation, because I wouldn't doubt that we'll see some 3-4 looks with a 260 pound defensive end even though it seems silly).

Personally, I'm still freaking out about our LB depth because what I just said is pure conjecture. It makes sense, though, and I hope that's how BB sees it.

 

[mgteich]

So, Mayo and Hightower are the LB's in the nickel. Who are the backups? Surely, we pull Spikes for a nickel back.

I'm still trying to figure out why this matters. We were in the nickel 65% of the time last year ...

We're a 6-5 team 65% of the time ... that 3-4 and 4-3 stuff is old school.

 

[Ring 6]

So, Mayo and Hightower are the LB's in the nickel. Who are the backups? Surely, we pull Spikes for a nickel back.

Ninkovich, Spikes (who did play in nickel last year, more later in the season) and White and Rivera. Plus on 3rd and long it will be dime with 1 LB and 6 dbs

 

[mgteich]

I get it. Belichick is seeing if Ninkovich can be a good choice at LDE. That's what preseason is for. My bet is that Deaderick is that Deaderick gets some reps at LDE in every game.

QUESTION 1: Who are the backups to the base package linebackers?

QUESTION 2: Presuming Spikes i out in the nickel, who are backups to Mayo and Hightower when we play the nickel?

QUOTE=Sciz;3134518]Last year's base defense:
LE: Ellis/Deaderick
DTs: Wilfork and Love, with some Haynesworth early
RE: Carter
Sam: Ninkovich
Mike: Spikes
Will: Mayo

This year's base defense:
LE: Ninkovich
DTs: Wilfork and Love
RE: Jones
Sam: Hightower
Mike: Spikes
Will: Mayo[/QUOTE]

 

[mgteich]

So, Ninkovich is our starting base LDE, our sub package DE, and our 1st backup to both Mayo and Hightower?

Ninkovich, Spikes (who did play in nickel last year, more later in the season) and White and Rivera. Plus on 3rd and long it will be dime with 1 LB and 6 dbs

 

[Ring 6]

So, Ninkovich is our starting base LDE, our sub package DE, and our 1st backup to both Mayo and Hightower?

Not quite sure he would start in the base (we will see) or be a DE in the sub (more doubtful) but neither would really impact his role as the backup LB with someone else playing that other role.

Are you saying someone starting at one spot can't move to another when there is an injury? Vrabel, Bruschi, AdT, Wilson, Wilfork, Seymour, Mankins, Vollmer among others would disagree.

 

[Deus Irae]

We'll have more insight into this quite soon.

 

[Ring 6]

We'll have more insight into this quite soon.

And then more later probably

 

[NinjaZX6R]

Wonder if we will see 34 D return like last season towards the end.

I can't wait till sunday.

 

[PP2]

Last year we would often split the D so that it it was half-4/3 and half-3/4. Of course, often doesn't mean every down, cause we'd mix it up quite a bit with different guys playing different gaps/techniques.

Here's a good Grantland article by Chris Brown; the guy that runs the "Smart Football" blog, and easily knows more than any of us...

I had an inkling something like this was in the works after consistently seeing Hightower one gap from the 30/40 tech in the preseason, but so gratifying to find this defined so well, and none other than Chris Brown. I used to have him bookmarked on my other computer but lost it all. I'll have to go back and do that. Can't believe I missed this. Great find!

 

[Joker]

THAT is another diagram that should be a sticky...how many times has someone explained what two gap means only to have the same question raised a few posts later...there is NOTHING better than a diagram to illustrate the technique...really nice post, Shock...I mean, for me, one of the top pieces posted here all summer.