A different view of Training Camp..

[DarrylS]

Always interesting to see how different folks view training camp, not to take away from someone else's observations.. but here is a somewhat different view.

BB gets a lot of his team for the 2 3/4 Hours of practice
Why Edelman is liked is obvious, he has one speed and never quits
Mallett on the 2nd team punt coverage is interesting, even thought ESPN did not report it.. was waiting for a jump pass.
Brady is in complete control
The linebackers seem as though they are developing into a nasty group with bad attitudes..
The WR corps of Welker, LLoyd, Gaffney and Stallworth are impressive
Gronk and Hernandez continue to develop and impress
Lots of hitting, only one post play dustup... Chung and Gronk
Bolden could be my new binkie, replacing BJGE...

 

[supafly]

The linebackers seem as though they are developing into a nasty group with bad attitudes..

This is the one that I am most pleased with.

The improvement of the WR position is 2nd place, but the 'nastiness' of the LB's would go a long, long way this year.

 

[Hudson Pats Fan]

SEC Assassins!:rocker:

 

[BlueThunder]

I'd like to see Bolden become one of the RB rotation. The FB's are expendable IMHO. Woody,Ridley,Vereen and Bolden would be fine in my book.
Keep an extra player at a different position of need.

 

[Sicilian]

I know camp is traditionally a time for eternal optimism, but does it seem to anyone else like this year has an unusually high percentage of positive reports? I don't just mean from posters here, but from media people both local and national as well.

You usually get a few "player X looks slow to me" or "player Y seems to be struggling to learn his assignments", etc. It seems like this year all we're hearing is:

The rookies all look good (or at least look like they belong)
The free agents look like they're fitting in nicely (or in Lloyd's case, could be special)
The returning WR's look like they never left
The bubble players (Brace, Cunningham, etc) are all showing additional burst.

Really the only negative I've heard so far is some lack of cohesion with the offensive line.

Could just be me, but it seems more positive than past years overall. Anyone else notice this?

 

[Kontradiction]

SEC Assassins!:rocker:

Indeed. As a Gator and SEC football fan, I'm absolutely loving this group of linebackers. They bring the wood, the attitude, and the insanity. Now if we could just go after some SEC safeties, my life would be complete.

 

[signbabybrady]

I know camp is traditionally a time for eternal optimism, but does it seem to anyone else like this year has an unusually high percentage of positive reports? I don't just mean from posters here, but from media people both local and national as well.

You usually get a few "player X looks slow to me" or "player Y seems to be struggling to learn his assignments", etc. It seems like this year all we're hearing is:

The rookies all look good (or at least look like they belong)
The free agents look like they're fitting in nicely (or in Lloyd's case, could be special)
The returning WR's look like they never left
The bubble players (Brace, Cunningham, etc) are all showing additional burst.

Really the only negative I've heard so far is some lack of cohesion with the offensive line.

Could just be me, but it seems more positive than past years overall. Anyone else notice this?

The secondary and Vareen has seen its share of criticism this TC both from the media and on here. I do agree with your point though the praise has been pretty thick and especially as the rookies have been concerned its over very little as they are only 5 practices deep.

I have been to all 5 practices and have seen some good things out of Hightower and Jones but there is some serious over hype going on for a handful of plays especially for Hightower. Jones' hype is probably right where it should but Hightower is reaching mythic proportions.

What I have seen through 5 practices is a passing game that may be at mythic proportions with targets galore and a defense that looks improved how much still remains to be seen. I see an o-line that missing 3 key pieces still seems to hold its own and two pieces should be back.

 

[NEGoldenAge]

I know camp is traditionally a time for eternal optimism, but does it seem to anyone else like this year has an unusually high percentage of positive reports? I don't just mean from posters here, but from media people both local and national as well.

You usually get a few "player X looks slow to me" or "player Y seems to be struggling to learn his assignments", etc. It seems like this year all we're hearing is:

The rookies all look good (or at least look like they belong)
The free agents look like they're fitting in nicely (or in Lloyd's case, could be special)
The returning WR's look like they never left
The bubble players (Brace, Cunningham, etc) are all showing additional burst.

Really the only negative I've heard so far is some lack of cohesion with the offensive line.

Could just be me, but it seems more positive than past years overall. Anyone else notice this?

It is striking how few reports there are of palyers looking lost. I think BB's investment in former college team captains and high character guys is really starting to pay off. This locker room is mature, professional and very hardworking. Most of them take their off-season seriosly and come to camp ready to go.

 

[NEGoldenAge]

Always interesting to see how different folks view training camp, not to take away from someone else's observations.. but here is a somewhat different view.

BB gets a lot of his team for the 2 3/4 Hours of practice
Why Edelman is liked is obvious, he has one speed and never quits
Mallett on the 2nd team punt coverage is interesting, even thought ESPN did not report it.. was waiting for a jump pass.
Brady is in complete control
The linebackers seem as though they are developing into a nasty group with bad attitudes..
The WR corps of Welker, LLoyd, Gaffney and Stallworth are impressive
Gronk and Hernandez continue to develop and impress
Lots of hitting, only one post play dustup... Chung and Gronk
Bolden could be my new binkie, replacing BJGE...

Good stuff.

Mallet on punt coverage is interesting, great catch.

Gronk seems to be taking a pounding from the defense so far. Any chance they're purposely being hard on him?

 

[patchick]

Indeed. As a Gator and SEC football fan, I'm absolutely loving this group of linebackers. They bring the wood, the attitude, and the insanity. Now if we could just go after some SEC safeties, my life would be complete.

Lining up Mayo, Spikes and Hightower together is incredibly exciting. But as for the safeties, it's amazing how scarce talent has been at that position lately. Consider Mark Barron going #7 overall vs. Hightower #25. And Brandon Taylor was really the only other SEC safety of note in the whole draft, after none went in the first two days of the 2011 draft.

 

[patsinthesnow]

The LB Core of (SEC Assassins, I like it) Mayo-Spikes-Hightower could become something special. One of them is already an All-Pro, one is a very good LB who could become All-Pro caliber if he could play a 16 game season, and one is a rookie who has a high ceiling and a high floor to begin with.

 

[Kontradiction]

Lining up Mayo, Spikes and Hightower together is incredibly exciting. But as for the safeties, it's amazing how scarce talent has been at that position lately. Consider Mark Barron going #7 overall vs. Hightower #25. And Brandon Taylor was really the only other SEC safety of note in the whole draft, after none went in the first two days of the 2011 draft.

I really liked Barron in the draft, but also took note that there was no way we were going to get him without giving up what it would take to trade up. That's just not Belichick's style. As it turns out, we ended up with two pretty good college players anyway.

 

[borg]

The toastability of the secondary, RT (Marcus Cannon), and C (Dan Koppen) has me somewhat nervous.
Secondary: If our WRs are looking all world....what does that say about the DBs. One particular report....Dowling has yet to make a play on the ball....is disconcerting to say the least.
RT: Cannon on the roster last year was a feel good story....and he deserved the benefit of the doubt coming off his recovery and lack of training camp...but I saw a guy that lacked lateral mobility and quickness. Therefore, G over RT seemed logical. But with Volmer being gimpy with worrisome back issues, Cannon may be called upon....and that's not good.
C: As Magic Johnson would say....Koppen is gettin blowed up. Hopefully he's just shaking off the rust....but he became a liability fending off strong interior D lines the last few years. Is it logical to assume an older Koppen will have addressed his obvious weakeness?

Putting those worries aside....I am a strong believer that a healthy, deeper S grouping with a full training camp under their belt ...will be a major improvement over the last man standing squad the Pats fielded to open last season. Last year, McCourty was on an island defending the sideline posts. If the Safeties can get to the sidelines faster this year, offenses may think twice targeting McCourty.

I am less optimistic believing the RT issues get resolved. Volmer had a weak '11 when he played and until he proves he has healed 100%, the Pats have problems. Factor in the possibility that their 6th O lineman,Gronk, doesn't regain his beastlike blocking skills. The Pats may need to rely on a quick passing game. Guess Brady will have to go for the homeruns on 1st down

As far as C goes, lets hope Koppen is depth only.

 

[Krugman]

I can only speak for myself,I believe those like me who cant attend this year appreciate the camp reports we get from fans.The perspective they bring is different,ie better,than many of the mainstream media.Thanks for your reports.

 

[jmt57]

The toastability of the secondary, RT (Marcus Cannon), and C (Dan Koppen) has me somewhat nervous.
Secondary: If our WRs are looking all world....what does that say about the DBs. One particular report....Dowling has yet to make a play on the ball....is disconcerting to say the least.
RT: Cannon on the roster last year was a feel good story....and he deserved the benefit of the doubt coming off his recovery and lack of training camp...but I saw a guy that lacked lateral mobility and quickness. Therefore, G over RT seemed logical. But with Volmer being gimpy with worrisome back issues, Cannon may be called upon....and that's not good.
C: As Magic Johnson would say....Koppen is gettin blowed up. Hopefully he's just shaking off the rust....but he became a liability fending off strong interior D lines the last few years. Is it logical to assume an older Koppen will have addressed his obvious weakeness?

Putting those worries aside....I am a strong believer that a healthy, deeper S grouping with a full training camp under their belt ...will be a major improvement over the last man standing squad the Pats fielded to open last season. Last year, McCourty was on an island defending the sideline posts. If the Safeties can get to the sidelines faster this year, offenses may think twice targeting McCourty.

I am less optimistic believing the RT issues get resolved. Volmer had a weak '11 when he played and until he proves he has healed 100%, the Pats have problems. Factor in the possibility that their 6th O lineman,Gronk, doesn't regain his beastlike blocking skills. The Pats may need to rely on a quick passing game. Guess Brady will have to go for the homeruns on 1st down

As far as C goes, lets hope Koppen is depth only.

The reports on Koppen getting manhandled are a bit disconcerting, but on the other hand Vince Wilfork has managed to do that to a couple other players over the course of his career. If Koppen is a liability keep in mind that the Pats were forced to turn to option three (Wendell) and option four (McDonald) for periods of time last year, and they more than held their own. At guard Donald Thomas has had a good week in both 7 on 7's and one on ones.

Regarding Dowling I read that he looked good, breaking up back-to-back passes to Lloyd.

 

[patfanken]

The toastability of the secondary, RT (Marcus Cannon), and C (Dan Koppen) has me somewhat nervous.
Secondary: If our WRs are looking all world....what does that say about the DBs. One particular report....Dowling has yet to make a play on the ball....is disconcerting to say the least.
RT: Cannon on the roster last year was a feel good story....and he deserved the benefit of the doubt coming off his recovery and lack of training camp...but I saw a guy that lacked lateral mobility and quickness. Therefore, G over RT seemed logical. But with Volmer being gimpy with worrisome back issues, Cannon may be called upon....and that's not good.
C: As Magic Johnson would say....Koppen is gettin blowed up. Hopefully he's just shaking off the rust....but he became a liability fending off strong interior D lines the last few years. Is it logical to assume an older Koppen will have addressed his obvious weakeness?

Putting those worries aside....I am a strong believer that a healthy, deeper S grouping with a full training camp under their belt ...will be a major improvement over the last man standing squad the Pats fielded to open last season. Last year, McCourty was on an island defending the sideline posts. If the Safeties can get to the sidelines faster this year, offenses may think twice targeting McCourty.

I am less optimistic believing the RT issues get resolved. Volmer had a weak '11 when he played and until he proves he has healed 100%, the Pats have problems. Factor in the possibility that their 6th O lineman,Gronk, doesn't regain his beastlike blocking skills. The Pats may need to rely on a quick passing game. Guess Brady will have to go for the homeruns on 1st down

As far as C goes, lets hope Koppen is depth only.

Both optimism and pessimism are being overblown by both fans and media alike. It's way too early to be making judgments on players. All we can do is get "indications", and even those will change from day to day. No one is going to win all their 1 or 1's and then you get the issue of the subjectivity of those doing the judging.

How often have we had conflicting reports about individual players. I've seen several reports about Cannon having a great camp. The fact is you can't judge players by success or failure in an individual drill. We don't know if during that rep a player is trying a new technique,or if the drill is set up to get a preconceived result.

When the Pats do their joint practices next week against the Saints we will get a much better picture of who is "flashing" and who is not and even then its way too early. As far as total yds go, the Pats had the 2nd worst defense in the history of the league last season, and I can only compare that to the dominant D. we saw from the first preseason game last year.

This is STILL a very young defense and it will be a work in progress for most of this season. Besides it really doesn't matter where a defense ranks until its playoff time. Haven't the Giants last 2 superbowls taught us that.

I think we should all be satisfied at this point in looking for improvements over last season. I want to see the DB's taking correct angles. I want to see the CB's turning their heads and finding the ball. I want to see the more pressure up the middle. I want to see better tackling. I want to sense the physicality in this defense. If passes are completed, and they will be, I want the coverage to be tight.

I just want it to be better than last season, and I want to get the sense that it is improving week to week. I'd like to see 2 goals this season - Be in the top 18 in total defense. Be in the top 10 in scoring D. That would a great result.

 

[Patjew]

The secondary and Vareen has seen its share of criticism this TC both from the media and on here. I do agree with your point though the praise has been pretty thick and especially as the rookies have been concerned its over very little as they are only 5 practices deep.

I have been to all 5 practices and have seen some good things out of Hightower and Jones but there is some serious over hype going on for a handful of plays especially for Hightower. Jones' hype is probably right where it should but Hightower is reaching mythic proportions.

What I have seen through 5 practices is a passing game that may be at mythic proportions with targets galore and a defense that looks improved how much still remains to be seen. I see an o-line that missing 3 key pieces still seems to hold its own and two pieces should be back.

Impressive sir!

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Don't know how many of you stop by the Planet but AWTE has been attending camp and his observations tend to be second to none among amatuer NFL analysts (he is a coach locally I believe). He goes into the detail the media isn't allowed to go into about specifics being focused on in these practices.

Here is a link to the thread containing a couple of his camp reports including for yesterday.

2012 Training Camp Thread - Page 18 - Patriots Planet - New England Patriots Forums and Message Boards

 

[Uncle Rico]

Don't know how many of you stop by the Planet but AWTE has been attending camp and his observations tend to be second to none among amatuer NFL analysts (he is a coach locally I believe). He goes into the detail the media isn't allowed to go into about specifics being focused on in these practices.

Here is a link to the thread containing a couple of his camp reports including for yesterday.

2012 Training Camp Thread - Page 18 - Patriots Planet - New England Patriots Forums and Message Boards

Nice reports there; thanks.

First time at The Planet. Love the "Assclown asylum"; much more to the point than "practice quad."

 

[TyronePoole]

looks like he agrees more with my take on Dowling yesterday than Bedard's:

Patriots Planet - New England Patriots Forums and Message Boards - View Single Post - 2012 Training Camp Thread

The CBs and receivers came together to work one on ones in man coverage. This was a fantastic drill. Lloyd and Dowling where matched-up three times with Dowling dominating the first two reps before Lloyd broke free in the back corner of the EZ for a win. McCourty got beat inside early by Stallworth before winning on an outside route and covering up Britt on the back line. Welk beat Arrington inside but it took three big moves to do so. The rush would have impacted the play live. Edelman beat Cole a couple of times, once he was overthrown and the second he smoked him for a TD. Edelman also beat Williams for a TD along the end line. Hoyer was the QB during this drill.

Dowling has been impressive. He plays calm and has great make up ability letting him sit longer on breaks than most CBs, especially CBs his size. He's very comfortable in man and his reach forces perfect throws to beat him. He is exciting.