"Spygate" allegations are so stupid

[Bill B.]

I keep hearing a lot about spygate these last couple of weeks and I can't believe how stupid some people really are. Sure, the coaching signals were taped, but they are seen by 70,000 people and the Patriots were filming right in the open. They weren't hiding it.

But it is the logistics that are hard to believe. The critics would have you believe that they would use the tapes in the second half. So you are telling me that you can take a half hour of game film, study both the signals and the corresponding plays of the other team. Decipher which ones are real and which signals are phony, and come up with a countering game plan based on the signals. And do this all in 15 minutes of halftime. Or that the offensive coordinator is waiting for the defense to give their signals before deciding what to run. That is what the haters would have you believe. Most plays are called even before the last play is over. Personell has to be changed on the field and I can't see how they could do all this and monitor the opposing coaches. Add in that the radios in the QBs helmet is shut off with 10 seconds left on the playclock and where does the offense find the time to call a play based on defensive signals. It just is't logical.

I still don't understand how the Dolphins, in 2006, could use audiotape of the Patriots signals to learn what we were going to do, and the NFL had no problem with that. It just seems ludicrous to me that you can call one getting a competitive edge and the other one is cheating.

 

[Patsfan1102]

stop......

 

[PatsFan24]

2007 is over....

 

[oldskool138]

I keep hearing a lot about spygate these last couple of weeks and I can't believe how stupid some people really are. Sure, the coaching signals were taped, but they are seen by 70,000 people and the Patriots were filming right in the open. They weren't hiding it.

Spygate wasn't about hiding the taping. It was all about BB being cute about his interpretation of the two memos that were sent out. The memos clearly ban the practice of filming signals from the sideline but BB decided to play semantics with the phrase "for use during the game" and got burned.

Goodell, the brand-spanking new commish at the time, was understandably angry. Not because he used to be a Jets employee. Not because he had some kind of grudge against BB and the Pats. It was because a coach decided to basically give him the finger and do something he expressly told him (and the league) not to do.

Also, people who bring up Spygate as some kind of rebuttal to the Pats success don't know anything about football.

 

[EJ Blitz]

this will end well

 

[Ron Sellers]

The incident is an excuse for fans of other teams to hate on the Pats. Anybody that brings up the filming as the reason they hate the Pats is lying: I guarantee you that they hated the Pats prior to that event. You could point that out to them and ask them that question, but they would simply lie again and claim that isn't true.

You could bring up the point you made, or the one I made above, or how the team's winning percentage is actually better post- than it was pre-, or how 'haven't won anything since' has more to do with Brady's subsequent knee injury plus all but one starter on defense moving on, or any of a dozen other rebuttals, but it's not going to matter; it's like arguing with a fence post. They're either saying it to get under your skin, or are so blind that there is no reasoning with them.

Yes, it stinks to have to hear that crap but it is what it is. They're simple people with simple minds. The only time they will ever stop is if the Pats are no longer a competitive team; which alternative would you prefer?

You may as well embrace the hate.

 

[PatsFan24]

The incident is an excuse for fans of other teams to hate on the Pats. Anybody that brings up the filming as the reason they hate the Pats is lying: I guarantee you that they hated the Pats prior to that event. You could point that out to them and ask them that question, but they would simply lie again and claim that isn't true.

You could bring up the point you made, or the one I made above, or how the team's winning percentage is actually better post- than it was pre-, or how 'haven't won anything since' has more to do with Brady's subsequent knee injury plus all but one starter on defense moving on, or any of a dozen other rebuttals, but it's not going to matter; it's like arguing with a fence post. They're either saying it to get under your skin, or are so blind that there is no reasoning with them.

Yes, it stinks to have to hear that crap but it is what it is. They're simple people with simple minds. The only time they will ever stop is if the Pats are no longer a competitive team; which alternative would you prefer?

You may as well embrace the hate.

It is the most powerful form of hate they feel they have so they hold on it it at all costs.

 

[blackglass3]

...getting ready to read some fresh new perspectives and anaylsis about the whole Spygate saga...

opcorn:opcorn:opcorn:

 

[PatsFan24]

Some a-hole from the NY Post asked BB about spygate in a presser this week. No wonder people don't take the media seriously.

 

[part-timer]

WHATS WRONG WITH YOU RESPONDERS! Even acknowledgeing this post is to play into the HATERS wishs. Responding gives in to the point that this topic is debateable, and to who, a hater that will never let it go! Smarten up and put it to bed and forget about the haters that will never let it go and constantly try to get under your skin for laughs at your expence. DO NOT LET THEM PROVE THEIR SMARTER BY GETTING TO YOU. No true fan would bring the point up in any form, to do so is to admit it was what they have made it out to be. The point is old and dead, and long past haveing been played out. Do not play into their hands. Do not even acknowledge that made up word.

 

[patfanken]

Here is a simple format for anyone to use when combating a "spygate" whiner.

1. Stealing signals has NEVER been illegal (if the Pats had had a guy on the sideline with binoculars and chart, it would have been OK. In fact, I think, if they had done the filming from the press box they would have been OK,as only sideline filming was excluded.)
2. No information from the tape could have any short term benefit (as Bill B. pointed out)
3. Even the Goodell has said no competitive advantage has been gained
4. The Pats were literally guilty of tweaking an insecure new commissioner, who over reacted, and badly mishandled, what amounted to a procedural insult to his memo (as oldschool so articulately pointed out)
5. Finally there are far more egregious examples of REAL cheating that are constantly ignored, where real competitive advantages were gained. The Cowboys, Niners, and Denver, ALL at one time or another tampered with the cap in order to sign players they shouldn't have. All were fined. All lost draft picks. All CHEATED. AND none of this is EVER mentioned by the mediots. (btw- and these are just a few that I know about there could be more)

Why Bob Kraft doesn't put his foot down and fight these unfair accusations is beyond me.

BTW- BB and the team SHOULD have been fined and lost draft picks for giving the finger to Goodell. I will never defend the actual infraction. But the reaction was a huge overreaction, and the Pats were left swing in the wind by the gross mishandling of the situation by BOTH Goodell and Kraft (for allowing him to discredit the entire organization.

Because of it, 4 years later the Pats and their fans have to deal with the aftermath. I know Kraft is very careful of his "brand". I fail to see how he runs everything else so well. He has a successful team. His players are mostly paragons of Virtue. They are respectful, humble and giving. Yet there is a significant segment of fandom, the media, and even some players, who hate the Pats as Cheaters, and question the legitimacy of those 3 Lombardi's. Again if I were Bob I would fight the big misconceptions surrounding the actual sequence of events., because clearly its not going away.

 

[Ring 6]

I keep hearing a lot about spygate these last couple of weeks and I can't believe how stupid some people really are. Sure, the coaching signals were taped, but they are seen by 70,000 people and the Patriots were filming right in the open. They weren't hiding it.

But it is the logistics that are hard to believe. The critics would have you believe that they would use the tapes in the second half. So you are telling me that you can take a half hour of game film, study both the signals and the corresponding plays of the other team. Decipher which ones are real and which signals are phony, and come up with a countering game plan based on the signals. And do this all in 15 minutes of halftime. Or that the offensive coordinator is waiting for the defense to give their signals before deciding what to run. That is what the haters would have you believe. Most plays are called even before the last play is over. Personell has to be changed on the field and I can't see how they could do all this and monitor the opposing coaches. Add in that the radios in the QBs helmet is shut off with 10 seconds left on the playclock and where does the offense find the time to call a play based on defensive signals. It just is't logical.

I still don't understand how the Dolphins, in 2006, could use audiotape of the Patriots signals to learn what we were going to do, and the NFL had no problem with that. It just seems ludicrous to me that you can call one getting a competitive edge and the other one is cheating.

If you feel it is stupid (which it is) why the F#$% are you bringing it up all over again?

 

[Big-T]

Spygate? Don't you mean forgottowearalimegreenvestgate?

 

[Brady_to_Moss]

sweet thread

 

[BelichickFan]

NY writer Rich Cimini tweeted a sarcastic comment about how no-one brings spygate up anymore. I replied to him with the facts that in 5 years since (and including) 2007, one without Brady, we have won 80% of our regular season games and been to 2 Super Bowls. Just repeat those facts if anyone ever brings it up.

 

[Bill B.]

If you feel it is stupid (which it is) why the F#$% are you bringing it up all over again?

I'm not the one bringing it up. As a lone Patriot fan out here in California, I am constantly being bombarded with the whole spygate thing whenever I am with friends who are fans of other teams. The media has also brought it up again. My argument that the whole thing falls on deaf ears so being a little frustrated, I came to here to vent a little. I thought that what this forum was for.

It's good to see the Thread Police is still on duty.

 

[PatsFan24]

Here is a simple format for anyone to use when combating a "spygate" whiner.

1. Stealing signals has NEVER been illegal (if the Pats had had a guy on the sideline with binoculars and chart, it would have been OK. In fact, I think, if they had done the filming from the press box they would have been OK,as only sideline filming was excluded.)
2. No information from the tape could have any short term benefit (as Bill B. pointed out)
3. Even the Goodell has said no competitive advantage has been gained
4. The Pats were literally guilty of tweaking an insecure new commissioner, who over reacted, and badly mishandled, what amounted to a procedural insult to his memo (as oldschool so articulately pointed out)
5. Finally there are far more egregious examples of REAL cheating that are constantly ignored, where real competitive advantages were gained. The Cowboys, Niners, and Denver, ALL at one time or another tampered with the cap in order to sign players they shouldn't have. All were fined. All lost draft picks. All CHEATED. AND none of this is EVER mentioned by the mediots. (btw- and these are just a few that I know about there could be more)

Why Bob Kraft doesn't put his foot down and fight these unfair accusations is beyond me.

BTW- BB and the team SHOULD have been fined and lost draft picks for giving the finger to Goodell. I will never defend the actual infraction. But the reaction was a huge overreaction, and the Pats were left swing in the wind by the gross mishandling of the situation by BOTH Goodell and Kraft (for allowing him to discredit the entire organization.

Because of it, 4 years later the Pats and their fans have to deal with the aftermath. I know Kraft is very careful of his "brand". I fail to see how he runs everything else so well. He has a successful team. His players are mostly paragons of Virtue. They are respectful, humble and giving. Yet there is a significant segment of fandom, the media, and even some players, who hate the Pats as Cheaters, and question the legitimacy of those 3 Lombardi's. Again if I were Bob I would fight the big misconceptions surrounding the actual sequence of events., because clearly its not going away.

Don't forget in SB 38 there were a number of Panthers players (I think 7 starters) that were using roids. Yet, that never gets mentioned either.

 

[Bill B.]

Spygate wasn't about hiding the taping. It was all about BB being cute about his interpretation of the two memos that were sent out. The memos clearly ban the practice of filming signals from the sideline but BB decided to play semantics with the phrase "for use during the game" and got burned.

But that is the problem. Goodell is making a rule through a memo. Only the competition commitee can make rules. Goodell is changing the rules without having the proper authority. He did the same thing this year with his memo about faking injuries. It's an abuse of power.

 

[Ron Sellers]

NY writer Rich Cimini tweeted a sarcastic comment about how no-one brings spygate up anymore. I replied to him with the facts that in 5 years since (and including) 2007, one without Brady, we have won 80% of our regular season games and been to 2 Super Bowls. Just repeat those facts if anyone ever brings it up.

Consider the source:Cimini is pot-stirring New York fan masquerading as a professional writer.

Here are some of the columns he has written in the last several days; I am purposely not going to include links.

-- Belichick dodges 'SpyGate' query
Yes, he even wrote a column about BB not answering the question. Interestingly he does not say "I asked Belichick" but instead phrases it as "Bill Belichick was asked if his three Super Bowl titles are tainted in any way by the scandal", and finishes the brief piece by writing "presumably, his cameras are focused on where they're supposed to be." Perhaps Cimini is a sportswriter because he couldn't make it as a comedian or script writer on Saturday Night Live.

-- Going to prove everybody wrong
The picture is that everyone is picking the Pats to win, and the Giants will prove them wrong. Huh?

-- Eli is one win away from Canton
Shouldn't that be a question, rather than a statement - especially whn you consider his rather uneven career?

-- Poll skewing Alert: Vote Against Belichick
In this column he implored his readers to "vote early, vote often, and send this to all your friends" not to vote for Coughlin, but to vote against Belichick in a bspn poll asking which was the better coach. Seriously ...

-- There were also a few columns that were simply attributed to the BSPN New York Staff that had Cimini's fingerprints all over them, such as the one that freaked out over Tom Brady telling the crowd at the sendoff that 'hopefully we'll have even more here for a party next week'.