Corner - How Bad Is It?

[mgteich]

We have started the season with McCourty, Arrington, Bodden, Molden and Dowling.

We weren't even sure that Dowling would play corner. Molden beat out Butler and Wilhite for a roster spot.

How bad off are we with Arrington, McCourty and Molden as our corners. We also have Jones and Edelman as emergency, injury and garbage time backups?

SOME THOUGHTS
1) I never counted on Dowling.
2) I was disappointed when Bodden was injured. However, this is NOT unexpected when someone is coming back from an injury.
3) Arrington is playing better than anyone could hope. McCourty has contributed much less. However, these are 2 solid starters.

BOTTOM LINE
As McCourty's health improves, this group will be fine. They are probably not good enough to stop GB or NO, but I don't think that anyone is.

If we have some health from McCourty, Chung, Spikes and Fletcher, we should have a reasonable shot at beating BALT and PITT.

 

[patsfan-1982]

if the pass rush can get going in the playoffs they will be ok if not it's going to take Brady puting up 30+ every game

 

[Mack Herron]

these are 2 solid starters.

Can you provide any evidence to support your contention that McCourty has been a "solid starter" this year?

 

[patsinthesnow]

Arrington is playing great.

Mccourty is playing like a stiff.

Molden is JAG depth, not sure how to judge Edelman at nickelback yet.

If Mccourty wakes up its decent, if he can somehow return to probowl form, its a great tandem.

 

[Big-T]

Can you provide any evidence to support your contention that McCourty has been a "solid starter" this year?

From the Dallas game (minus one horrible missed tackle) up until he got injured he was playing as well as he was as a rookie again, he starts the season off shaky which we can put down to the lockout and he was shaky in the 4th quarter on Sunday, but who on the defense wasn't?

 

[supafly]

Can you provide any evidence to support your contention that McCourty has been a "solid starter" this year?

There's no way in hell anyone can.

McCourty's defensive QB rating against was 120 going into the Indy game...where he was promptly burned several more times by Garcon, and allowed at least one TD, if not 2 more.

Arrington's defensive QB rating against was 44 going into the game, with 7 INT's and only 2 TD's allowed all season.

I don't know what happened to him, or if maybe he's just not too good and last yr was a complete fluke (I hate to say it, but it's certainly possible), but he has absolutely sucked this yr.

I did a comparative stat test against such whipping boy/low-life CB's such as Duane Starks and Ellis Hobbs in the other thread about "Should we be worried about McCourty?", and BOTH of their numbers are way better than McCourty's this yr.

And to whoever says that we won't need Brady to score 30+ come playoff time, I would ask WHY you would honestly believe that? Teams will continue to pick McCourty apart, and rightfully so. He has no business as a starter this year, and frankly--if it were anyone else he'd have been benched, which he very well may in the next couple of weeks.

I know it's a negative view of him, and I am sorry for that, but unfortunately it's the truth.

 

[supafly]

From the Dallas game (minus one horrible missed tackle) up until he got injured he was playing as well as he was as a rookie again, he starts the season off shaky which we can put down to the lockout and he was shaky in the 4th quarter on Sunday, but who on the defense wasn't?

He was playing better, still nowhere near his play of last yr.

The defense as a whole was playing much better lately, but it had nothing to do with Devin McCourty as he had been hurt.

I'm obviously trusting Belichick's decision, as he has earned that right; but I will have to admit that I won't be surprised in the least if he's benched for a game.

 

[Stilla]

Its all about Brady and the offense.

We need to lead the score for most of the game. BB likes to get the ball after half time, so we need a strong outing by the defense with the 1st possession of the game, and the result needs to be a score by NE.

If we can't accomplish that, we are in for a long game. NE needs to take control right away, or our defense is in big trouble. If the other teams drive the field and control the clock at will, we are in trouble. NE's offense is about driving the field, not score at will. If NE gets down in the 4th quarter, its going to take more than Brady to get us out of the hole and I am sure the defense is the last thing you want to see on the field with 3/4 minutes to go in the game.

We need to make sure Brady has the ball in his hands when it comes down to the last possession. And, it better be for the win.

 

[robbomango]

new potential

 

[supafly]

new potential

Yeah, but can he rush the pass...... no wait. We're referring to the 'other' problem.

Can he turn around and look for the damn ball?

 

[robbomango]

Yeah, but can he rush the pass...... no wait. We're referring to the 'other' problem.

Can he turn around and look for the damn ball?

if he thought it was a bottle of jack daniels being tossed around out there, yes

 

[supafly]

if he thought it was a bottle of jack daniels being tossed around out there, yes

sign the beast

 

[patsfaninpa]

Yeah, but can he rush the pass...... no wait. We're referring to the 'other' problem.

Can he turn around and look for the damn ball?

The thing that confounds me about McCourty has been his tackling. He was outstanding in that dept. last year. Spotty at best this year. Has had some big whiffs. Brandon Marshall, Dez Bryand and last week immediately come to mind. He exceeded my expectation in coverage last year. But, came with a rep as a good tackler and showed his form. I hope the soph jinx is the reason. And, no offseason program. Also, had a rep as a great practice player/gym rat. Maybe the lack of that really threw him off and he's never caught up.

 

[supafly]

The thing that confounds me about McCourty has been his tackling. He was outstanding in that dept. last year. Spotty at best this year. Has had some big whiffs. Brandon Marshall, Dez Bryand and last week immediately come to mind. He exceeded my expectation in coverage last year. But, came with a rep as a good tackler and showed his form. I hope the soph jinx is the reason. And, no offseason program. Also, had a rep as a great practice player/gym rat. Maybe the lack of that really threw him off and he's never caught up.

I sure hope so!

 

[patfanken]

BOTTOM LINE
As McCourty's health improves, this group will be fine. They are probably not good enough to stop GB or NO, but I don't think that anyone is.
.
If we have some health from McCourty, Chung, Spikes and Fletcher, we should have a reasonable shot at beating BALT and PITT.

Bad News: You are right. This defense IS NOT good enough to consistently stop either the GB or NO offense

Good News: NEITHER of those defenses are good enough to stop the Pats offense.

If the Pats are lucky enough to reach the superbowl, it will be a very exciting one, where the winner will be decided by the team that wins the turn over battle and has the best special teams

 

[RayClay]

If Jones can play some safety and/or nickel, I could see Moore playing some corner delegating molden to specialist big corner situations. Molden is a good tackler, poor cover corner from limited observation.

BB has likely acquired a variety pack of different skill types to use in different situations, which works if you know what you're doing and scout teams well. He knows what he's doing and undoubtedly is putting in a tremendous amount of work on the secondary.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

As bad as this group is, it's far better than our 2004 CB group that won a SB. Question is can our pass rush be consistent enough to mask the potential weakness at #3 CB and FS.

 

[TheBostonStraggler]

We have started the season with McCourty, Arrington, Bodden, Molden and Dowling.

We weren't even sure that Dowling would play corner. Molden beat out Butler and Wilhite for a roster spot.

How bad off are we with Arrington, McCourty and Molden as our corners. We also have Jones and Edelman as emergency, injury and garbage time backups?

SOME THOUGHTS
1) I never counted on Dowling.
2) I was disappointed when Bodden was injured. However, this is NOT unexpected when someone is coming back from an injury.
3) Arrington is playing better than anyone could hope. McCourty has contributed much less. However, these are 2 solid starters.

BOTTOM LINE
As McCourty's health improves, this group will be fine. They are probably not good enough to stop GB or NO, but I don't think that anyone is.

If we have some health from McCourty, Chung, Spikes and Fletcher, we should have a reasonable shot at beating BALT and PITT.

Good points MG. Arrington is the real shining star who has provided a solid performance at the CB spot. What concerns me is McCourty and whether his health has anything to do with his sub performance. I hate to put so much on one guy but I think McCourty is the key here. If he can regain just a relatively modest amount of 2010's performance, the ripple effect on the pass defense will, imho, be considerable. Until he gets back to being solid, opposing QB's are allowed too much success on McCourty's side -- meaning QBs have to force it less elsewhere (less errors = less turnovers), not have to hold the ball that extra second (less effective pass rush), keep the chains moving (keeping our D on the field and our O off), and allowing their offense to get a rhythm going. Again, I know it's harsh to put so much on one guy but it seems clear to me he is having that strong of an effect.

 

[supafly]

Good points MG. Arrington is the real shining star who has provided a solid performance at the CB spot. What concerns me is McCourty and whether his health has anything to do with his sub performance. I hate to put so much on one guy but I think McCourty is the key here. If he can regain just a relatively modest amount of 2010's performance, the ripple effect on the pass defense will, imho, be considerable. Until he gets back to being solid, opposing QB's are allowed too much success on McCourty's side -- meaning QBs have to force it less elsewhere (less errors = less turnovers), not have to hold the ball that extra second (less effective pass rush), keep the chains moving (keeping our D on the field and our O off), and allowing their offense to get a rhythm going. Again, I know it's harsh to put so much on one guy but it seems clear to me he is having that strong of an effect.

All good points. I agree with everything you said.

If McCourty can just step it up a bit, and get some of his focus and skills back, if could carry unto many different aspects of the game.

First he has to remember how to turn around and look for the ball though. And to me, that seems strange for a guy who has played that position for quite a while now.

 

[robbomango]

All good points. I agree with everything you said.

If McCourty can just step it up a bit, and get some of his focus and skills back, if could carry unto many different aspects of the game.

First he has to remember how to turn around and look for the ball though. And to me, that seems strange for a guy who has played that position for quite a while now.

I hate when CB's do that as well, looks desperate but if a player finds himself beat on a play is there any merit to that technique or is it completely frowned
upon in every situation?