Congrats to Jerod Mayo on his 1st career int

[Deus Irae]

while it is true that Brettlax used the original post to "go on a barely tangential attack" on Mayo, the same can be said about your post in response to Brettlax's.

No, the same cannot be said. My response was directly on point.

how in god's earth does the fact that Patrick Willis only has 5 interceptions have ANYTHING to do with Mayo's ability. Who on earth made Patrick the be all end all of linebackers? How does interceptions by another player have anything to do with Mayo? so to spew what you did about the attack by Brettlax and then do what you did makes no sense

I refuse to believe that you are so clueless that you don't understand why a comparison of INTs (the initial topic of the thread) is important to the discussion when getting an INT was the purported reason for his commentary. As a result, I'll just assume that part of your post was just throw away material.

Brettlax was merely indicating what I think most people see, which is that Mayo does have the ability to make tackles, but his ability to cover another player is sub-par. i call mayo's tackles "Mayo Specials." That being, the player Mayo is guarding makes the catch, then Mayo makes the tackle and then everyone starts talking about how good mayo is because he makes all the tackles.

Incorrect.....

obviously, the interception does not indicate a problem of our coverage, but the 1 interception indicates how mayo does not have the interceptions.

Then you had no real reason to interject your post as a counter to mine, since you're conceding my very point.

 

[JackBauer]

maybe...but more importantly, does that mean since he is the be all end all at LB's, the fact that Mayo has 4 less INTs less than him means that mayo is good in coverage?

No. It simply means that interceptions aren't a terribly useful metric for judging a linebacker's coverage ability.

 

[Brettlax3434]

No, the same cannot be said. My response was directly on point.




I refuse to believe that you are so clueless that you don't understand why a comparison of INTs (the initial topic of the thread) is important to the discussion when getting an INT was the purported reason for his commentary. As a result, I'll just assume that part of your post was just throw away material.



Incorrect.....



Then you had no real reason to interject your post as a counter to mine, since you're conceding my very point.

I conceded that Interceptions arent the be all and end all of coverage ability as well. What I am saying is that when watching Mayo he struggles in coverage and does not challenge enough pass attempts. Nor does he make tackles in front of the first down marker in big spots....enough.

 

[billdog3484]

No, the same cannot be said. My response was directly on point.

saying your response is directly on point, and actually being directly on point are not the same thing im sorry to say. you brought up a completely different player, from a completely different team, with a completely different system and compared statistics. and because the statistics resembled eachother (in that they were both not good), you said the players are comparable.

 

[RobertWeathers]

I think part of the issue is that people WANT Mayo to evolve into the next Ray Lewis, Bruschi or Urlacher- men that made/make a living at forcing turnovers, making a INT in a millisecond's reaction to a thrown pass. Its tough to live up to.

What we do know is that BB LOVES the kid and has gone out of his way to sing praises for his play and work ethic. Additionally, what we also know is that he was defensive rookie of the year and in his 3rd year was an All-Pro. That indicates to me that his play is highly respected around the league.

Personally, I'd like him to become the next Bruschi or Lewis as well, but the problem is that he may never get there. We'll just have to settle for an LB who can do sideline to sideline as well as anyone, is a sure tackler, excellent leader and creates turnovers every now as opposed to all the time.

 

[billdog3484]

I refuse to believe that you are so clueless that you don't understand why a comparison of INTs (the initial topic of the thread) is important to the discussion when getting an INT was the purported reason for his commentary. As a result, I'll just assume that part of your post was just throw away material.

haha, ok. so because both players have low INT numbers that means mayo is good in coverage. ok.

 

[billdog3484]

Then you had no real reason to interject your post as a counter to mine, since you're conceding my very point.

im only interjecting because you ripped brettlax on the premise that brettlax used 1 stat to prove his point when that stat does not necessarily prove his point.

subsequently, you did the same thing. you, i think, missed the point of my post

i actually agree with you that the 1 interception does not indicate our coverage is bad.

 

[Deus Irae]

saying your response is directly on point, and actually being directly on point are not the same thing im sorry to say. you brought up a completely different player, from a completely different team, with a completely different system and compared statistics. and because the statistics resembled eachother (in that they were both not good), you said the players are comparable.

I brought up a comparison regarding the INTERCEPTIONS. I'm sorry that you think ILB interceptions are not directly on point in a comparison to ILB interceptions. I'd help disabuse you of that notion if I could.

 

[NinjaZX6R]

His first INT since 2007 vs Arkansas. Wohoray!

I'm surprised he caught that one. The ball was thrown high wide and fast and he made a nice athletic move.

 

[Deus Irae]

im only interjecting because you ripped brettlax on the premise that brettlax used 1 stat to prove his point when that stat does not necessarily prove his point.

subsequently, you did the same thing. you, i think, missed the point of my post

i actually agree with you that the 1 interception does not indicate our coverage is bad.

Ok, so you're only interjecting because you have a reading comprehension issue.



Got it.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Do not get me started on Mayo.

He is a fine tackler...thats about it in terms of tangible on-field ability.

The lack of perspective here is so becoming the norm. Mayo has had a lot thrust on his plate since his DROY season...which of course is long forgotten here in ADHA fanland. He had to deal with knee injuries twice including early in his second season as well as being not only annointed but appointed the defacto leader of a transitional, hodge podge defense on as well as off the field (because Seymour was never that all in guy and wore out his welcome as a result and Warren checked out and Big Vince was worried about his own deal and while playing at a consistently high level just doesn't have an unjovial in a teamates face bone in his ample body).

You have to retool leadership cores as well as rosters in transition and while our core guys are good guys and team captains we lack a couple of grizzled bad asses with cache due to youth and veteran turnover. For that reason it all falls on Mayo in ways it never all fell on Milloy or Rodney or Tedy or Vrabel or Willie (if anything Willie by nature spent as much time scaring his young teamates as he did scaring opposing players) to be the lone leader on and off the field. We need a couple of players to emerge or be acquired who will not only lead by example via professionalism on the field but lead by scaring the bejesus out of some of the rest of their teamates who lose focus despite giving effort. Bill has always known that you need that and smart coaches rely on it because players tune critical coaches out and can easily develop denial syndrome when their source is some guy who never played the game on their level... Rodney might have salvaged Merriweather in time. Ray has been out a couple of weeks in Baltimore but that defense is still playing like he's on the field with them perhaps because they fear the consequences if they don't, and not from Harbaugh or Ozzie but from Ray-Ray. Bill should have listened to him when he said AD was a fraud. Nobody challenged AD here in 2009 but the coaches and he tuned them out.

Mayo will start making more plays when he has less on his mind because he has better talent and more leadership around him on defense sharing the load like that leadership crew did in 2001-2008.

 

[Deus Irae]

I think part of the issue is that people WANT Mayo to evolve into the next Ray Lewis, Bruschi or Urlacher- men that made/make a living at forcing turnovers, making a INT in a millisecond's reaction to a thrown pass. Its tough to live up to.

What we do know is that BB LOVES the kid and has gone out of his way to sing praises for his play and work ethic. Additionally, what we also know is that he was defensive rookie of the year and in his 3rd year was an All-Pro. That indicates to me that his play is highly respected around the league.

Personally, I'd like him to become the next Bruschi or Lewis as well, but the problem is that he may never get there. We'll just have to settle for an LB who can do sideline to sideline as well as anyone, is a sure tackler, excellent leader and creates turnovers every now as opposed to all the time.

Bruschi had 12 INTs in 13 seasons. He had 1 INT in his first 5 seasons. IN 7 of his 13 seasons, he was without an interception. In 2 more seasons, he had 1 interception.

That means that in 9 of 13 seasons, Bruschi had 1 interception or fewer.

Bruschi had 17 forced fumbles in those 13 seasons, and had 1 forced fumble or fewer in 8 of his 13 seasons. Mayo has 4 forced fumbles in his first 4 seasons, 1 each year.

The "Mayo is not a playmaker" claim is largely a function of people having demands that are out of whack with the realities of the position involved. The one area where people have a valid point is in the sack totals, but I think even most of the anti-Mayo people would be willing to admit that at least part of that is because of the different way the Patriots have been playing defense in recent seasons.

 

[TruthSeeker]

As far as Patrick Willis, he is the best in the game and has 80% more interceptions then Mayo.

I've always wondered how you can have 1.8 interceptions. Perhaps you can also explain the 2.3 children I often hear about.

 

[mcsully]

I've read a lot of the points and counter points regarding Mayo.. Some good, some bad..


My feeling is he's a good LB in their system and is a good leader. Is he a top 5 LB at his position, I don't think so, more like top 10. And the reason is, he's not a game changer.
Unlike what we've come to expect, I'm with the group concerned our LB's don't make enough plays. Unlike what we've been seen in the past with McGinnest, Vrabel & Bruschi, we don't have a lb who can game in and game out make a defensive play to change the flow of the game.

Mayo made a great play yesterday and hope this continues.

But in the near future, we need to add some talent around him. Maybe we slide him back to MLB and bring in a OLB either thru the draft or FA. In two short years I'm concerned about Spikes healthy and ability to play at a steady level.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Bruschi had 12 INTs in 13 seasons. He had 1 INT in his first 5 seasons. IN 7 of his 13 seasons, he was without an interception. In 2 more seasons, he had 1 interception.

That means that in 9 of 13 seasons, Bruschi had 1 interception or fewer.

Bruschi had 17 forced fumbles in those 13 seasons, and had 1 forced fumble or fewer in 8 of his 13 seasons. Mayo has 4 forced fumbles in his first 4 seasons, 1 each year.

Not sure I follow but if you are making an attempt to state that Mayo and Bruschi are on the same play-making level, I disagree. From 2001-2004 (the years people remember and Bru's prime,) he had 10 INTs, 12 sacks, 4 TDs, 30 passes defensed and 9 forced fumbles. I think you would agree that those numbers are Ray Lewis numbers.

The "Mayo is not a playmaker" claim is largely a function of people having demands that are out of whack with the realities of the position involved. The one area where people have a valid point is in the sack totals, but I think even most of the anti-Mayo people would be willing to admit that at least part of that is because of the different way the Patriots have been playing defense in recent seasons.

I agree. It's expectations. I don't think we've seen Mayo's prime yet but to assume he'll reach the same level of production as Bru in his prime years is unrealistic. I'll take 1/2 that and be pretty satisfied.

 

[NinjaZX6R]

But in the near future, we need to add some talent around him. Maybe we slide him back to MLB and bring in a OLB either thru the draft or FA. In two short years I'm concerned about Spikes healthy and ability to play at a steady level.

What? Spikes played all 12 games and was suspended last year for that ADHD medication. This year, maybe b/c of his lack of off season workouts, he missed the 1st two games, came back in force and was good. He then got injured w. a MCL sprain.

 

[patsfan-1982]

is he the best ILB in the NFL no but he makes the pats defense a whole lot better and thats all i care about

 

[JFK]

Please don't compare the start of Bruschi's career to Mayo's.

Mayo was a #10 pick. He is a good player though. Let's hope Mayo becomes a game changer because we need one. We need to stop making excuses for him.

 

[patsfan-1982]

Please don't compare the start of Bruschi's career to Mayo's.

Mayo was a #10 pick. He is a good player though. Let's hope Mayo becomes a game changer because we need one. We need to stop making excuses for him.

he was a first team all pro last year Bruschi was never a first team all pro and mayo has never played with the same type of talent around him as Bruschi had and Mayo may never get to play with that type of talent, Mayo is a very good player and a leader

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Please don't compare the start of Bruschi's career to Mayo's.

Mayo was a #10 pick. He is a good player though. Let's hope Mayo becomes a game changer because we need one. We need to stop making excuses for him.

We need more than 1. Willie disappointed on his early teams. Law and Milloy for were stealing Roberts money for a while. Surround them with good talent and coaching you suddenly you had a core of playmakers...and some of that talent came out of left field, like a LB they couldn't find a use for in Pittsburgh and a washed up SS from SD...

Context isn't an excuse, it's a possible reason.