Some Musings from Last Night's Jets' loss to Broncos

[Rob0729]

Ok, I don't know we need another Jets related thread, but we don't have a game until Monday Night so what the heck. Here are some musings I thought of:

1.) We complain about the Pats' safety position (rightfully so), but do you think any Jets fans wouldn't trade Eric Smith straight up to get James Ihedibgo back? The Jets' safety position sucks and Eric Smith played a big role in both their last two losses. He got burnt by Gronk all Sunday night and he blew the blitz on the Tebow TD run.

2.) The easiest way to kill the Broncos offense is get an early lead. If you can get a two score lead early, the Broncos can't answer. They are built to win these close games where Tebow can pull it out in the end. I think this is why I am not worried about the Pats playing them. Yes, the Broncos defense is playing well, but a better offense last night would have exploited them.

3.) I remembered last night that Revis said after he got his new deal that if he didn't get another deal before the upcoming offseason, he was going to hold out again. The Jets are in a bind if he does because they got a lot of dead weight and a lot of needs.

4.) The Jets fans are using Schottenheimer as a scapegoat, but he isn't the biggest problem on that offense. Yes, he is a mediocre OC, but Wayne Hunter is horrible, Sanchez is playing scared, and they have no legitimate lead back even at full strength.

5.) People are talking about how great the Jets defense was last night before that final drive, but were they? Tebow missed a lot of wide open receivers last night. I think an average passer might have carved up the Jets defense last night.

6.) The Jets are pretty much done. They need to run the table to get into the playoffs which isn't likely. They lose pretty much every tiebreaker with all the potential Wild Card contenders. The AFC North is pretty much guaranteed one Wild Card.

7.) Joe McKnight is an one trick pony. He is a very good kick returner in a system that creates great kick returners (Brad Smith, Leon Washington). He sucks as a RB.

8.) Where is Santonio Holmes? He was the highest paid WR in guarantees prior to Fitzgerald's contract and he has been a virtual non-factor for most of the year. He did very little last night.

9.) The NFL Network sucks at broadcasting the games. I love Mike Mayock, but he is not a good color guy. The broadcast was a comedy of errors from the head ref not being properly miced, them not resetting the timeout clock in the first drive in the second half, the cameraman being faked out on plays, etc.

 

[DarrylS]

Re: Some Musings from Last Night

The NFL Network broadcast team is worse than the F team at Fox, CBS or NBC... they suck and make the broadcast insufferable.

Last night's game was difficult to broadcast as for the most part is was less than exciting, they can only massage Tebow's Testicles so many times and in so many different ways.. but this network could do better.

 

[AzPatsFan]

Re: Some Musings from Last Night

The Jets are unraveling before our very eyes. Just as predicted.

They have been getting only one or two draft picks for half a decade. This ensures that there is no depth anywhere, after a while and it shows.

Their offensive line has aged out. instead of four former probowlers like in 2009 they are down to 2 with only an average player in a third position and two gaping holes in the other two starting slots. So much for the horses to make the holes for the "Ground and Pound'.

Their RBs are gone. Shone Greene is a strong grind-it-out back, but an adventure trying to catch or block. Classy has gone Over the Hill. Just like the Chargers thought, who even kept him another year to be sure, before dumping him on Tanney the Doofus. McKnight is a poor imitation of Leon Washington with the additional burden of severe Fumbleitis.

The only thing Tannenbaum is good for is office politics, making sure that Mangini who breathed life into the Jets corpse was blamed even though he foisted the Favre on him and he didn't last a single full season, while producing winning seasons.

They downgraded their WR corps with a 35 and 38 year old, Over the Hill gang. So much for any Offense. I almost feel sorry for Sanchize.

Their Defense is aging before our very eyes. Bart Scott and Jim Leonard are thoroughly done. Eric Smith is a never-was. Westerman is a ST guy forced to play. Antonio Cromartie can't keep track of his ****, and certainly is too busy chasing tail to be concerned with anything else. Revis is all there is.

Did I mention that their Defensive line is a set of good reserves and situation substitutes, without a modicum of pass rush ability. The only one with upside is still a rookie, and his upside is not all that high anyway.

 

[Dessalines]

Re: Some Musings from Last Night

Ok, I don't know we need another Jets related thread, but we don't have a game until Monday Night so what the heck. Here are some musings I thought of:

1.) We complain about the Pats' safety position (rightfully so), but do you think any Jets fans wouldn't trade Eric Smith straight up to get James Ihedibgo back? The Jets' safety position sucks and Eric Smith played a big role in both their last two losses. He got burnt by Gronk all Sunday night and he blew the blitz on the Tebow TD run.

2.) The easiest way to kill the Broncos offense is get an early lead. If you can get a two score lead early, the Broncos can't answer. They are built to win these close games where Tebow can pull it out in the end. I think this is why I am not worried about the Pats playing them. Yes, the Broncos defense is playing well, but a better offense last night would have exploited them.

3.) I remembered last night that Revis said after he got his new deal that if he didn't get another deal before the upcoming offseason, he was going to hold out again. The Jets are in a bind if he does because they got a lot of dead weight and a lot of needs.

4.) The Jets fans are using Schottenheimer as a scapegoat, but he isn't the biggest problem on that offense. Yes, he is a mediocre OC, but Wayne Hunter is horrible, Sanchez is playing scared, and they have no legitimate lead back even at full strength.

5.) People are talking about how great the Jets defense was last night before that final drive, but were they? Tebow missed a lot of wide open receivers last night. I think an average passer might have carved up the Jets defense last night.

6.) The Jets are pretty much done. They need to run the table to get into the playoffs which isn't likely. They lose pretty much every tiebreaker with all the potential Wild Card contenders. The AFC North is pretty much guaranteed one Wild Card.

7.) Joe McKnight is an one trick pony. He is a very good kick returner in a system that creates great kick returners (Brad Smith, Leon Washington). He sucks as a RB.

8.) Where is Santonio Holmes? He was the highest paid WR in guarantees prior to Fitzgerald's contract and he has been a virtual non-factor for most of the year. He did very little last night.

9.) The NFL Network sucks at broadcasting the games. I love Mike Mayock, but he is not a good color guy. The broadcast was a comedy of errors from the head ref not being properly miced, them not resetting the timeout clock in the first drive in the second half, the cameraman being faked out on plays, etc.

The biggest YETS probelm doesn't suit up, coach or play and it's name is Mike Tannenbaum. That man has a lot to answer for, such as Mark Sanchez, lack of drafts picks due bad movs, bad free agent signings, letting good players go and most tellingly, the failure to improve the team this year. Burress for Braylon Edwards was a big mistake, not to mention Derrick Mason, now departed

 

[Rob0729]

Re: Some Musings from Last Night

The Jets are unraveling before our very eyes. Just as predicted.

They have been getting only one or two draft picks for half a decade. This ensures that there is no depth anywhere, after a while and it shows.

Their offensive line has aged out. instead of four former probowlers like in 2009 they are down to 2 with only an average player in a third position and two gaping holes in the other two starting slots. So much for the horses to make the holes for the "Ground and Pound'.

Their RBs are gone. Shone Greene is a strong grind-it-out back, but an adventure trying to catch or block. Classy has gone Over the Hill. Just like the Chargers thought, who even kept him another year to be sure, before dumping him on Tanney the Doofus. McKnight is a poor imitation of Leon Washington with the additional burden of severe Fumbleitis.

The only thing Tannenbaum is good for is office politics, making sure that Mangini who breathed life into the Jets corpse was blamed even though he foisted the Favre on him and he didn't last a single full season, while producing winning seasons.

They downgraded their WR corps with a 35 and 38 year old, Over the Hill gang. So much for any Offense. I almost feel sorry for Sanchize.

Their Defense is aging before our very eyes. Bart Scott and Jim Leonard are thoroughly done. Eric Smith is a never-was. Westerman is a ST guy forced to play. Antonio Cromartie can't keep track of his ****, and certainly is too busy chasing tail to be concerned with anything else. Revis is all there is.

Did I mention that their Defensive line is a set of good reserves and situation substitutes, without a modicum of pass rush ability. The only one with upside is still a rookie, and his upside is not all that high anyway.

Wait a second! Felger has been telling us that the Jets draft better than the Pats. Now you are telling me that having zero depth and a bunch of high draft picks, many of them overrated (Sanchez, Greene, Keller) is not a great strategy. My world is shattered. Next thing you will tell me is that the cap isn't actually crap and teams actually have to worry about a salary cap.

Another draft point. People trashed the Pats for not taking a d-lineman like Muhammed Wilkerson, but I will argue since he was activated off the PUP that seventh round pick Brandon Deaderick has made more of an impact to the Pats than Wilkerson has made to the Jets. Wilkerson is solid against the run, but provides zero pass rush. Deaderick is a solid pass rusher where his return has actually made the Pats' non-existent pass rush actually become fairly consistent.

In fairness though, Mike DeVito is a solid, underrated d-lineman. He might be the only one on their d-line that would start on the Pats' d-line. Wilkerson would make a good run down specialist, but I wouldn't want him as a starter.

I also agree with Joe Begnino of WFAN who said the Jets never really adequetly replaced Alan Faneca or Damien Woody which has turned one of the most dominant o-lines to one of the worst. Wayne Hunter should never be on the field, but the Jets whiffed on Vlad Ducasse so bad and didn't add any depth on the o-line that they have to play him.

 

[Holy Diver]

Re: Some Musings from Last Night

Imagine if they

kept Woodhead and cut McNight
Drafted Freeman instead of trading up for Sanchez
Made an offer to Brad Smith
Drafted someone like Ryan Mallett as a backup

?

Anyway....


It was a grea run for these Jets.
2 years of Glory!
I think they won about 5 IN-season Superbowls
They now have their own island
A brand new stadium (which they share with an actual NFL team)


back in the high-life again...

 

[Rob0729]

Re: Some Musings from Last Night

The biggest YETS probelm doesn't suit up, coach or play and it's name is Mike Tannenbaum. That man has a lot to answer for, such as Mark Sanchez, lack of drafts picks due bad movs, bad free agent signings, letting good players go and most tellingly, the failure to improve the team this year. Burress for Braylon Edwards was a big mistake, not to mention Derrick Mason, now departed

It is kinda funny. Mason is sorta like Haynesworth in that both didn't put the effort in and were wash out free agent acquisitions. The Pats had an answer for the loss of Haynesworth, but the Jets really didn't have an answer for the loss of Mason.

Word was that Holmes hated Edwards. In fact, there were rumors that Holmes told the Jets that he wouldn't resign with the Jets if the Jets resigned Edwards. Tannenbaum and Ryan basically chose to go with Holmes and pay him a king's ransom. In hindsight, they probably would have been better off gambling on Edwards. Holmes has been a problem child this year and his production sucks. He has played 10 games where most receivers have played 9 and he is still 49th in receiving yards, 62nd in receptions, and 18th in TDs. Not bad for the WR with the second highest guaranteed money in the NFL.

 

[goheels22002]

Re: Some Musings from Last Night

.

Their offensive line has aged out. instead of four former probowlers like in 2009 they are down to 2 with only an average player in a third position and two gaping holes in the other two starting slots. So much for the horses to make the holes for the "Ground and Pound'.

Their RBs are gone. Shone Greene is a strong grind-it-out back, but an adventure trying to catch or block. Classy has gone Over the Hill. Just like the Chargers thought, who even kept him another year to be sure, before dumping him on Tanney the Doofus. McKnight is a poor imitation of Leon Washington with the additional burden of severe Fumbleitis.

They downgraded their WR corps with a 35 and 38 year old, Over the Hill gang. So much for any Offense. I almost feel sorry for Sanchize.

Their Defense is aging before our very eyes. Bart Scott and Jim Leonard are thoroughly done. Eric Smith is a never-was. Revis is all there is.

Did I mention that their Defensive line is a set of good reserves and situation substitutes, without a modicum of pass rush ability. The only one with upside is still a rookie, and his upside is not all that high anyway.

Your points about the aging of the Jets is spot on. As the last two games wore on, the Jets got increasingly slower on both sides of the ball. The Patriots sped up the 2nd half and the Jets visibly lost track of where they were supposed to be on defense. At altitude against a terrible schoolyard offense, the Jets defense was gassed and unable to adjust to an offensive line that was younger, faster and well-coordinated. The Jets defense is toast.

On offense, the skill guys are old and slow. LT is gone now and the WRs are just old. The Patriots covered them with a second-rate DB corps and so did the Broncos last night. The Broncos also smacked Keller in the mouth on every play just like the Pats limiting his effectiveness.

The nitwits on the two Jets messageboards want to blame Sanchez. He manned up and took responsibility for the defeat. I am beginning to admire him. The interception or a TD was Burress' fault for not breaking to the ball and keeping the DB on his hip. Either he was tired or gassed because of the altitude. But his break on that play was slow and soft.

The Patriots will kill the Broncos. That's a decent Broncos defense but left huge holes in their cover two and lucked out that the Jets couldn't establish a running game. Without LT to provide both a short passing and outside running game, the Jets could do nothing.

On offense, the Broncos better come up with something better than that empty-backfield crap. Why the Jets didn't stick Cromartie or Revis on the edge and send one of them to track down and hammer Tebow is beyond me. The Jets had three nose tackles in there at the same time begging Tebow to run around them. He's tough and fast but can't outrun defensive backs.

The Jets were just awful. It seemed as if they didn't even try to prepare for this game. Somebody mentioned that in one of the posts - how Rex and the Jets put so much emphasis on the Pats that they lost perspective.

 

[Ring 6]

Re: Some Musings from Last Night

Imagine if they

kept Woodhead and cut McNight
Drafted Freeman instead of trading up for Sanchez
Made an offer to Brad Smith
Drafted someone like Ryan Mallett as a backup

?

Anyway....


It was a grea run for these Jets.
2 years of Glory!
I think they won about 5 IN-season Superbowls
They now have their own island
A brand new stadium (which they share with an actual NFL team)


back in the high-life again...

Back to back 6th seeds!!!!!!!! What a dynasty.

 

[everlong]

Re: Some Musings from Last Night

Perillo was on Felger and Mazz and they were starting their usual BB the personnel guy sucks and they only trade for value not to acquire talent crap. Perillo had one of the most rational takes I've heard.

To paraphrase: Listen everybody has misses. Do you think Ozzie Newsome is a good GM? I don't know anybody who would say otherwise. In trying to (said sarcastically) Dilfer he's overpaid Grbac, traded a first and second for Kyle Boller and now is saddled with Joe Flacco who's absolutely killing the Ravens right now. That's a full decade of resources.

He goes on to name off all the hits and defend the point.

They like to site the Jets as some sort of GM wonderland and it couldn't be further from the truth. Yes they certain hit trading a first and second for Revis and in drafting Mangold and Keller in the first. They also this decade gave up two firsts for Robertson and a first, second and three players for Sanchez and drafted the immortal Vernon Gholston. So that's three bust at 3rd, 5th and 7th overall. Bellichick that high has the likes of Seymour and Mayo. Dip into the teens and it's Warren and Solder. All four are better than any of the Jets picks. Revis at 14 was a steal but that still leaves them batting 1/4.

Ray Lewis is looking to be out for at least a week. I hope Flacco carries them the same way Sanchez did the Jets.

 

[Joker]

Re: Some Musings from Last Night

yeah...and NOW a Dienasty....

 

[patfanken]

Re: Some Musings from Last Night

I posted this on the Ganggreen site about 3 days ago in a thread discussion on whether the Jets had regressed.

JE, I think that Sunday's loss to a team with a bad defense to start with, made worse by an injury situation, made even WORSE, by a injuries during the game, was much more revealing than the December Debacle last season.

It exposed flaws in the Jets team that go far beyond this season,

1. You have a QB who after 3 seasons is what he is. A 55% passer, whose most consistent attribute is his inconsistency. Brilliant one moment, head scratching the next. He will NEVER be able to "carry" a team. He can't make the players around him better a la Brady, Rodgers, and Bress. That being said, he has shown the mental toughness and ability to play well in big games, that the Jets shouldn't jettison him. However they have to build a team a better team around him....and this is why I think the Jets are in some trouble.

2. The fact the Pats were able to generate that kind of a pass rush with only 4 people makes me wonder where the great OL's the Jets have had in recent years has gone. If the Jets are going to rebound they would have to add 2 players that would be upgrades over what the currently have PLUS some realistic depth. They are a single injury away from disaster as it is.

3. Keller is a plus receiver as a TE, but the game exposed what has increasingly been a nagging question about him. Is he tough enough. Sunday a depleted Pats squad took him completely out of the game. The Pick 6 was a perfect example. Tracy White, who is a career special teamer and certainly not a guy you want playing regular defenses. On that play he decleats Keller off the LOS, which allows Ninkovitch to jump the RB and make the pick. The replay shows that if Keller gets off the LOS Ninko would have stayed with him and LT would have been wide open. He only moves to LT AFTER Keller hits the ground

I think its becoming clear that Keller can be taken out of the game if you line him up on the LOS. He is NEVER going to be a 2 way TE. So the Jets are going to have to make a big investment in adding your version of the Gronk, and BB drafted a LOT of guys, some were decent players but none were complete, before he lucked into him;so its not going to be easy.

4. You also need to invest at the RB position. Greene looks like your version of BJGE a hard RB who gets what's there, falls forward, and rarely loses yards, but like Benny isn't going to scare opposing DC's. LT is toast, and I find it curious how few snaps the Jets have given McKnight thus far. I think its telling......and Powell is......a huge cipher.

Right now it seems like the Pats are in slightly better shape at the RB position than the Jets, and that should be very troubling to Jet fans since in their style of play they NEED to be one of the better running teams in the league, The Pats running game can afford to be mediocre and STILL be complimentary.

5. You also need to find a better back up QB.

6. Your WRs need a big upgrade. You need to find a field stretcher like the one you HAD in Edwards. Holmes is a good receiver but certainly isn't worth the 10MM/yr you are paying him (currently the 49th most productive receiver) You need to replace Plax, who rarely becomes relevant unless the Jets are inside the opponent's 10 yard line. Kerley is a nice prospect but certainly not proven....and that's it for the Jets. So the Jets not only need to invest in skill at the position, but depth as well

7. Your LB situation for next year will also be in need of a revamp. You haven't been able to replace Thomas, and while Pace and Scott are decent LB's they are vastly overpaid and aging. So aside from Harris (one of the most under rated ILBs in the league) the Jets will have some big Questions next season.

8. I actually think your DL situation is pretty good. A nice mix of some young guys who have great upside and solid blue collar vets.

9. Your secondary is much better shape than most of the league. With the development of Wilson, you have 3 legitimately talented CBs, and while many here have keened for better S's, I doubt there would be many Pats fans who would take the Jets Safety situation in a NY minute. In fact if you look closely at the game for most of the time it was less that the Jet's S's were out of position against the TE's as they were physically mismatched by Gronk, which is going to be the case until he runs into a 6'5 250 lb safety.

So between the OL, LB, WRs and TE's the Jets need to hit on a lot of guys, just to keep up with the division. And while from what I gather, they aren't cap strapped, they won't be able to "buy" their solutions in the FA market.

BTW - I'm not oblivious to the Pats areas of weakness (all on defense), but they have fewer problems that the Jets face. They are set on the OL, TE, WR(a field stretcher would be a nice luxury, but the success of the Pats offense shows that it isn't a necessity) and RB.

IMHO the Pats need to draft the best S available in the draft at the bottom of the 1st round PLUS sign one of the 3 best FA safeties that are coming out next year. They also need to get a young outside pass rush threat, another big CB and coverage ILB

So my question to you Johnny isn't whether the Jets have regressed this season, but whether that regression will continue next season?

BTW -II - as an aside I have to ask you WTF the Jets never threw about a half dozen 20-30 yd back shoulder fades against the Pats defense. Especially after McCourty went out, there was no way they could have defended Plex on that route Very curious

To their credit, I ddn't get a single GFY or for that matter a Jet fan who disagreed with my assessment. The bottom line here is that the window of opportunity for the Jets team of th last 2 years has closed. Now turning things around doesn't take long given the draft and FA opportunities, but as I point out above, the Jets have a LOT of holes to fill over the next few years, many more than the Pats

 

[Rob0729]

Re: Some Musings from Last Night

Perillo was on Felger and Mazz and they were starting their usual BB the personnel guy sucks and they only trade for value not to acquire talent crap. Perillo had one of the most rational takes I've heard.

To paraphrase: Listen everybody has misses. Do you think Ozzie Newsome is a good GM? I don't know anybody who would say otherwise. In trying to (said sarcastically) Dilfer he's overpaid Grbac, traded a first and second for Kyle Boller and now is saddled with Joe Flacco who's absolutely killing the Ravens right now. That's a full decade of resources.

He goes on to name off all the hits and defend the point.

They like to site the Jets as some sort of GM wonderland and it couldn't be further from the truth. Yes they certain hit trading a first and second for Revis and in drafting Mangold and Keller in the first. They also this decade gave up two firsts for Robertson and a first, second and three players for Sanchez and drafted the immortal Vernon Gholston. So that's three bust at 3rd, 5th and 7th overall. Bellichick that high has the likes of Seymour and Mayo. Dip into the teens and it's Warren and Solder. All four are better than any of the Jets picks. Revis at 14 was a steal but that still leaves them batting 1/4.

Ray Lewis is looking to be out for at least a week. I hope Flacco carries them the same way Sanchez did the Jets.

When has the Pats whiffed on a top 10 pick? Granted Belichick has only two, but Seymour was a home run and Mayo was a good top 10 pick.

Yes, Belichick has gotten a lot of crap for his personnel decisions, but the Jets' personnel decisions have been overrated. Their drafts have not been any better than the Pats. If they didn't hit big on four players - Revis, Harris, Mangold, and Ferguson - they would have had miserable drafts in recent years.

 

[NEPatriot]

Re: Some Musings from Last Night

Rob, excellent analysis. While it's going to be a hard road ahead, I do think they could lose 1 game and possibly get in to the playoffs. Certainly running the table gives them a much better chance.

 

[LetsGoPats36]

Re: Some Musings from Last Night

NFLN is definitely shoddy.

Remember one of their first games when they put **** Vermeil in the booth even though it sounded like he had just smoked a carton of cigarettes and not slept in a month? I'm sure he had laryngitis or something similar, not his fault. But NFLN let Vermeil get through an entire half before yanking him. Torture.

 

[ausbacker]

Re: Some Musings from Last Night

I have a feeling that being lost in the Jets wash up is how well the Broncos defense played. Since Tebow has taken over they've surrendered;

@Miami        15 W
Lions         45 L
@Oakland      24 W
@Kansas City  10 W
Jets          13 W

During that stretch the defense created the following plays;

@Miami        4 sacks 1 forced fumble
Lions         2 sacks 
@Oakland      3 sacks 1 forced fumble 3 interceptions 1 punt return TD
@Kansas City  4 sacks 1 forced fumble
Jets          3 sacks 1 forced fumble 1 interception return TD

Tebow is getting a hell of a lot of help from the D. They're playing some inspired football at present.

The moral of the story seems to be that if you beat the Denver defense the offense finds it difficult to put up a score past the teens.