Defense - Safeties

[Sciz]

I like the devil's advocate role as much as anyone else, but if you're trying to say that you don't think our safeties would have been better with one or more of those 4 names---I'm sorry, but I just don't believe you.

If we were getting the 2009 versions of Sanders and Meriweather, then yeah. Probably even the 2010 versions. But during the preseason, there were a few hints that both of these players were disappointing. Meriweather was benched. Sanders missed a lot of practice. There were reports that Belichick was "desperate" for a free safety. Obviously neither of the two were cutting it.

Now, it could be a situation where Belichick went with the unknown because he decided that the known wasn't good enough. But it's not like both of these players were cut out of nowhere. There were definitely a few signs that said that these guys weren't playing up to expectations.

 

[VJCPatriot]

Maybe BB has faith in Sergio Brown? I started a thread earlier on the possibility of him being a starting safety kinda by default. Meriweather, well we saw all the warning signs. Despite his 'pro bowl' selections, he was constantly making mental mistakes and messing up assignments. I'm only surprised we didn't at least manage to get a draft pick for him, even a 4th would have been nice. Sanders is a decidedly average safety, but he knew the system well, I'm more surprised at the Sanders cut and I think he must have had some kind of injury issue. Page and McGowan, well the Pats weren't going to bid on them at free agent rates so they were as good as gone. Ihedigbo and Barrett are completely unknown quantities to me. BB must like something about them?

I wouldn't read too much into the safety play from the SD game because I believe that by design, they were assigned to blanket/suffocate Gates and they did just that. They didn't do much of anything else though. Let's see if we get some more progress from our secondary against the Bills in game 3. BTW if Dowling isn't healthy, we might finally get to see more of Molden.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

I don't have any resentment at all.

Meriweather was good for a while, but if he can't do what the coaches need of him then what good is he?

I didn't think I was being overly harsh? I don't think the first two games are representative of what we're going to see later on in the year. Even Nick Collins was getting smoked like a corncob pipe by Brees & Co.

Sounds good

 

[supafly]

If we were getting the 2009 versions of Sanders and Meriweather, then yeah. Probably even the 2010 versions. But during the preseason, there were a few hints that both of these players were disappointing. Meriweather was benched. Sanders missed a lot of practice. There were reports that Belichick was "desperate" for a free safety. Obviously neither of the two were cutting it.

Now, it could be a situation where Belichick went with the unknown because he decided that the known wasn't good enough. But it's not like both of these players were cut out of nowhere. There were definitely a few signs that said that these guys weren't playing up to expectations.

Agreed.

Like I said, I don't like to question the moves of such a well-earned reputation, but I am referring more to the 'lesser known' names such as Page and McGowan personally.

You are right, we don't KNOW for sure if they'd be upgrades to Barrett, but I do believe they'd be upgrades to Ihedigbo.

I think the bottom line is that I don't think he should've nixed everyone all at once, so we can go back and forth with specific names (and you'd be more right than wrong with guys such as BMcG), but the entire removal and starting from scratch is what I don't really care for or personally agree with.

I think if anything, we could have still had use for a guy like Page or Sanders. Then we'd have no Ihedigbo, and could have had Barrett and Brown learn a bit before throwing them directly in the fire.

Only time will tell if it was the right decision or not, but so far I am leaning towards it being a lost gamble.

 

[supafly]

Maybe BB has faith in Sergio Brown? I started a thread earlier on the possibility of him being a starting safety kinda by default. Meriweather, well we saw all the warning signs. Despite his 'pro bowl' selections, he was constantly making mental mistakes and messing up assignments. I'm only surprised we didn't at least manage to get a draft pick for him, even a 4th would have been nice. Sanders is a decidedly average safety, but he knew the system well, I'm more surprised at the Sanders cut and I think he must have had some kind of injury issue. Page and McGowan, well the Pats weren't going to bid on them at free agent rates so they were as good as gone. Ihedigbo and Barrett are completely unknown quantities to me. BB must like something about them?

I wouldn't read too much into the safety play from the SD game because I believe that by design, they were assigned to blanket/suffocate Gates and they did just that. They didn't do much of anything else though. Let's see if we get some more progress from our secondary against the Bills in game 3. BTW if Dowling isn't healthy, we might finally get to see more of Molden.

I really like S.Brown myself, but I am wondering if he could have been showcased as a role player with a little better of a supporting cast instead (?)

You are right that apparently BB likes something, so we'll have to trust that for now.

 

[Deus Irae]

If we were getting the 2009 versions of Sanders and Meriweather, then yeah. Probably even the 2010 versions. But during the preseason, there were a few hints that both of these players were disappointing. Meriweather was benched. Sanders missed a lot of practice. There were reports that Belichick was "desperate" for a free safety. Obviously neither of the two were cutting it.

Now, it could be a situation where Belichick went with the unknown because he decided that the known wasn't good enough. But it's not like both of these players were cut out of nowhere. There were definitely a few signs that said that these guys weren't playing up to expectations.

If Barrett had been on the team for Sunday's game, and he'd suffered a heart attack on the field, falling into a heap and being completely unable to move, how would that have been significantly worse than what he was doing for much of the game when he was in there?

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

I really like S.Brown myself, but I am wondering if he could have been showcased as a role player with a little better of a supporting cast instead (?)

You are right that apparently BB likes something, so we'll have to trust that for now.

I wouldn't be shocked if BB's evaluation criteria is considerably different from your criteria....and everyone else on this thread.

 

[Sciz]

If Barrett had been on the team for Sunday's game, and he'd suffered a heart attack on the field, falling into a heap and being completely unable to move, how would that have been significantly worse than what he was doing for much of the game when he was in there?

Anybody watching the TV version of the game saw at most 50% of what Barrett was doing last Sunday.

 

[Deus Irae]

Anybody watching the TV version of the game saw at most 50% of what Barrett was doing last Sunday.

I always love that argument. It's as if people think it means something. Is it possible that Barrett was amazing in that theoretical 50%? Sure, but it's highly unlikely given that he looked like garbage in the other 50%.

 

[sbpatfan]

Our safeties blow, neither Ihedigbo or Barrett look capable of covering / playing the run. But hey, when they mess up because they suck at least they know why they suck. Meri might have been an idiot freelancer but at least that dude can ball.

 

[The-Hooded-One]

If Barrett had been on the team for Sunday's game, and he'd suffered a heart attack on the field, falling into a heap and being completely unable to move, how would that have been significantly worse than what he was doing for much of the game when he was in there?

Seriously, he was awful. Check out the Mathews TD run. Barrett gets the Monty Beisel Award for Tackling Excellence on that play.

 

[Ochmed Jones]

If Barrett had been on the team for Sunday's game, and he'd suffered a heart attack on the field, falling into a heap and being completely unable to move, how would that have been significantly worse than what he was doing for much of the game when he was in there?

How much of the cutting of Sanders and Merriweather has to do with Coach patricia?

Clearly BB has to do something about the hole at safety. Barrett and Ivebeenaho are not viable NFL calibre players.

Is Ventrone availalble?

 

[FalconHeavy]

How much of the cutting of Sanders and Merriweather has to do with Coach patricia?

Clearly BB has to do something about the hole at safety. Barrett and Ivebeenaho are not viable NFL calibre players.

Is Ventrone availalble?

10 chars

 

[mgteich]

James Sanders is capable of being a better #4 safety for 2011 than Ihedigbo. Do you disagree?

Many of us think that Sanders would be a better #2 and #3 than what we have.

If we were getting the 2009 versions of Sanders and Meriweather, then yeah. Probably even the 2010 versions. But during the preseason, there were a few hints that both of these players were disappointing. Meriweather was benched. Sanders missed a lot of practice. There were reports that Belichick was "desperate" for a free safety. Obviously neither of the two were cutting it.

Now, it could be a situation where Belichick went with the unknown because he decided that the known wasn't good enough. But it's not like both of these players were cut out of nowhere. There were definitely a few signs that said that these guys weren't playing up to expectations.

 

[Sciz]

James Sanders is capable of being a better #4 safety for 2011 than Ihedigbo. Do you disagree?

Many of us think that Sanders would be a better #2 and #3 than what we have.

I do not believe Sanders would be better than Brown or Barrett. I think the #4 role had more to do with special teams than safety play. Ihedigbo plays on all 4 major special teams. He and Tracy White are the only two to do that. (Brown and Barrett each play on 3/4)

 

[mgteich]

I believe that Slater, Arrington and McCourty all palyer on at least on 4 of the special teams units. Also, I believe that Sanders also did. Sanders was a fine special teamer.

I guess that you can say that Page was only a special teamer last year. I believe that he is starting at safety this year.

I do not believe Sanders would be better than Brown or Barrett. I think the #4 role had more to do with special teams than safety play. Ihedigbo plays on all 4 major special teams. He and Tracy White are the only two to do that. (Brown and Barrett each play on 3/4)

 

[captain stone]

I was really hoping that Bill would sign Dashon Goldson when he had the chance, before Stomper was released. However I have also noticed that he hasn't played in either of SF's first 2 games; I wonder if he's injured.

 

[reflexblue]

I'm starting to think that BB reads this forum when making personel decisions, after all according to many on this board Meriwether and Sanders stunk, same thing with Darius Butler. I'd like to have them now.

 

[supafly]

I wouldn't be shocked if BB's evaluation criteria is considerably different from your criteria....and everyone else on this thread.

As I've stated several times, I don't like to question such a great reputation, but that does not always mean that he's 'right' either. We have all seen plenty of mistakes over the yrs, some of which have been quite costly.

If you agree with dismantling the entire position of safety (once thought of as the strongest position on the team, depth-wise) within a month long period before the season, then more power to you.

I believe that keeping 1-2 of the 4 players would have been a better move, and thus allowed for the blending in of the younger/greener guys such as Brown (who I already said I liked), and Barrett.

That's my opinion. Whether I am right or wrong will remain to be seen. I have all the faith in the world in our coach, and hope that it all works out. And what I mean by that is, I hope Brady keeps putting up big numbers and masking this deficiency.

You can't really tell me with a straight face that you actually can't see some of these opposing viewpoints after the recent moves, and start to the season by the safeties, can you?

 

[Sciz]

I believe that Slater, Arrington and McCourty all palyer on at least on 4 of the special teams units. Also, I believe that Sanders also did. Sanders was a fine special teamer.

I guess that you can say that Page was only a special teamer last year. I believe that he is starting at safety this year.

The big 4 are kickoff, kick return, punt, and punt return. I don't have the link right now, but Reiss often posts on his blog who plays on how many units.