Patriots passing offense difficult?

[RayClay]

I think it is for many players from other teams. It's not about getting open, it's about being in the right area at the right time going in the right direction.

Many receivers are used to trying to get open while the quarterback waits and hits them.

Our offense is based on receivers being in certain areas at certain times so Brady can go through his sequence and find the weakness in the overall coverage.

Sometimes a receiver needs to fight the defender to a spot. If he doesn't, the QB might throw an interception because he assumed the receiver was going to follow through.

I'm assuming Gabriel got open a few times while not doing exactly what he was supposed to and thought he was doing great.

I know his "I've got the playbook down" comment after a couple weeks gave me pause, but I forgot about it.

This offense is about 3,4,5 guys being in the right place at the right time and knowing what to do if the defense is hindering them.

When everyone is on the same page it works quite well and all the expensive receivers in the world won't make it work if they freelance instead of carrying out their assignments.

I'm not an x+o guy, so tear this apart if you want.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Yup, I've mentioned that a couple of times. When he said it my first thought was we either got waaaaay more than we bargained for, or way less. My fear because of the almost arrogant and dismissive tone he said it in (he was being asked about the level of difficulty perception at the time) was it was gonna be less.

 

[Pat the Pats Fan]

As cerebral as Belichick is, one would have to think the offense and the receiver routes are fairly complicated.

 

[mikiemo83]

As cerebral as Belichick is, one would have to think the offense and the receiver routes are fairly complicated.

the route vary based on many variables like type coverage or how the coverage is positioned as well as running precise routes and 8 yard out is an 8 yard out not a 7 not a 9 and I feel some players are not disciplined enough to run these routes - this is the reason college WR's have issue for the most part in their rookie year - discipline in Route running and comprehending the complexity of the options available to them in the split second they appear

 

[PATRIOTS-80]

you hit it right on the head Ray Clay ... I might add it seems BB's system seems to be difficult for LBs as well....

 

[RayClay]

the route vary based on many variables like type coverage or how the coverage is positioned as well as running precise routes and 8 yard out is an 8 yard out not a 7 not a 9 and I feel some players are not disciplined enough to run these routes - this is the reason college WR's have issue for the most part in their rookie year - discipline in Route running and comprehending the complexity of the options available to them in the split second they appear

Actually, timing is also important, from what BB said in a press conference.

If you get bumped at the line, you need to make your cut to be in the area at the same time. So it is essential in this instance to run a 7 yd route so you will be in sight when he looks to the area.

I think that clock in the head thing is more difficult.

 

[Pat the Pats Fan]

you hit it right on the head Ray Clay ... I might add it seems BB's system seems to be difficult for LBs as well....

Agreed Pats80,

 

[MrBigglesWorth]

Agreed Pats80,

makes me feel a little better about jackson not picking up the offense that quickly. he just needs time. hopefully they could put in 3 or 4 routes for him per game and swithc them up every game.

 

[RayClay]

makes me feel a little better about jackson not picking up the offense that quickly. he just needs time. hopefully they could put in 3 or 4 routes for him per game and swithc them up every game.

I think there's a certain amount of ball busting involved.

They're being told to forget "beating your man" and instead get to a certain area at a certain time even if you have to fight the defender.

This goes against what hometown heroes have learned which is I can beat my man and the quarterback needs to find me when I get open, (sound familiar).

Where not talking "Stephen Hawkings" difficult here, we're talking "do what you're told, buy into it for a long time and you will start getting more balls thrown to you".

Reche Caldwell was hungry. He was written off as a bust so he worked his ass off. He gets it IMO.

David Patten could see himself back hauling 75 Lb. bags of Coffee beans.

Troy Brown could have been a career special teamer. Givens 7th rounder.

Branch seemed a natural and I wonder if he played a similar system in college.
Either way, he wasn't highly rated and had something to prove.

One "superstar" free lancing, waiting for the QB to find him, screws the whole system up.

 

[RayClay]

you hit it right on the head Ray Clay ... I might add it seems BB's system seems to be difficult for LBs as well....

They are similar in that LBs are taught to stay in the system and leave the tackle to the LB in whose area it is.

I think it's easier to find receivers with the minimum physical skills, at least going by the draft position or success if by trade of the successful candidates at each position.

 

[HEY BRO! WHAT UP?]

HAAAAAAHAAAAhAAAAAhAAAAhAA! McDaniels offense being hard to grasp.....HAAAAHAAAAHAhaaaa! Doug Gabriel probably picked up on that offense in about a week. It's sure funny how he did pretty well in Oakland and then he goes to the Pats and never plays. It's not like the competition was tough. I think Gabriel had problems with the coaching staff, bad work ethic, didn't practice hard enough? He clearly has talent and can play the game. The Pats need to explain such a bizarre release when they aren't exactly loaded at reciever.

 

[Oswlek]

I don't like the use of the word "difficult" but I think that this is a good point. The example that I would use as a possible illustration is the int Brady threw in the Cincy game. Gabriel settle into what appeared to be the right zone, but the pass was too high and he could only tip it up. Clearly it could have been Brady's fault, but it could have been an example of a guy who picked what appeared to be a good spot in the coverage, but it wasn't the right spot based on other guys' positioning.

That is the one that jumps out to me.

 

[cstjohn17]

the route vary based on many variables like type coverage or how the coverage is positioned as well as running precise routes and 8 yard out is an 8 yard out not a 7 not a 9 and I feel some players are not disciplined enough to run these routes - this is the reason college WR's have issue for the most part in their rookie year - discipline in Route running and comprehending the complexity of the options available to them in the split second they appear

Is the Pats system more complex than other teams in the league? and if so why?

I have wondered if it is unnecessarily complex, everything seems to be life and death. Watching other games it seems like some teams run less complex plays and still move the ball effectively.

 

[bosfan]

If the offense is that tricky for receivers then one would think we would make sure we do our best to keep the ones who perform well in it. If it is not a position we can just plug any joe blow into, then we should be especially willing to pay the price to maintain a certain standard when we have someone who does the job well. This league is tough enough without making things extra difficult for ourselves....

 

[MrBigglesWorth]

You know, we are all talking about systems being difficult, about players not grasping it, about the routes being wrong, etc., etc., etc.

Damn it , what the hell is wrong with this coaching staff? Are they really that stubborn,l that obstinate and that ignorant.

Players change. Names change. Their talents and abilities change. One player could do this, but this one cant,but instead, he can do something different.

Is that so hard for this coaching staff to grasp?

CHANGE WHAT THE HELL YOU'VE BEEN DOING WITH OTHER PLAYERS, CAUSE THESE PLAYERS ARE NOT THE SAME. Put in plays, and routes, that play to THEIR strengths, not to the strengths of the players you had last year, or two years ago, etc.

Is that so friggin hard to understand for these coaches.? Maybe winning, sometimes, sends coaches down the wrong path, and they believe that what they did yesterday is ok for today. WELL, IT'S NOT, because the names of the players have changed....its as simple as that.

CHANGE AND ADJUSTMENT IS ALL THAT IT TAKES...

Maybe thats on page two of the manual and they are only on page one, I dont know...but, CHANGE IS REQUIRED...especially on the offensive side.

Belive me, I am no expert on X's and O's but I am far from a dummy about common sense. CHANGE AND ADJUSTMENT SHOULD HAVE BEENMADE WEEKS AGO, AND GAME BY GAME, AND IT IS NOT BEING DONE.

or put in a player that knows the system? like bam childress?

 

[smg93]

If the offense is that tricky for receivers then one would think we would make sure we do our best to keep the ones who perform well in it. If it is not a position we can just plug any joe blow into, then we should be especially willing to pay the price to maintain a certain standard when we have someone who does the job well. This league is tough enough without making things extra difficult for ourselves....

Really good observation.

 

[RayClay]

I don't like the use of the word "difficult" but I think that this is a good point. The example that I would use as a possible illustration is the int Brady threw in the Cincy game. Gabriel settle into what appeared to be the right zone, but the pass was too high and he could only tip it up. Clearly it could have been Brady's fault, but it could have been an example of a guy who picked what appeared to be a good spot in the coverage, but it wasn't the right spot based on other guys' positioning.

That is the one that jumps out to me.

I agree, it's not difficult it's discipline. Not doing what comes natural, which is trying to beat your man but getting to a spot at a certain time.

It's against the way receivers played in college where the QB would wait til his main receiver came open.

Also running your route correctly when your not the primary is importan, because the play id designed to force the defense to make choices.

You don't just "get open", sometimes you run right into coverage.

 

[RayClay]

Is the Pats system more complex than other teams in the league? and if so why?

I have wondered if it is unnecessarily complex, everything seems to be life and death. Watching other games it seems like some teams run less complex plays and still move the ball effectively.

I don't think it's more complex, at least not for the receiver.

In other systems the WR tries to beat the coverage and get open. Of course there are variations.

An example would be if you are running you route and the coverage is converging, you need to fight it off and get to your spot at the right time.

Because you drew the coverage somebody else will be open.

When Brady Makes his read he looks at spots and if he sees lots of coverage ther he knows maybe theres no safety unaccounted for and hits the next man.

If the receiver pulls up into an open spot, he might be open once, but he throws the rhythm off on that play.

You notice how po'd Brady is and how he's talking about doing what the coach says. We need one more guy to practice only his assignments and resist the urge to make the play.

 

[Joker]

Discipline and familiarity are the hallmarks of the Patriot passing offense...and NO TURNOVERS...there's the chink in the armor right there