Questions I'd like answers to.....

[patfanken]

WTF is going on with the Solder, Dowling and Vareen signings????? Solder's especially. Doesn't his agent know that he/or the kid himself, is KILLING his chances of being a significant contributor THIS season. He is going to get around $9MM over a 4 year period REGARDLESS of how it is constructed. WHAT IS THE HOLD UP. He needs to get on the practice field. To a lesser degree the same goes for Dowling and Vareen. Not signing just makes NO SENSE!

Even if they end up signing today, I'd like to know what the hold up was about

I wanted just to find out where the Pats are as it pertains to the cap. However I resisted my naturally lazy nature and actually went to Miguels pages to see for myself. Of course Miguel is such a stickler to accuracy he doesn't just give us the simple answer we'd all like to see. So, I just would like to see if my interpretation is correct.

According to Miguel the Pats are currently $9.7MM under the cap.....not counting the recent signings of Tracy White, Brandon McGowan, Sammy Morris, Kevin Faulk, Steve Williams, Marcus Cannon, and Malcolm Williams. Now with the exception of Faulk, the other 6 signings look like they are going to be pretty much minimum wage guys. So I am unclear where they will end up among the to 51 that counts to the cap. But lets make a conservative guess and say that those signings drop us to $8MM under the cap.

The next big question what is going to happen to the "dead money" when the league year starts. If it goes away*and I think it does) then we will have ANOTHER $5.5MM to play with. That brings us back to $13.5MM under.

Then I read about the 3 million dollar exemption you can get credit for on up to 5 guys with 5+ years in the league. Interesting you don't have to start pay that back until 2014. A period AFTER the next TV deal is supposed to bring in a whole BOATLOAD of new revenue, so there is no reason NOT to take that credit. So now We are at $16.5MM

Then I looked at Chad and Albert's contracts. Both could easily be restructured to spread their $11.5MM cap hit out a bit more judiciously. reportedly they are already in the process of doing that right now. Lets be conservative and say that when the dust clears, the Pats will be able to shave another $3.5MM from their current number, and it could be more, and the new number comes to $20MM under the cap.

Do a long term deal with Logan Mankins and you could conservatively shave off another 3+MM which gets us to $23MM

Now lets assume it will cost us 4MM to sign the 3 rookies still unsigned and $6 MM to get Light under contract. That would leave the Pats at CONSERVATIVELY $13MM under the cap. A number that would allow us to add ANY FA we wanted. We could sign Matt Roth AND Manny Lawson. BOTTOM LINE, if my numbers are even close to reality. The cap should NOT be a hindrance in signing any further FAs.

Now what I need from you guys is to let me know where I have gone wrong in my very amateurish attempt at understanding where the Pats stand. I need your help

 

[NEPats1]

FWIW, Florio said this about picks from 17-24

The bulk of the holdouts are clustered from picks 17 through 24. Only one player in that stretch, Bucs defensive end Adrian Clayborn (No. 20 overall) has agreed to terms. The fact that Clayborn overshot the allocation for his slot by roughly $75,000 possibly has contributed to the problem. Clayborn received $8,210,000; the formula pegged his slot at $8,135,000.

Clayborn not only overshot his own slot — he got more than the number that the formula provides for Amukamara at No. 19 ($8,180,000).

Another issue could be the question of the extent to which the contracts will be guaranteed. Clayborn’s deal is fully guaranteed, which squeezes Pats, Chargers, and Giants to do the same thing. Likewise, the players picked at No. 21 through No. 24 may be seeking fully guaranteed deals, and the teams may be resisting. The 25th pick, James Carpenter of the Seahawks, has a guarantee only for the first three years.



Despite rookie wage scale, 10 first-round picks still aren’t signed | ProFootballTalk

 

[jmt57]

Regarding question #2, I would direct you to what is currently the last page of the "Dead money question" thread. Looks like it will be split over two years, somewhat similar to how it was in 2009 and before if teams waited to cut a player. Unfortunately for the Pats they could have written it all off if in the uncapped year if they had cut players prior to 3/11 like the Jets did.

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...07-dead-money-question-page4.html#post2606985

My guess is that this is how it goes.
if a player was released before 3/11/11 no dead money at all in 2011.
if a player was released after 3/10/11 2011 dead money consists of 2011 signing bonus proration and some offseason workout bonus money.

NFL's transition rules allow Vikings to clear more cap space with cuts | 1500 ESPN Twin Cities ? Minnesota Sports News & Opinion (Twins, Vikings, Wolves, Wild, Gophers)

Denver Broncos Won't Count "Dead Money" Towards 2011 Salary Cap Figure - Mile High Report

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...07-dead-money-question-page4.html#post2608660

Further support for my position.

Five thoughts on Lofa Tatupu's situation - NFC West Blog - ESPN

It will count $1.1 million after releasing Tatupu, with another $2.2 million counting against the cap in 2012

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Regarding question #2, I would direct you to what is currently the last page of the "Dead money question" thread. Looks like it will be split over two years, somewhat similar to how it was in 2009 and before if teams waited to cut a player. Unfortunately for the Pats they could have written it all off if in the uncapped year if they had cut players prior to 3/11 like the Jets did.

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...07-dead-money-question-page4.html#post2606985



http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...07-dead-money-question-page4.html#post2608660

Has any mediot written anything that attempts to explain why the NFL arbitrarily imposed ANY cutoff date which "accidentally" benefits a few teams' profligate GMs? If the goal was to satisfy the NFLPA (no asterik needed now) desire for more player money why choose a cutoff date that has benefit to a select few and penalizes some well run teams?

 

[Gwedd]

Has any mediot written anything that attempts to explain why the NFL arbitrarily imposed ANY cutoff date which "accidentally" benefits a few teams' profligate GMs? If the goal was to satisfy the NFLPA (no asterik needed now) desire for more player money why choose a cutoff date that has benefit to a select few and penalizes some well run teams?

Very good question, and one that I, too, would be interested in having an answer for.

 

[ay-yo]

WTF is going on with the Solder, Dowling and Vareen signings????? Solder's especially. Doesn't his agent know that he/or the kid himself, is KILLING his chances of being a significant contributor THIS season. He is going to get around $9MM over a 4 year period REGARDLESS of how it is constructed. WHAT IS THE HOLD UP. He needs to get on the practice field. To a lesser degree the same goes for Dowling and Vareen. Not signing just makes NO SENSE!

Just guessing but here's a possibly theory. It's better to have the rooks miss a few days and make an important trade / FA signing than get the rooks into camp and miss out on the trade / FA the team wanted. What really matters is how the rooks look by January. Missing a week now won't make a huge difference by the time the playoffs roll around.

 

[patfanken]

Regarding question #2, I would direct you to what is currently the last page of the "Dead money question" thread. Looks like it will be split over two years, somewhat similar to how it was in 2009 and before if teams waited to cut a player. Unfortunately for the Pats they could have written it all off if in the uncapped year if they had cut players prior to 3/11 like the Jets did.

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...07-dead-money-question-page4.html#post2606985



http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...07-dead-money-question-page4.html#post2608660

Thanks for the info, but let me know the lazy man's answer. Does all this mean that the Pats can write of $2.7MM of the dead money THIS year. With the end result being that instead of the $13MM I previously came up with, the reality is closer to $10MM under after all is said and done, including Light and the rookies?

 

[patfanken]

Just guessing but here's a possibly theory. It's better to have the rooks miss a few days and make an important trade / FA signing than get the rooks into camp and miss out on the trade / FA the team wanted. What really matters is how the rooks look by January. Missing a week now won't make a huge difference by the time the playoffs roll around.

In theory that's plausible, but not likely. Let me repeat, all these rookies first contracts are SLOTTED ALREADY. Everyone on the planet knows that Solder is getting roughly $9MM. Its NOT complicated/ It shouldn't distract from ANY OTHER possible transaction. Christ, if they are busy they can get one of the parking lot attendants to handle it. How come the rest of the league can get their rookies on the field and the Pats can't.

If there is answer, I want to know it.

 

[italia44]

In theory that's plausible, but not likely. Let me repeat, all these rookies first contracts are SLOTTED ALREADY. Everyone on the planet knows that Solder is getting roughly $9MM. Its NOT complicated/ It shouldn't distract from ANY OTHER possible transaction. Christ, if they are busy they can get one of the parking lot attendants to handle it. How come the rest of the league can get their rookies on the field and the Pats can't.

If there is answer, I want to know it.

Caln down ken.....What are you gonna do...hold your breath 'till you turn blue?

I'm not concerned in the least. If BB is using the week until Aug.4 to look at the players or to keep $$$ in the right pocket for a possible deal.....so what...ya know why?....Because of: Solder,Vereen and Dowling; we need ZERO of them right now.

 

[midwestpatsfan]

What is the holdup on gettings these guys signed?

Solder is the highest pick yet not to have signed, should not be that hard to slot him in.
Dowling and Vereen are 2nd rounders that should have been done days ago, yet, nothing to speak of. Why? What is taking so long on getting deals done with these 3?

 

[ctpatsfan77]

In theory that's plausible, but not likely. Let me repeat, all these rookies first contracts are SLOTTED ALREADY. Everyone on the planet knows that Solder is getting roughly $9MM. Its NOT complicated/ It shouldn't distract from ANY OTHER possible transaction. Christ, if they are busy they can get one of the parking lot attendants to handle it. How come the rest of the league can get their rookies on the field and the Pats can't.

If there is answer, I want to know it.

Except that while they are slotted, they inexplicably weren't slotted in stone. As Florio noted, part of the problem is that one rookie in the first-round already got more than what was allocated for the player above him.

 

[supafly]

Except that while they are slotted, they inexplicably weren't slotted in stone. As Florio noted, part of the problem is that one rookie in the first-round already got more than what was allocated for the player above him.

Good point ct, but I don't think that it was that significant.

In other words, I think we can agree with Ken's questioning of 'what the hell is going on here?'

The slotting system makes it virtually impossible for there to be problems, yet we now have 3 pretty high picks (and the overall highest drafted player) who have not signed yet.

I don't think the problem is that one guy got a little bit more money (I believe you're speaking of Adrian Clayborn), I think that it's the guaranteed years on the deal. I'd imagine that Solder is looking for all 4 yrs guaranteed, and I'd bet that the Pats are only wanting 3.

This problem was pretty much solved by Danny Watkins tonight, as he agreed to only 3 yrs guaranteed, with the hopes that the PHI Eagles would 'sweeten' the deal a little bit...it worked, as the Eagles gave him an extra 25,000 in his signing bonus. Maybe this can be a solution that the front office duplicates here in the days to come.

Regardless, I'm glad that we signed Light now anyway, as I never was one to buy into the whole premise that Solder would immediately start as of day one, and frankly I'm surprised that so many felt this way.

 

[VJCPatriot]

The total money is not an issue because well it's slotted. I think the holdup is going to be -- how much of that money is guaranteed. And thus the agents make their money and the Pats lawyers and negotiators make their money. That's what it's gonna boil down to. Solder's agent is gonna ask for 100% guaranteed money for the whole rookie contract. The 2nd rounders, I dunno the precedent will probably be asking at least 50% of the money guaranteed, etc.