Tommie Harris coming in for a workout | update: signed by Colts

[strngplyr]

Re: Tommie Harris coming in for a workout

2 pt stance or 3 pt stance?

Reports didn't say, just that he was at DE. Maybe someone attending practices can help us out. Assuming a 3pt if we're going for an aggressive and attacking style like the Giants use.

 

[Joker]

Re: Tommie Harris coming in for a workout

According to camp reports, Cunningham has been lining up as an end in the 4 DL set, which is what he played in college

yeah..I saw that...three point stance too...

this week I'm going up to the Razor to watch in person.. I can't wait to see what they're doing

 

[fumbrunner]

Re: Tommie Harris coming in for a workout

2 pt stance or 3 pt stance?

Saw a reference to his hand being in the dirt, Rapsheet I think.

 

[NinjaZX6R]

Re: Tommie Harris coming in for a workout

Reports didn't say, just that he was at DE. Maybe someone attending practices can help us out. Assuming a 3pt if we're going for an aggressive and attacking style like the Giants use.

The reason I ask is because I remember the Pats using a 34 Leo looks last season.

 

[strngplyr]

Re: Tommie Harris coming in for a workout

Anyone else excited for a switch if it happens? I just feel like a lot of our players are more 4-3 suited and this might be a big boost just getting people doing what they practically grew up playing.

I think a combination of this switch and picking up Haynesworth may fix a lot of our pass rush issues.

 

[Joker]

Re: Tommie Harris coming in for a workout

IF..and this is the huge 5 ton elephant in the room hiding behind the floor lamp, Haynesworth plays up to expectations, the 4/3 will provide devastating penetration on pass plays..which is what is needed for this defense to be effective against the pass.

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: Tommie Harris coming in for a workout

If they switch to the 4-3, I hope it works brilliantly.


I much prefer the 3-4, however.

 

[andrewgarrr]

Re: Tommie Harris coming in for a workout

Belichick finally got sick waiting for suitable 34 OLBs?

 

[Zach004265]

Re: Tommie Harris coming in for a workout

I agree if BB is implementing a Tampa 2 4/3...but if he's going to the Giants 4/3 of the nineties, then he'd play like Carson, who didn't cover deep downfield like the MLB does in the Tampa 2.

Hey, we'll find out soon enough what's up...

Can you or someone explain what kind of defense that is because I always thought that BB ran 34- 2 gap defense. Is this the same thing just in a 4/3?

 

[NinjaZX6R]

Re: Tommie Harris coming in for a workout

If they switch to the 4-3, I hope it works brilliantly.


I much prefer the 3-4, however.

Yeah me too. I don't know how BB can teach the 43 in 1 month.

 

[Joker]

Re: Tommie Harris coming in for a workout

I think the "4/3" alignment run by Belichick with the Giants WAS a 3/4 basically, but with Taylor rushing from the edge 90% of the time it was called a 4/3...but Taylor was the LOLB his whole career

 

[strngplyr]

Re: Tommie Harris coming in for a workout

Yeah me too. I don't know how BB can teach the 43 in 1 month.

Well, one thing that helps is some of the young guys like Cunningham come from a 43 in college, so should already know it well, maybe not every detail of BB's system, but have a head start.

Same for guys like Haynesworth who played most of his career in it. I don't think BB would even attempt it either if he didn't believe he could do it in time.

 

[BillBelichickFan79]

Re: Tommie Harris coming in for a workout

Haven't seen him play much but remember he was pretty highly regarded a few years ago. Low risk, high reward type of move if it happens.

Love that Bill is assertively going after front 7 talent. Hope he continues to be aggressive. Would love to see Harris and Tatupu brought in.

 

[ClevTrev]

Re: Tommie Harris coming in for a workout

My two cents: BB is notorious for trying new schemes early in training camp. Yes, he doesn't have much time for a full-time 4-3 implementation; however, given the personnel they've acquired and the schemes they can run, don't rule out the emergence of the 4-3 as a frequent formation when necessary. Remember, they've been toying with the 4-3 for awhile now, and last year, Wilfork was playing DE and DT as much as NT depending on the personnel on the field.

Over time their rivals have learned how to better attack the Pats 3-4, so the Pats running a modified 4-3 against certain teams at certain times should be very effective. Also, given the wider adoption of the 3-4, it may now be easier to get better quality personnel suited for the 4-3. I don't think the Pats will ever go completely away from the 3-4, but a hybrid mix could really keep their opponents guessing.

Leave to Belichick, just as Green Bay, a staunch 4-3 team for years, wins the SB with a Capers led 3-4 and with the 3-4 becoming the common defensive formation in the NFL, he's going in another direction. Keep 'em guessing . . .

 

[VJCPatriot]

Re: Tommie Harris coming in for a workout

Yup, Tommy Harris is definitely a 4-3 style defender. I don't think we'll take him unless he comes on the cheap but if Harris still has something in the tank he could certainly supplant some of the mediocre youngsters we have waiting on the wings - love, deadrick, etc.

I posted what I thought the 4/3 lineup would look like a couple of days ago...

Spikes-Mike
Mayo-Sam
Cunningham-Will

why would anyone think Spikes wouldn't play the Mike?

I've got that flipped. Mayo - Will, Spikes - Mike, and Cunningham - Sam. I think Mayo has the best sideline to sideline speed of all the linebackers we have. Your scenario could work too but that's how I see it. Either way a 4-3 alignment will help cover for our lack of LB depth and will keep Haynesworth happy, dominating the OL next to his new pal Wilfork who will do the dirty work. Both will command double teams, making it easier for the rest of the defense to do their jobs.

Edit: Reading the above it looks like BB has Cunningham slated for a DE slot. Hmm this could mean that Ninkovich takes an OLB slot instead of Cunningham.

 

[BillBelichickFan79]

Re: Tommie Harris coming in for a workout

My two cents: BB is notorious for trying new schemes early in training camp. Yes, he doesn't have much time for a full-time 4-3 implementation; however, given the personnel they've acquired and the schemes they can run, don't rule out the emergence of the 4-3 as a frequent formation when necessary. Remember, they've been toying with the 4-3 for awhile now, and last year, Wilfork was playing DE and DT as much as NT depending on the personnel on the field.

Over time their rivals have learned how to better attack the Pats 3-4, so the Pats running a modified 4-3 against certain teams at certain times should be very effective. Also, given the wider adoption of the 3-4, it may now be easier to get better quality personnel suited for the 4-3. I don't think the Pats will ever go completely away from the 3-4, but a hybrid mix could really keep their opponents guessing.

Leave to Belichick, just as Green Bay, a staunch 4-3 team for years, wins the SB with a Capers led 3-4 and with the 3-4 becoming the common defensive formation in the NFL, he's going in another direction. Keep 'em guessing . . .

Another thing to think about: the pool of players for you to go after is much bigger/wider. How many times over the years have we heard/said "that guy can't play DE in a 3-4, that guy can't play OLB in a 3-4, that guy is too small/weak to hold up against the run or set the edge, that guy doesn't have enough length to play in the Pats 3-4, etc."

It's easier to draft/scout/pickup 4-3 DE's from college or via free agency and plug them in as 4-3 DE's rather than trying to get them to play 3-4 OLB. It's easier to draft/pickup interior lineman because you don't need mammoth/rare/special players like Seymour. You can pickup some guys who may be considered "undersized" for a 3-4, especially if you play more of a one gapping style.

 

[ZoisKing]

Re: Tommie Harris coming in for a workout

Yeah me too. I don't know how BB can teach the 43 in 1 month.

I'm surprised that some think that the 4-3 is so alien that football players who've been playing the game since they were barely teens (maybe they have seen this formation used at some point in their lifetime) wouldn't be able to pick it up and run with it....

To add to that, we have two Florida guys who came from a 4-3, Mayo who is well suited to play OLB in the set, we just traded for the prototype 4-3 DT, and VW who can play any position on the line well.

I think we'll be fine.

 

[Sciz]

Re: Tommie Harris coming in for a workout

I'm surprised that some think that the 4-3 is so alien that football players who've been playing the game since they were barely teens (maybe they have seen this formation used at some point in their lifetime) wouldn't be able to pick it up and run with it....

To add to that, we have two Florida guys who came from a 4-3, Mayo who is well suited to play OLB in the set, we just traded for the prototype 4-3 DT, and VW who can play any position on the line well.

I think we'll be fine.

Yeah, the only players I see possible having a big problem are Ninkovich, Fletcher, and Deaderick. Ninkovich was a college DE and NFL 3-4 OLB, but I don't see him being the pass-rusher that a 4-3 needs at DE. He's got the agility to play OLB, but I worry a little about his speed, and then there's the whole playing off the line part. Fletcher seems like an ideal fit at 4-3 OLB, but needs to learn everything after playing 4-3 DE in college and then 3-4 ILB. Deaderick played 3-4 DE in college and the NFL. Of course, I also can easily see him not making the roster.

 

[ausbacker]

Re: Tommie Harris coming in for a workout

I'm surprised that some think that the 4-3 is so alien that football players who've been playing the game since they were barely teens (maybe they have seen this formation used at some point in their lifetime) wouldn't be able to pick it up and run with it....

To add to that, we have two Florida guys who came from a 4-3, Mayo who is well suited to play OLB in the set, we just traded for the prototype 4-3 DT, and VW who can play any position on the line well.

I think we'll be fine.

Given his defensive roots and knowledge, if anyone can affect philosophical change successfully it's BB. That man would have read almost every schematic NFL book known to man... then stored it in his savant-like memory.

 

[TheComeback]

Re: Tommie Harris coming in for a workout

If they switch to the 4-3, I hope it works brilliantly.


I much prefer the 3-4, however.

I doubt it will be an exclusive conversion to the 4-3. Probably more of a hybrid defense like the Ravens. We could certainly still use the 3-4 if the situation called for it. Could even mix it up on a play by play basis.