Our Defense - Biggest Issues

[mgteich]

For me, our defense is better than last year, even without further additions. Wright and Bodden are back. The youngsters all have a year more under their belts. We've added Dowling.

HOWEVER, I don't think Belichick will stop without additions to the front seven.

ISSUES

1) The front seven could use some help at both OLB and on the DL.

2) I'm fine with having Butler and Wilhite battle it out for the last positional defensive back spot. It seems like a good idea to have 8 defensive backs if we can who can actually play defensive back.

3) There is clearly plenty of room at the bottom. The top 20 will get almost all the reps. Obviously, injuries will affect the final composition of the 53.

DEFENSE (20)

DL (5) Wright, Wilfork, Haynsworth, Brace, Deaderick
LB (7) Cunningham, Ninkovich, Moore, Fletcher, Mayo, Spikes, Guyton
DB (7) Bodden, McCourty, Arrington, Dowling, Meriweather, Chung, Sanders
ST (1) Slater (our top special teamer)

DEFENSE (5) could be from almost any positions
Many of these could be upgraded. One option is
DL (2) Pryor, Love
LB (1) Murrell/Carter
DB (1) Wilhite/Butler
ST (1) Barrett/Brown/Tarp

 

[Sciz]

How about a scheme change?

 

[Deus Irae]

How about a scheme change?

This

If the Patriots go to the 4-3 as a base, that'll bring up one set of issues and, if they stay with the 3-4, they have a different set of issues.

 

[mgteich]

Belichick has run a 2-gap his entire career, whenever he was making the choice. I don't see that changing.

As far as 3-4 and 4-3, we run both now. Someone could go back and count, but I wouldn't be surprised if we were about even as far as schemes.

I suppose that Belichick could concluded that he just isn't finding the "right" OLB's for his schemes.

In the end, this situation is nothing that TWO additions wouldn't solve. And we've only been in free agency a couple of days. Belichick has the cap money. If not, then a few restructures will free up more cap money.

So, as far as I'm concerned, compared to 2010, we have replaced G. Warren with Haynsworth and Wright. We have added Bodden and Dowling.

WE ARE FINE EVERWHERE BUT OLB
So, for me, this is not a tough order to fill in free agency.

How about a scheme change?

 

[BradyFTW!]

How about a scheme change?

In the front 7, Spikes and Deaderick are the two that I dunno how they'd fit into a base 4-3. The rest could probably pull it off with varying levels of success, but any change going forward will be pretty clearly reflected in who thy target from here, I'd think.

 

[Joker]

In the front 7, Spikes and Deaderick are the two that I dunno how they'd fit into a base 4-3. The rest could probably pull it off with varying levels of success, but any change going forward will be pretty clearly reflected in who thy target from here, I'd think.

Spikes plays Harry Carson and Mayo plays Carl Banks...Deaderick plays DE

 

[BillBelichickFan79]

The biggest issue is still the need for an edge rusher. Hypothetically, if you gave the Pats a guy like Osi Umenyoria to play DE in sub and maybe some 3-4 snaps here or there, this defense would be in better shape than it has been in a very long time.

The secondary of this team is still fairly young but fairly promising. I think if you got them a good pass rush, this could be a very good unit. CB is deeper than it has been in a very long time, and I love Chung at safety. Meriweather has to step up and consistently be the player we all thought he would be -- but maybe he never will. He's my only major concern back there.

The Pats have already improved their interior pass rush with Haynesworth -- excellent move. Now it's time to get a feared edge rusher. Maybe Cunningham will eventually be that guy, but maybe not. Even if he is a good pass rusher, they could still use another guy -- a difference maker.

If you worked out a deal for a guy like Osi, you'd have some serious players at each level of the defense. Guys who put fear in opposing teams at every level of the defense. Haynesworth and Osi up front. Mayo at LB. McCourty, Chung, and maybe a ball hawking Meriweather if he ever got his head on straight in the secondary.

Combine that with our pretty explosive offense, and the potential is very exciting. Here's to hoping that Bill has one more thing up his sleeve to bring in an impact DE/OLB

 

[Sciz]

The biggest issue is still the need for an edge rusher. Hypothetically, if you gave the Pats a guy like Osi Umenyoria to play DE in sub and maybe some 3-4 snaps here or there, this defense would be in better shape than it has been in a very long time.

Agent is Condon. That's a no-go.

And there's literally nobody else out there I can think of, unless they're going after Jamaal Anderson or Andre Carter.:bricks:

 

[BillBelichickFan79]

Agent is Condon. That's a no-go.

And there's literally nobody else out there I can think of, unless they're going after Jamaal Anderson or Andre Carter.:bricks:

That'd be a shame if a deal couldn't get done only because of Condon. I've been trying to think of other guys out there as well, but there don't seem to be too many guys.

The one guy I wanted to take a shot on for a mid to late round pick over the past few years has been Merriman. I know a lot of people think he's done, but I think he's still got something left in the tank. His last few years have been marred by injuries and battles with AJ Smith/San Diego management, but he's only 27 years old and I think he could still be a key part of a defense if he's healthy.

He could play 3-4 OLB or 4-3 DE, would bring some intensity/physicality/swagger/attitude/playmaking to this defense. But he just signed an extension with the Bills and I don't see them trading him. Even if they were to trade him, highly unlikely they trade him the division. Probably not a guy that BB would be interested in anyway, but I've always loved the way the guy has played with reckless abandon and tried to play through injuries to help his team.

 

[pdangle]

Is there a way I can filter all posts from all threads with the words 'Scheme change'?

I kid.

BB spent 2.5 years re-tooling the D in his image, and now people think he would change away from something where he's one of the foremost coaching authorities in the league? Why? On the tangled words of a disgruntled employee? Because a newly acquired player once said he doesn't like playing the NT in a 3-4?

The 3-4 ain't going nowhere. And, it is most definitely NOT one of our biggest issue.

Sorry, I've must of caught a little bit of the thread rage. Carry on.

 

[patsfan-1982]

the pats now have two Dline men that demand a double team so the pass rush should be a little better, the biggest issues is coverage thats why they will be playing a lot of nickle and dime this year

 

[pdangle]

the pats now have two Dline men that demand a double team

This.

This one little fact will change everything. Assuming all goes as planned, Haynesworth forcing the O to commit to that extra double, will ignite such a profound chain reaction of advantages for our D, that I am almost giddy with anticipation.

 

[Fencer]

Spikes plays Harry Carson and Mayo plays Carl Banks...Deaderick plays DE

I don't recall that Giants defense as a 4-3, so I'm failing to see your point.

 

[DarrylS]

Perhaps it the wishful thinking part of me that says that there is more stuff gonna happen, why else would they clear out about 10 million of cap dollars???...

Have thought for a while now that BB is morphing into a very hybrid defense, he figured out how to use LT, he seems to be collecting a lot of players in the defensive backfield. The amount of time we are in "sub" packages is also telling. Some of the guys McGowan, Page and even Arrington could be used to pressure the qb... so as much as everyone wants a stud DE or pass rushing OLB, maybe the pressure is going to come from somewhere else. We have upgraded our corners, and that may allow freedom for DB's to apply pressure as well.

 

[Simkin]

BTW we played a lot of 2-5 schemes last year lol

 

[patsfan13]

For me, our defense is better than last year, even without further additions. Wright and Bodden are back. The youngsters all have a year more under their belts. We've added Dowling.

HOWEVER, I don't think Belichick will stop without additions to the front seven.

ISSUES

1) The front seven could use some help at both OLB and on the DL.

2) I'm fine with having Butler and Wilhite battle it out for the last positional defensive back spot. It seems like a good idea to have 8 defensive backs if we can who can actually play defensive back.

3) There is clearly plenty of room at the bottom. The top 20 will get almost all the reps. Obviously, injuries will affect the final composition of the 53.

DEFENSE (20)

DL (5) Wright, Wilfork, Haynsworth, Brace, Deaderick
LB (7) Cunningham, Ninkovich, Moore, Fletcher, Mayo, Spikes, Guyton
DB (7) Bodden, McCourty, Arrington, Dowling, Meriweather, Chung, Sanders
ST (1) Slater (our top special teamer)

DEFENSE (5) could be from almost any positions
Many of these could be upgraded. One option is
DL (2) Pryor, Love
LB (1) Murrell/Carter
DB (1) Wilhite/Butler
ST (1) Barrett/Brown/Tarp

A lot of competition for the last 5 slots. I think the breakout of spots is correct I would add Page as part of the mix for the 25 due to their ST play also.


Wilfolk & Haynesworth playing 1 gap in passing situation both demanding double teams is a nightmare. Pressue up the middle is the bane of an NFL QB existence.

 

[mgteich]

Page is a free agent.

A lot of competition for the last 5 slots. I think the breakout of spots is correct I would add Page as part of the mix for the 25 due to their ST play also.


Wilfolk & Haynesworth playing 1 gap in passing situation both demanding double teams is a nightmare. Pressue up the middle is the bane of an NFL QB existence.

 

[patsfaninpa]

I thought Sergio Brown looked good last year. I can see him beating out Slater because he can also play S. And, looks like a good special teamer. Not worried about db's at all.

A lot riding on Ron Brace and Brandon Deaderick. Am curious to hear how both look conditioning wise. That will play a big part in their success or lack of. Hope we bring G. Warren back. I'd like to spot M. Wright and just use him pass-rush situations. Would like to keep him healthy for the playoffs.

The other guy I want to see is Jermaine Cunningham. Has he taken a step forward? If he has, that helps the pass-rush tremendously. If he hasn't, just don't see where we're getting the pass rush from. Ninko doesn't set the edge on run plays well at all. I would like to see him in a backup role.

 

[patsfan13]

Page is a free agent.

Wasn't aware of that, he is still listed on the Team roster at patriots.com.

 

[PushnPencils]

The idea of Wilfork and Haynesworth playing one gap and terrorizing QBs is bordering on wet dream territory.

However, the reality is this... There is a better than 50-50 chance Haynesworth implodes or never even sees the field.

So then what do you have? No pass rush and a depleted D-Line. I realize the wheeling and dealing period has just begun, but at this moment that's where we're at.