Why We dont play Gabriel...

[Fantasic4x50x54x59x55]

Forgive me If this has been disscussed already but this is an open end question/disscussion I am just giving my views...please add on or flame me...whatever works.

I've been looking over tapes of the some of the games we've had this season..and there are plenty of reason why the pats arent playing good (offensively anyway) football.. but one of the main reasons obviously is lack of productive recivers ( I dont want to say lack of skill because honestly Caldwell, Gabriel, Brown, Gaffney--do have the physical skill and tools to be average to good recievers in the league) but I've noticed a bulk of the "dumb" brady interceptions were thrown to gabriel..I believe alot of these "dumb" picks are due to Gabriel not running the correct route and being totally not on the same page as brady...If you notice also alot of Gabriels Receptions are Ones where he had to make moves and break to the ball...something a defensive back has to do to make a play..receivers with qb's as good as Tom for the most part have passes float into their hands, and dont have to make wild adjustments to get to the ball.

With that being said, I think Gabriel just doesnt get the playbook (Bethel Johnson, Donald Hayes,). He seems to be 5-10 yds away from where the ball is thrown to..so What do we do this offseason..get rid of him or pound the playbook into his head..because honestly he does have some upside, and the physical tools to be a deep threat or redzone threat...

I still think Jackson will solve alot of the recieving problems next season and there after...but its time to start looking at what we got now and what we do with them in the season coming.

 

[Sean Pa Patriot]

We need some recievers... a Drew Bennet ,and Jeff smargina from ND would be nice additions.. But I dont want to think about next yr for about a month.

 

[Michigan Dave]

We need some recievers... a Drew Bennet ,and Jeff smargina from ND would be nice additions.. But I dont want to think about next yr for about a month.

Samardzija is definitely not the answer. I do NOT want Samardzija.

 

[JoeSixPat]

Some players, while having physical skills, just seem to be unable to run routes correctly (hello Tony Simmons!) - they just never seem to be where they need to be when the QB throws the ball.

Caldwell was having problems with that earlier this season - I was concerned he was one of those who would just never learn to run routes but while he's not one's preferred #1 WR he's shown that he can learn the routes and be productive.

Maybe Gabriel has just simply not yet been able to handle the route running. That would be something evident in practice and would be a good reason not to be playing him.

He's not benched because of that one drop, that's for sure.

 

[Fantasic4x50x54x59x55]

JoeSix, Exactly...Exactly..

Its something i've noticed on these tapes..His routes are etheir off or Brady likes playing catch with defenders. It seems like every catch gabriel made (minus one or 2) hes had to fight for, or repoistion himself, or dash toward the ball to get it... while most of other completions to different recivers seem to ,for the most part glide into their hands.

Reche Had the problem but adjusted...now hes a good to dare i say great possesion receiver. (He gets his job done, to say the least).

That one fumble or drop didnt put Gabriel on the end of the bench... Inability to get routes down, or maybe not wanting to get the routes down is what i believe did. He has the raw talent to be good..but we know in this system we dont play that chuck it up and chase after it type of offense...or esle Bethel would have been great here.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

In the Fish game, he was running a sideline fly with the defender staying with him step for step, Tommy threw the ball behind him at his inside shoulder, but he either wasn't expecting that or wasn't expecting the throw at all since he was unable to make the adjustment to get turned around and make the catch.

Either:
A. He has never had a QB this good who would put the ball in the most advantageous and safe place.

B. He isn't a top flight WR who can make adjustments.

C. He was running out of control (Hello Bethel).

D. He sleepwalks through practice and games.

He missed a pass Branch and Givens and Brown and Patten would have had in their sleep. That is the team we would like to see re-emulated with the current corps, they ain't there by any means.

 

[tombonneau]

If we want to talk about looking ahead to WRs for 07, I wouldn't mind Anthony Gonzalez from OSU. Not sure where he projects in draft or what year he is (think he is SR?) but he seems like the kind of guy who just gets open & makes plays.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

If we want to talk about looking ahead to WRs for 07, I wouldn't mind Anthony Gonzalez from OSU. Not sure where he projects in draft or what year he is (think he is SR?) but he seems like the kind of guy who just gets open & makes plays.

I think he is a Sophomore, but your right, he is better than the two most ballyhooed OSU WRs when it comes to route running and hands.

 

[RayClay]

The Pats need to decide on a second receiver to get most of the reps with Caldwell and the others mostly sit.

They have a choice of three, which is better than they are usually looking at this time of year, (Stokes, Ward).

It's easy to forget that Branch and Givens rarely were completely healthy at the same time until last year.

I think they need to simplify the offense and improve execution.

They looked like the Temptations on some plays against Miami, shifting backs and tight ends while Zach Thomas correctly diagnosed which play they were running from which formation.

Less formations with more options and more play action IMO.

If you want to spend our first 4 picks next year on WRs, that's fine, but there's no one out there this year better than what we have on the roster.

 

[BelichickFan]

Well Gabriel was averaging 50 yards a game and 13.7 a catch before The Fumble. Was it only the fumble ? Probably not. But he was playing before the fumble and not after it. I know I don't have the coaches' tape and wouldn't know how good Gabriel's route was even if I did . . . but the guy was producing at the rate of an 800 yard per season WR for 6 games and I'm pissed that they've dumped him like this.

 

[Digger44]

In the Fish game, he was running a sideline fly with the defender staying with him step for step, Tommy threw the ball behind him at his inside shoulder, but he either wasn't expecting that or wasn't expecting the throw at all since he was unable to make the adjustment to get turned around and make the catch.

Either:
A. He has never had a QB this good who would put the ball in the most advantageous and safe place.

B. He isn't a top flight WR who can make adjustments.

C. He was running out of control (Hello Bethel).

D. He sleepwalks through practice and games.

He missed a pass Branch and Givens and Brown and Patten would have had in their sleep. That is the team we would like to see re-emulated with the current corps, they ain't there by any means.

I agree Box that there may be truth in all of these options. The issue for a QB is that he loses trust in that receiver and will now not go to him. Tommy has admitted doing this before.

 

[Jimke]

He is probably in the dog house along with Ellis Hobbs. Another

wasted draft pick like Andre Davis.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Maybe we don't play him because he's not on the team?

 

[RayClay]

Forgive me If this has been disscussed already but this is an open end question/disscussion I am just giving my views...please add on or flame me...whatever works.

I've been looking over tapes of the some of the games we've had this season..and there are plenty of reason why the pats arent playing good (offensively anyway) football.. but one of the main reasons obviously is lack of productive recivers ( I dont want to say lack of skill because honestly Caldwell, Gabriel, Brown, Gaffney--do have the physical skill and tools to be average to good recievers in the league) but I've noticed a bulk of the "dumb" brady interceptions were thrown to gabriel..I believe alot of these "dumb" picks are due to Gabriel not running the correct route and being totally not on the same page as brady...If you notice also alot of Gabriels Receptions are Ones where he had to make moves and break to the ball...something a defensive back has to do to make a play..receivers with qb's as good as Tom for the most part have passes float into their hands, and dont have to make wild adjustments to get to the ball.

With that being said, I think Gabriel just doesnt get the playbook (Bethel Johnson, Donald Hayes,). He seems to be 5-10 yds away from where the ball is thrown to..so What do we do this offseason..get rid of him or pound the playbook into his head..because honestly he does have some upside, and the physical tools to be a deep threat or redzone threat...

I still think Jackson will solve alot of the recieving problems next season and there after...but its time to start looking at what we got now and what we do with them in the season coming.

Now that is what I call a prescient post.

 

[BruschiOnTap]

Samardzija is definitely not the answer. I do NOT want Samardzija.

Samardzija can ball, but he's unfortunately signed with a major league baseball team already if I recollection serves me correctly

 

[Fantasic4x50x54x59x55]

Thanks guys! ive really been taking notes on some of our tapes as to why and what is going on here!! Gabriel is a major let down so far, in my eyes anyway, because he does have potential to be a game breaker, or even maybe just a solid contributor (see Caldwell) but it seems he just can't get it right.

-- I'll add some of my notes for the sake of keeping this disscussion going

**Matt Light is having the most horrid season (duh) an O lineman can have..
**Koppen is holding up nicely but I dont think hes playing up to his full potential...
** Thank God we have Hawkins or we'd be in ALOT more trouble..
*** Assante Samuel is Gone after this year...He's the Real Deal, He's Young-Brilliant-isnt afraid of throwing his body around etheir...big $$$ coming to him (god I hope I am wrong, I am just going with our previous track recrod)
**** Brady doesn't look comfortable at all even when leading and going against a lower tier team (You could thank Matt Light, personally for this)
**** Maroney is the real deal(we all know this)..he just needs a chance to shine...and WHY THE HELL DO WE USE HIM AS A POWERBACK?!?! I'd Much rather see him getting the role Bush is getting in N.O (get well soon kid)
**** Dillion,Bruschi,Vrabel--- Still major players, still great players, Great vets But let's be real..Their legs are slowly giving..and they can't be expected to make the huge season changing plays to save the day anymore..
*** Good tackling has been on the rise THANKGOD all across the board..
**** D-Line is Just NASTY as its ever been.. Hope Wilfork is alright..Mike Wright has a bright future but I dont think hes ready to take a boatload of the snaps yet..Ty Warren is A friggin STUD, Jarvis Green is a STUD...

We are etheir looking at the sinking of the titanic or a REAL REAL REAL REAL good rebuilding season (we are 9-4 with no production coming from WR's and our TE being our at times, only weapon)..

Etheir way Guys..ive never loved the pats more..I love standing by them during these times..cause anyone who knows even a little ounce of football knows what a younger lb or 2 can do.. and a reinforced wr corps and db backfield can do..

 

[Fantasic4x50x54x59x55]

I just caught on to the fact gabriel was released...haha..oh well..

 

[AzPatsFan]

Forgive me If this has been disscussed already but this is an open end question/disscussion I am just giving my views...please add on or flame me...whatever works.

I've been looking over tapes of the some of the games we've had this season..and there are plenty of reason why the pats arent playing good (offensively anyway) football.. but one of the main reasons obviously is lack of productive recivers ( I dont want to say lack of skill because honestly Caldwell, Gabriel, Brown, Gaffney--do have the physical skill and tools to be average to good recievers in the league) but I've noticed a bulk of the "dumb" brady interceptions were thrown to gabriel..I believe alot of these "dumb" picks are due to Gabriel not running the correct route and being totally not on the same page as brady...If you notice also alot of Gabriels Receptions are Ones where he had to make moves and break to the ball...something a defensive back has to do to make a play..receivers with qb's as good as Tom for the most part have passes float into their hands, and dont have to make wild adjustments to get to the ball.

With that being said, I think Gabriel just doesnt get the playbook (Bethel Johnson, Donald Hayes,). He seems to be 5-10 yds away from where the ball is thrown to..so What do we do this offseason..get rid of him or pound the playbook into his head..because honestly he does have some upside, and the physical tools to be a deep threat or redzone threat...

I still think Jackson will solve alot of the recieving problems next season and there after...but its time to start looking at what we got now and what we do with them in the season coming.

I was going to be a wise ass, and answer the question, "Why we don't play Gabriel?" is because he isn't on the roster anymore. But your post had an awful lot of diagnosis and pretty good analysis, BEFORE Gabriel was let go.

 

[AzPatsFan]

Thanks guys! ive really been taking notes on some of our tapes as to why and what is going on here!! Gabriel is a major let down so far, in my eyes anyway, because he does have potential to be a game breaker, or even maybe just a solid contributor (see Caldwell) but it seems he just can't get it right.

-- I'll add some of my notes for the sake of keeping this disscussion going

**Matt Light is having the most horrid season (duh) an O lineman can have..
**Koppen is holding up nicely but I dont think hes playing up to his full potential...
** Thank God we have Hawkins or we'd be in ALOT more trouble..
*** Assante Samuel is Gone after this year...He's the Real Deal, He's Young-Brilliant-isnt afraid of throwing his body around etheir...big $$$ coming to him (god I hope I am wrong, I am just going with our previous track recrod)
**** Brady doesn't look comfortable at all even when leading and going against a lower tier team (You could thank Matt Light, personally for this)
**** Maroney is the real deal(we all know this)..he just needs a chance to shine...and WHY THE HELL DO WE USE HIM AS A POWERBACK?!?! I'd Much rather see him getting the role Bush is getting in N.O (get well soon kid)
**** Dillion,Bruschi,Vrabel--- Still major players, still great players, Great vets But let's be real..Their legs are slowly giving..and they can't be expected to make the huge season changing plays to save the day anymore..
*** Good tackling has been on the rise THANKGOD all across the board..
**** D-Line is Just NASTY as its ever been.. Hope Wilfork is alright..Mike Wright has a bright future but I dont think hes ready to take a boatload of the snaps yet..Ty Warren is A friggin STUD, Jarvis Green is a STUD...

We are etheir looking at the sinking of the titanic or a REAL REAL REAL REAL good rebuilding season (we are 9-4 with no production coming from WR's and our TE being our at times, only weapon)..

Etheir way Guys..ive never loved the pats more..I love standing by them during these times..cause anyone who knows even a little ounce of football knows what a younger lb or 2 can do.. and a reinforced wr corps and db backfield can do..

Excellent analysis. The weekly worrywarts are convinced there is absolutely no talent left. The team must be torn down completely. Its refreshing to see someone else knows better as well. Its like three year ago when the O-line was in for frequent criticism. The Dante school was working invisibly and a couple of draft picks helped. Now everyone is again complaining; they forget that we are playing a rookie and two sophs on the line and two guys coming back from season ending injuries. The only healthy vet got injured this year and missed several games.

This time the criticism is on the WRs. Only two have been through TC. Not surprisingly these two are doing the best of the WRs. Like the O-line, the talent was drafted and learning; talent was signed. The problem will take care of itself next year. the criticism will prove to be yesterday's news.

The Team is very close to being BETTER than any previous Super Bowl club; Add a cover CB and speedy ILB/OLB, and the league better watch out, next year.

Regarding this year, they have two games against weak sub-.500 clubs and a road game against a contender. Prediction 2-1 or 3-0, ending at 12-4 or 11-5 and into the playoffs, hosting a WC club.

The road looks to be entertaining defense-deficient Cincy, and then having an opportunity to visit SD weak pass defense, and send them home. Then a visit to the offense-challenged Ravens before dispatching the annual NFC pretender.

Of the three, Cincy will probably be the biggest challenge matching the Cincy pass offense against the injury-depleted secondary. Plus, its hard to beat a club twice in the same year. unlike msost years though the reinforcement are comimng. Rodney should be back and Hobbs will be able to play with two hands.