At what positions do the Pats ever have logjams?

[Fencer]

We frequently see ideas along the lines of dumping a guy because we have so much other talent at his position. But when does that ever really come into play?

This offseason, the Pats are for the second time letting a good kicker go (the other was Robbie Gould). And Cassell was shipped out. But other than at the "There can only be one" positions, examples are scanty of guys who were let go for reasons of excessive depth, and then missed.

On defense, there's been the occasional JAG DB we might have liked back in our worst injury year, but anybody better has pretty clearly moved on for reasons of money, not roster space.

On offense there have been a few guys who started elsewhere, but which of them have been better than Pats who got reps at the time? (Thomas at TE? Perhaps. Who else?) Probably some WR examples, given that Slater or Aikman got the occasional snap, but they aren't jumping to mind.

Another area may be STs -- Sean Morey went on to be a Pro Bowler after he left. But overall, if there's a guy who's useful, who's not overpaid, and who didn't generally burn his bridges, he winds up staying and getting snaps as injuries, packages, etc. progress.

 

[supafly]

I think that the positions of S, CB, and even DL could be some that may fall into that category, depending on your personal view of course.

We seem to be pretty well stocked at all 3 of those, with at least adequate depth and guys that could start for other teams if needed. Some of the examples I am thinking of (not even coming close to saying that any will or should be let go) are guys like Brace, Pryor, G.Warren, Butler, Wilhite, Page, McGowan, Sanders.

*obviously realizing that some of these are UFA's, so maybe they aren't the best examples (shrugs shoulders), but I don't expect more than 1-2 to leave via FA either, and any one of these guys could define the 'logjam' term that you use in terms of depth*

The thing I love most about this team, the front office, the owner/coach etc, is the importance of depth. I would rather have a bunch of good-to-very good players, than just a couple or a few 'great' ones. The whole Belichickian philosophy of sufficient depth, and rotational players is so important, and I simply love watching groups of 4-5-6 different guys being rotated on sub packages at times.

 

[randomk1]

quarterback-bledsoe,brady,cassell

now mallett and hoyer.

that ******* brady guy keeps holding other guys down. add a supermodel wife and a monster contract and then it's like a kick in the nuts.

 

[Fencer]

quarterback-bledsoe,brady,cassell

Oh, duh. I forgot Drew!!!

 

[Fencer]

I think that the positions of S, CB, and even DL could be some that may fall into that category, depending on your personal view of course.

We seem to be pretty well stocked at all 3 of those, with at least adequate depth and guys that could start for other teams if needed. Some of the examples I am thinking of (not even coming close to saying that any will or should be let go) are guys like Brace, Pryor, G.Warren, Butler, Wilhite, Page, McGowan, Sanders.

*obviously realizing that some of these are UFA's, so maybe they aren't the best examples (shrugs shoulders), but I don't expect more than 1-2 to leave via FA either, and any one of these guys could define the 'logjam' term that you use in terms of depth*

The thing I love most about this team, the front office, the owner/coach etc, is the importance of depth. I would rather have a bunch of good-to-very good players, than just a couple or a few 'great' ones. The whole Belichickian philosophy of sufficient depth, and rotational players is so important, and I simply love watching groups of 4-5-6 different guys being rotated on sub packages at times.

My point is that those logjams have barely materialized in prior years.

It MAY be the case, which I forgot before, that Hobbs was dumped a year early for roster reasons. But who else? Matt Chatham at LB? Dan Klecko at DL? There's almost no such thing as too much defensive depth.

 

[BlueThunder]

If you look at the defense, a bunch of them are in their 2nd and 3rd years and should be either still developing, or reaching their potential this year....let's hope the shortened camp doesn't affect their growth....

No Injuries please...

 

[patchick]

David Thomas leaps to mind.

 

[Fencer]

David Thomas leaps to mind.

So far we have QBs, Ks, ST cover guys, and him.

 

[Richard Camembert]

Let's not forget Ted Larsen...when our depth guys can start for other teams you know something is going well.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

David Thomas leaps to mind.

The 2009 TEs. Oy:

* Give away a 5 for Alex Smith, who didn't even make the roster, when the team already had a full complement of TEs
* Trade away David Thomas, who arguably had the best season of any of those TEs, for (initially) a 7 two years down the road
* Trade for *another* TE who barely plays, and gets cut after a few weeks
* Run the season with two TEs who TFB barely trusts

About the only thing that saves it from being an unmitigated disaster is that, like the 2006 WRs, it forced BB to completely make over the position, and now the Patriots almost unarguably have the best TE unit in the league.

 

[mgteich]

There are players at DL and S that we will cut this year that we would like to keep. Of course, such competition is GOOD thing.

DEFENSIVE LINEMEN NOT NAMED WILFORK (PICK 6)
--------------------------------------------------
T. Warren
G. Warren
Stroud
Wright
Brace
Deaderick
Pryor
Love
Weson
Richard

SAFETIES (Pick 4)
---------
Meriweather
Chung
Sanders
Brown
Page
McGowan
Barrett
Lockett
Williams

 

[patchick]

Let's not forget Ted Larsen...when our depth guys can start for other teams you know something is going well.

Agreed, he's one I wish we could have back right now.

 

[Mike the Brit]

The 2009 TEs. Oy:

* Give away a 5 for Alex Smith, who didn't even make the roster, when the team already had a full complement of TEs
* Trade away David Thomas, who arguably had the best season of any of those TEs, for (initially) a 7 two years down the road
* Trade for *another* TE who barely plays, and gets cut after a few weeks
* Run the season with two TEs who TFB barely trusts

About the only thing that saves it from being an unmitigated disaster is that, like the 2006 WRs, it forced BB to completely make over the position, and now the Patriots almost unarguably have the best TE unit in the league.

Dead right.

And then there were the wide receivers. I forget the details of how we parted company with Jabar Gaffney and Kelley Washington in favour of Joey Galloway and Sam Aiken (weren't there others?)

Off-season 2009 doesn't really show that there was a logjam -- just that the Front Office had a really bad case of "Hans in Luck" syndrome: Hans in Luck - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Ron Sellers]

Dead right.

And then there were the wide receivers. I forget the details of how we parted company with Jabar Gaffney and Kelley Washington in favour of Joey Galloway and Sam Aiken (weren't there others?)

Off-season 2009 doesn't really show that there was a logjam -- just that the Front Office had a really bad case of "Hans in Luck" syndrome: Hans in Luck - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

If I recall correctly Gaffney and Washington left as free agents for more money elsewhere; their replacements were going to be Galloway, who had been let go by Tampa Bay because Antonio Bryant had a big season the previous year, and the Eagle's Greg Lewis, who was obtained for a 5th-round draft pick.

Aiken was like Slater this past year: his position was listed as WR but he was initially on the roster strictly for special teams. He ended up at WR by default, only because first Lewis, and then Galloway did not work out.

 

[Mike the Brit]

If I recall correctly Gaffney and Washington left as free agents for more money elsewhere; their replacements were going to be Galloway, who had been let go by Tampa Bay because Antonio Bryant had a big season the previous year, and the Eagle's Greg Lewis, who was obtained for a 5th-round draft pick.

Aiken was like Slater this past year: his position was listed as WR but he was initially on the roster strictly for special teams. He ended up at WR by default, only because first Lewis, and then Galloway did not work out.

You're quite right, I think -- I'd forgotten about Lewis. Although Gaffney and Washington left, it would have been quite possible to re-sign them for reasonable money. The thought seems to have been that their replacements would strengthen the position. Which (as with the Tight End shuffle) didn't turn out to be the case.

 

[mgteich]

I think that you were vocal at the time in wanting to keep Larsen over Ohrnberger.

Agreed, he's one I wish we could have back right now.

 

[patchick]

I think that you were vocal at the time in wanting to keep Larsen over Ohrnberger.

I did wish they'd found a way to keep Larsen -- but IIRC they cut Ohrnberger at the same time. I guess it came down to Larsen vs. Wendell?

 

[jmt57]

I did wish they'd found a way to keep Larsen -- but IIRC they cut Ohrnberger at the same time. I guess it came down to Larsen vs. Wendell?

If I'm not mistaken there were one of two roster spots that could have gone to Larsen at the time of the final cuts besides the one that went to Wendell. One went to Nick Kaczur, who had just had back surgery and would end up going on IR without ever playing a single down for the Pats in 2010. Another went to Steve Maneri, who was claimed off waivers and then a couple weeks later was cut/ signed to the practice squad. Granted Maneri was/is a tackle and not an interior lineman, but regardless neither of those two offensive linemen were on the roster by October 1.

 

[captain stone]

I think that you were vocal at the time in wanting to keep Larsen over Ohrnberger.

She wasn't the only one.

 

[unoriginal]

Hard as it is to believe, the Patriots once had a logjam at inside linebacker, and Brandon Moore washed off the practice squad to the 49ers in 2002 because of it. Led them in tackles in 2006.