Are you content with being a Colts fan?

[Deus Irae]

I don't agree with this comparison at all. While the Pats' early exits the past few years have sucked and the regular season accolades given to Brady are hollow compared to winning the Super Bowl. The awards are justly deserved and there is no reason whatsoever why fans shouldn't be able to enjoy them and be happy for Brady....

How is your post any different than that of an early 2000s Colts fan?

 

[letekro]

Enjoying regular season accomplishments from your QB that gain no merit by years end? In Indy they would of loved this season(OPOTY, MVP) reguardless of it's monumental failure. Give me rings and Trent Dilfur for all I care.

If you can't see that praising a player for a phenomenal season and being disappointed because the team didn't win it all are not mutually exclusive, then I would suggest that your bitterness is clouding your judgment.

 

[Rob0729]

You may be right, but I've seen absolutely none of this. I've not even one poster who seemed to do this, although I admit that I've not exactly tallied results on it or anything. The same people who questioned early, questioned late and were bashed for it. Now, there are those who's moods swing in the breeze, but they don't really fall into either the group I'm talking about or the group you're talking about.

Maybe you weren't here after the week after the loss. There were dozens of threads complaining about everything as if the team went 2-14 rather than 14-2.

We can now safely say that it's a pattern. This team needs to become more than just Brady v. the world.

Two years isn't much of a pattern especially with a young team. If yearly patterns held to form, the Jets would never have gotten to the AFC Championship game two years in a row and Manning would never have won a Super Bowl or gone to another or beaten the the Pats.

This was a young team playing who overachieved in the regular season going against a team that considered it to be their biggest game in franchise history other than their one Super Bowl win. The playoff game against Baltimore was far more worrisome because that was the result of a lot of veterans who didn't have the character to overcome adversity (AD, Springs, etc.).

I don't agree with this at all, and neither would anyone who still remembered the first half of the 2000s for what it was. The Patriots weren't just "a legitimate contender". They were the team nobody wanted to play, and were one of, if not THE, team to beat, and for damned good reason. This new group has lost that, partly because BB has made some bad decisions and moves, and partly because of natural attrition. Criticizing people for "biatching" is ridiculous, given how the past 2 seasons have unfolded.

Name the last team that won 4 or more championships over a ten year period. You have to go back over 20 years. There are only four teams in NFL history who have won 4 or more championships over a decade period. That is in 70 years. So expecting the Pats to win Super Bowls year after year is a little ridiculous. Many teams that had a lot of success over a two to four year stretch like this had already fallen apart this far away from that success (The 90s Cowboys and 90s Broncos for example).

I am not satisfied that they went one and done. Actually was pretty upset about it since they should have at least gone to the Super Bowl, but I am a realist who realizes the odds are good that the Pats never win another Super Bowl again with Brady and Belichick even if they put together the best team in the league. The laws of averages are against them.

 

[fair catch fryar]

How is your post any different than that of an early 2000s Colts fan?

Simple. I'm NOT a Colt's fan and am in no way ready to give up on this team's potential to win another SB or two. Go ahead and flame me for feeling this way and call me "homer" I don't give a ****. I've been following this team since the late 70's and always will. I'm just trying to enjoy Brady and BB right now.

 

[TB=TD]

If you can't see that praising a player for a phenomenal season and being disappointed because the team didn't win it all are not mutually exclusive, then I would suggest that your bitterness is clouding your judgment.

The season didn't end after 16 games.

 

[Nikolai]

Be happy for Brady's accomplishments, but lament that the season was lost because of a horrible playoff loss. It's not that hard, people.

 

[Rob0729]

A team that beat every playoff contender in the AFC with an All time great Coach/QB were favorites to win and should of been.

Should, but in the NFL it is far from a guarantee. If you look at Super Bowl winners over the last last five years, three of them are Wild Card teams (Steelers in 05, Giants in 07, and Packers this year). It isn't who is playing best in the regular season, it is who is playing best in the playoffs.

 

[TB=TD]

Should, but in the NFL it is far from a guarantee. If you look at Super Bowl winners over the last last five years, three of them are Wild Card teams (Steelers in 05, Giants in 07, and Packers this year). It isn't who is playing best in the regular season, it is who is playing best in the playoffs.

Brady and Bill are playoff tough but both failed to execute.

 

[letekro]

How is your post any different than that of an early 2000s Colts fan?

I may change my name to Early2000sColtsFan because I don't see anything wrong with recognizing Brady's accomplishments this year. If I understand you correctly, the only time any Patriot should be recognized and the only time a "Pats Fan" can have any joy is when the Patriots win the SB?

 

[Rob0729]

Be happy for Brady's accomplishments, but lament that the season was lost because of a horrible playoff loss. It's not that hard, people.

Agreed. Personally, I don't give a crap about Brady getting the MVP without the Lombardi and haven't really said much about the MVP award since the loss. But this season was one hell of ride. It was far better and fun than I expected and people consider me a homer. I hated the loss in the playoff especially to the Jets, but that doesn't change how I enjoyed the regular season and how I think this team is heading in the right direction for the future.

 

[Deus Irae]

Maybe you weren't here after the week after the loss. There were dozens of threads complaining about everything as if the team went 2-14 rather than 14-2.

Complaint posts after a loss like that are to be expected of any team, as you well know. That's not what you were focusing on, though.

there was even a group who were silenced all season who couldn't wait until the Pats lost to the Jets to tell us how O'Brien sucks or this defense is awful or whatever.

This is what I was referring to.

Two years isn't much of a pattern especially with a young team. If yearly patterns held to form, the Jets would never have gotten to the AFC Championship game two years in a row and Manning would never have won a Super Bowl or gone to another or beaten the the Pats.

This was a young team playing who overachieved in the regular season going against a team that considered it to be their biggest game in franchise history other than their one Super Bowl win. The playoff game against Baltimore was far more worrisome because that was the result of a lot of veterans who didn't have the character to overcome adversity (AD, Springs, etc.).

It's 3 years plus a Super Bowl loss, not 2 years. That's plenty of evidence to call it a pattern.

Name the last team that won 4 or more championships over a ten year period. You have to go back over 20 years. There are only four teams in NFL history who have won 4 or more championships over a decade period. That is in 70 years. So expecting the Pats to win Super Bowls year after year is a little ridiculous. Many teams that had a lot of success over a two to four year stretch like this had already fallen apart this far away from that success (The 90s Cowboys and 90s Broncos for example).

Actually, given that Brady was winning his Super Bowls at a younger age than Montana, and given the "Best coach ever" help of Belichick, it made perfect sense to expect more. What's ridiculous is pretending otherwise.

 

[TB=TD]

I may change my name to Early2000sColtsFan because I don't see anything wrong with recognizing Brady's accomplishments this year. If I understand you correctly, the only time any Patriot should be recognized and the only time a "Pats Fan" can have any joy is when the Patriots win the SB?

That is the only goal, not MVPs or COTY/OPOTY.

 

[signbabybrady]

Enjoying regular season accomplishments from your QB that gain no merit by years end? In Indy they would of loved this season(OPOTY, MVP) reguardless of it's monumental failure. Give me rings and Trent Dilfur for all I care.

I think this sentiment is a little rediculous because the Colt fan mentality was built after constantly losing Note: this was prior to their SB win). By matter of 01,03, and 04 Brady had proved to be a winner and thus looking at his stats and talking about how they effect his overall status as NFL Elite is not the same as the way Colts fans did it with Manning Prior to his winning the big one.

I think there is a huge difference between overhyping someone before they win the big one and using individual numbers to hype them after they have proven to be able to win the big one.

So in the end I dont think we are content with being a Colts fan as I dont think we are acting like they used too.

With an attitude like the one you have why even bother to learn the players names? Basically what I am saying is if you dont care about an individual's accomplishments then why even learn who the individual is. By your logic you should be as big a fan of Huard as Brady I mean they were both QBs for the Patriots when they won SBs and since we can't look at individual accomplishments I have no idea who did more to help the team win.

I dont think there is really much debate which QB was better the 07 version of TB or the 01 version yet one won the SB and the other lost.

 

[Rob0729]

I may change my name to Early2000sColtsFan because I don't see anything wrong with recognizing Brady's accomplishments this year. If I understand you correctly, the only time any Patriot should be recognized and the only time a "Pats Fan" can have any joy is when the Patriots win the SB?

There is nothing wrong with celebrating Brady's accomplishments. What he did in the regular season was record breaking. I don't understand how recognizing Brady had an amazing regular season has anything to do with the playoff loss.

What Colts fans used to do is use the Brady/Manning comparisons as their own sort of personal Super Bowl as if winning that debate was like winning a Super Bowl. Recognizing how amazing Brady's regular season was is nothing like that.

 

[Deus Irae]

I may change my name to Early2000sColtsFan because I don't see anything wrong with recognizing Brady's accomplishments this year. If I understand you correctly, the only time any Patriot should be recognized and the only time a "Pats Fan" can have any joy is when the Patriots win the SB?

That's not what's meant, and you know it. You can try flipping this around on someone else. I'm not going to play that game. It's one thing to say "Brady had a nice season." It's another thing to gripe about fans and posters for saying the same types of things that Brady said when he won the MVP. From PFT

“It’s a great award,” Brady said. “I think playing in a Super Bowl is the greatest thing a quarterback can be doing at this time of year.”

“You don’t ever get over the losses. I haven’t got over the loss to the Broncos in 2006,” Brady said. “They stick with you forever.”

Brady then listed all of the Patriots’ memorable postseason defeats from recent years, including to the Colts in the AFC Championship and the Giants in the Super Bowl.

After great team success early in his career, individual honors don’t seem like much consolation to Brady these days.

Tom Brady wins MVP by unanimous vote | ProFootballTalk

You follow the Colts way if you choose. I'll side with Brady on this one. The individual awards are great, but they aren't the focus.




Just as a side note: What Brady did was tremendous. It was without precedent. And, in the end, it was wasted. People pointing out either side is great, as long as they aren't trying to make it the end all.

 

[Deus Irae]

...What Colts fans used to do is use the Brady/Manning comparisons as their own sort of personal Super Bowl as if winning that debate was like winning a Super Bowl. Recognizing how amazing Brady's regular season was is nothing like that.

What the hell do you think the fans we're talking about here have been doing? It's Brady v. Manning and Patriots v. Jets/Colts. Hell, Fair Catch Fryar gave us a perfect example of that in this very thread:

Besides, the Pats and Colts are heading in opposite directions regarding which teams appear to be getting better and ready to make another run at the Lombardi Trophy.

It's the same pathetic syndrome.

 

[letekro]

The season didn't end after 16 games.

Well, Let's include the playoff game then:

14-3

4,199 yds

38 Tds

5 Ints

Still, far and away the best player in the league this year. I know it seems meaningless without the ultimate prize, but try to have some perspective---Brady's season (even including the Jets game) was ridiculously good.

 

[TB=TD]

I think this sentiment is a little rediculous because the Colt fan mentality was built after constantly losing Note: this was prior to their SB win). By matter of 01,03, and 04 Brady had proved to be a winner and thus looking at his stats and talking about how they effect his overall status as NFL Elite is not the same as the way Colts fans did it with Manning Prior to his winning the big one.

Right now the Patriots are constantly losing every time they enter the playoffs.

I think there is a huge difference between overhyping someone before they win the big one and using individual numbers to hype them after they have proven to be able to win the big one.

This isn't about hype it's about results not past accolades.

So in the end I dont think we are content with being a Colts fan as I dont think we are acting like they used too.

With an attitude like the one you have why even bother to learn the players names? Basically what I am saying is if you dont care about an individual's accomplishments then why even learn who the individual is. By your logic you should be as big a fan of Huard as Brady I mean they were both QBs for the Patriots when they won SBs and since we can't look at individual accomplishments I have no idea who did more to help the team win.

I dont think there is really much debate which QB was better the 07 version of TB or the 01 version yet one won the SB and the other lost.

It is a team game individuals mean nothing.

 

[TB=TD]

Well, Let's include the playoff game then:

14-3

4,199 yds

38 Tds

5 Ints

Still, far and away the best player in the league this year. I know it seems meaningless without the ultimate prize, but try to have some perspective---Brady's season (even including the Jets game) was ridiculously good.

Past accomplishments don't hold up in this debate.

 

[Rob0729]

Complaint posts after a loss like that are to be expected of any team, as you well know. That's not what you were focusing on, though.

It is what a month after the loss. We went through about 2-3 weeks of biatching.

It's 3 years plus a Super Bowl loss, not 2 years. That's plenty of evidence to call it a pattern.

So you are saying that there are 27 other teams who are even more pathetic than the Patriots? You do realize that only four teams in that timeframe have actually won a Super Bowl and one of those years Brady missed the entire season and the Pats in that year were the first team in like 20 years to not get into the playoffs with an 11 win season?

Actually, given that Brady was winning his Super Bowls at a younger age than Montana, and given the "Best coach ever" help of Belichick, it made perfect sense to expect more. What's ridiculous is pretending otherwise.

And the Pats could win more. To expect more is one thing. To think the odds are very good that it was going to happen is another. Unless you thought players like Harrison, Bruschi, Vrabel, McGinest, etc. were going to play like guys in the mid to late 20s forever.

Sorry, but the fact the Pats are still legitimate Super Bowl contenders right now is nothing short of amazing. The Pats could have won the Super Bowl in the 2007 if not for any one of three different plays on the Giants last drive (which just goes to show how the margin for error is so small in the NFL).

The reality is the Pats were very lucky to win the three in four years. If it wasn't for the tuck rule, they wouldn't have even gotten very close in the 2001 season. Winning Super Bowls are never a given.

If you expected it was a given that the Pats would have won their fourth Super Bowl by now, you have only yourself to blame for your disapointment. There is no guarantees in football.