ProFootball Weekly: There is still a decent chance Mankins plays this year

[Rob0729]

From their whispers column:

The ship has not sailed on OG Logan Mankins playing for the team this year, we hear. Although Mankins is stubborn and the team and his representatives have not had any serious negotiations since May, there is this to consider: Mankins is a football player. And, we hear, the bottom line is that he's not likely to give up $3.27 million this season by choosing not to play this season when all is said and done. So far, the team's lead negotiator in this case has been Floyd Reese, but it's possible that Bill Belichick could act as a closer and get involved late in the process of trying to get Mankins back with the team. Mankins' presence becomes an even greater priority with the report that his potential replacement, Nick Kaczur, may miss the entire season after undergoing back surgery.

Also from their whispers:

The Patriots could have several tough roster decisions. One team observer thinks FS James Sanders and RB BenJarvus Green-Ellis might be squeezed out in a roster crunch but could offer minimal trade value in return from a needy club.

ProFootballWeekly.com - Bowe's play encourages passing-challenged Chiefs

 

[JackBauer]

Re: Profootball Weekly: There is still a decent chance Mankins plays this year

Interesting stuff.

Though I'm not sure why they'd cut Sanders over McGowan, if $$ isn't a factor.

 

[DaBruinz]

Re: Profootball Weekly: There is still a decent chance Mankins plays this year

I don't think they'd cut Sanders at all. A trade is more likely.. And the Bengals are hurting at Safety with Gibril Wilson going down. But the Cardinals and Rams could also be options. The only problem is that trading Sanders really hurts the depth at Safety as McGowan proved to wear down last year.

 

[BradyManny]

Re: Profootball Weekly: There is still a decent chance Mankins plays this year

I don't think I'd be big on a Sanders trade. He's a rather ordinary player, and undeniably now an overpaid player, but he has value to us. This team uses 3 safeties a fair amount, and you need depth at that position to do that.

Mankins and his agent would have to be morons to walk away this season with $0. Next season may be a wash, so he'd be going two years without a paycheck. That's not smart. Of course, I think Mankins and his agent have both shown themselves to be pretty amateurish at this so far, so nothing would surprise me.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Re: Profootball Weekly: There is still a decent chance Mankins plays this year

What does "we hear" mean?

Anyhow, were the Pats to reopen the door, changing the negotiator is usually a good move, not that Reese isn't the right guy to have been doing the negotiations, but when you're stalled at an ongoing impass with neither party offering a new deal, something else then needs to change. I've never been against the Pats maning up and offering the olive branch even though Logan did the bad mothing. BFD. The fence mending will be done in private. However, I'm not optimistic about a settlement since I believe that the Pats have changed their thinking and would not be as $ generous as their final 'best' offer. Perhaps a one year deal at some nice number of millions where Logan has the option to become a UFA or to collect a 2011 contract/ bonus should he be hurt this season. What do I know?

 

[BradyManny]

Re: Profootball Weekly: There is still a decent chance Mankins plays this year

Perhaps a one year deal at some nice number of millions where Logan has the option to become a UFA or to collect a 2011 contract/ bonus should he be hurt this season. What do I know?

I think that's the way to go, minus the bonus for getting hurt. I don't think that's ever a good idea - an incentive for failure to play. Besides, given how insincere Mankins and his agent have seemed thus far in their dealings, I wouldn't trust him with that kind of incentive. What's to stop him from faking/exaggerating an injury?

But in general, I think giving him a raise for this year seems like the fair thing for both parties involved.

 

[mgteich]

Re: Profootball Weekly: There is still a decent chance Mankins plays this year

HOW GOOD IS THE ANALYSIS?
It starts by saying that Mankins is passing up $3.27M which is the tender that was the tender amount before the team's reduction.

 

[RayClay]

Re: Profootball Weekly: There is still a decent chance Mankins plays this year

What does "we hear" mean?

We made it up.

 

[Patspsycho]

Re: Profootball Weekly: There is still a decent chance Mankins plays this year

HOW GOOD IS THE ANALYSIS?
It starts by saying that Mankins is passing up $3.27M which is the tender that was the tender amount before the team's reduction.

That's right. He is not going to make that amount, only the reduced tender of $1.54 million.

 

[PatsWickedPissah]

Re: Profootball Weekly: There is still a decent chance Mankins plays this year

I think that's the way to go, minus the bonus for getting hurt. I don't think that's ever a good idea - an incentive for failure to play. Besides, given how insincere Mankins and his agent have seemed thus far in their dealings, I wouldn't trust him with that kind of incentive. What's to stop him from faking an injury?

What's to stop anyone? Doctors. And the fact that he'd opt for FA instead of staying on the 2011 Pats roster for $5M bonus or whatever.

The point being and I'm not married to it, that a guy signing a one year contract risks his entire CAREER should he get injured that one season. Need to offset that risk by a roster bonus due next March. I'm an uninformed amateur here. The Pats would know what they could do legally and in reality.

 

[BradyManny]

Re: Profootball Weekly: There is still a decent chance Mankins plays this year

What's to stop anyone? Doctors. And the fact that he'd opt for FA instead of staying on the 2011 Pats roster for $5M bonus or whatever.

The point being and I'm not married to it, that a guy signing a one year contract risks his entire CAREER should he get injured that one season. Need to offset that risk by a roster bonus due next March. I'm an uninformed amateur here. The Pats would know what they could do legally and in reality.

True, but the doctors issue can get tricky. We often see little spats between team doctors and a player's doctor (coughs, Jacoby Ellsbury...) So I think its a slippery slope. I see your point in general though, and agree with what your saying re: a 1 year deal.

As for risking an entire career, and I'm also an uninformed amateur here, but don't these guys have their bodies insured in the event they have a career-threatening injury?

 

[Rob0729]

Re: Profootball Weekly: There is still a decent chance Mankins plays this year

HOW GOOD IS THE ANALYSIS?
It starts by saying that Mankins is passing up $3.27M which is the tender that was the tender amount before the team's reduction.

Well, the assumption is that Mankins would make the Pats give him his original tender to return. I seriously doubt Mankins would return for less than the original tender and I doubt the Pats would refuse to pay it as a condition to get Mankins to return as long as he returned before the season.

 

[stinkypete]

Re: Profootball Weekly: There is still a decent chance Mankins plays this year

I don't see how it benifits Mankins at all to sit out the season. He loses out on a few million, possibly falls out of shape, and there's the looming specter of a 2011 lockout. There are simply too many reasons for him to play.

In a different time, one with a salary cap and labor certainty, I would think a trade to be very likely. But with teams penny pinching and nobody having any clue what the labor situation looks like beyond this season, I think a trade for any kind of value to be very unlikely.

In this case, does Mankins have a choice but to play? This looks like Asante Samuel to me. Sit out camp, preseason, talk a big game, but eventually report and bolt for the big free agency $$$, if there even is free agency in 2011.

Sanders? I don't think he gets cut or traded. Belichick has commented repeatedly about Sanders' role as a veteran stabilizer in the secondary. He's a very good backup who can fill in a dime role if one of the corners gets hurt.

 

[crowell33]

Re: Profootball Weekly: There is still a decent chance Mankins plays this year

HOW GOOD IS THE ANALYSIS?
It starts by saying that Mankins is passing up $3.27M which is the tender that was the tender amount before the team's reduction.

$3.27 million is still the amount that Mankins will have lost by deciding to not play football this year. I think that is what the author meant. Yes, now that number is down to $1.54, and two weeks from now that number gets lower every single week.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Re: Profootball Weekly: There is still a decent chance Mankins plays this year

I have no confidence in McGowan, really, so I definitely wouldn't want to see Sanders traded. Nor do I think he'll be traded; I think that this is something that makes sense to the media, so now it's taken on a life of its own.

 

[BradyManny]

Re: Profootball Weekly: There is still a decent chance Mankins plays this year

I have no confidence in McGowan, really, so I definitely wouldn't want to see Sanders traded. Nor do I think he'll be traded; I think that this is something that makes sense to the media, so now it's taken on a life of its own.

Agreed.

In a season without a cap, does overpaying your #3 safety really matter all that much?

Sanders is still a steady player who helped right the ship in the secondary at the end of the last year. He's not a playmaker, he's not a star, but he has value to us.

 

[BTTA]

Re: Profootball Weekly: There is still a decent chance Mankins plays this year

What Mankins is risking is amazing to me. Is he married? Thinking about it? Have a mother?

Given the economic uncertainty all of us face, and the uncertainty of the next few years of the NFL, and the uncertainty of his profession in terms of health, why in the world would a player give away millions of dollars, regardless of how pissed off he is?

How self absorbed does a person have to be to walk away from being able to secure a financial future for dozens of his children and grandchildren and other family members just because he's pissed off at his employer about something?

"yes, sweetheart, I know you would have been able to send my grandchild to a good college, but I had to hold my principles that that daggum Mr. Kraft! Don't you see why that's more important than Harvard vs. a community college?"

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Re: Profootball Weekly: There is still a decent chance Mankins plays this year

True, but the doctors issue can get tricky. We often see little spats between team doctors and a player's doctor (coughs, Jacoby Ellsbury...) So I think its a slippery slope. I see your point in general though, and agree with what your saying re: a 1 year deal.

As for risking an entire career, and I'm also an uninformed amateur here, but don't these guys have their bodies insured in the event they have a career-threatening injury?

Their isn't an option of insuring in the event of a career threatening injury, just a career ending one. And even then not only is the cost prohibitive but the odds of prevailing in a claim are debatable given the variables involved in determining just what ended the career and did it have to end it or is it just prefereable to end it... So many injuries are recoverable these days provided the player is committed to recovery.

I'm sure the deal Mankins was offered contained double digit guarantees. Probably less than the $19M Evans got (and the $20M Wilfolk received) but likely in the $17M range (or roughly half the total deal value). So padding a one year offer doesn't really make sense given his mindset. His real issue seems to be average, and I don't see the team budging on AAV to the tune of a million a year... Using the RFA year indicated to me they didn't really feel he was a $7M+ value player. It became a matter of creating something that each side could put positive spin on. His 5/$35M new money spin for him and a lesser 6 year AAV for the team. He unfortunately had convinced himself he was in line for something else - and exponentially better - altogether. That they never countered the initial offer also hints that they were likely told this was a first best offer that the team didn't anticipate a lot of haggling over, particularly where the broad, overall parameters were concerned.

I still think he shows up at some point. Whether it's week one or week ten is anyone's guess. Otherwise while a lockout would be bad news for him a union decertification to avoid one could be worse news since the owners would likely retain 6 year FA under that scenario.

I don't think PFW has any insight because they've been out of the loop in Foxboro for the last several seasons. Those whispers they tend to pick up on are usually the regurgitated mutterings of other mediots usually well after they were muttered.

 

[SanAngeloState]

Re: Profootball Weekly: There is still a decent chance Mankins plays this year

I don't think he's going to risk what he thinks is a 30M contract with half guaranteed for 1.8M this year or whatever he's going to get. They'd have to up the amount to make it worth his while.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Re: Profootball Weekly: There is still a decent chance Mankins plays this year

Not sure who PFW's sources are but Ian Rappaport seems to have found some others with just the opposite view. Mankins is an odd duck to say the least. Someone to whom money matters so much it...doesn't matter... And frugal as he may be, his uncles (Sam and the state of California) likely took close to half of the $7M he's earned to date leaving him with about 1/10th of what he appears set on walking away from on principle banked. So I guess it then comes down to does football (and playing it) matter to Logan. Maybe he's had enough of that, too. Money aside, most players struggle to walk away from the game. If he doesn't it's just one more reason why they won't extend any further for him here.

Beyond that, what he has to also be prepared to shrug off is it's likely an organization that has some principles of it's own won't let him off the hook if he still has significant value when he is ready to come back. If he chooses to stay away all season he runs the risk that when the league plays again sometime in 2011 or in 2012, with either the franchise tag or 6 year FA rule or possibly both still in tact if the union chooses to decertify to avoid a lockout, the team still remains determined to squat on his rights until they receive something of value from some other organization who by then will likely be willing to pay him little more if not less than he's already thumbed his nose at.

Friends: Don’t count on Logan Mankins - BostonHerald.com