Outlook on Mankins Not Promising

[PatsFans.com Article]

Ian's Daily Blog - Ian Rapoport of the Boston Herald has a blog entry this morning regarding the unsettled situation between the Patriots and guard Logan Mankins.* According to the report Mankins’ agent, Frank Baur, claims that since the incident there has been “zero” communication between the two sides. “I think any time the door opens, a deal can [...]

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[patfanken]

actually I find this article to be quite encouraging. Where as before it was presented that the Mankins camp had made the irrevocable decision to leave the Pats. Now the agent is saying that although there has been no contact between the two parties, something might be done when they do start to talk.

Its not much, but the way I read between the lines, it would seem to me that Mankins has made the first move toward coming to some accommodation. Now its up to the Pats to come to the table with an offer.

 

[Reckedtrek]

actually I find this article to be quite encouraging. Where as before it was presented that the Mankins camp had made the irrevocable decision to leave the Pats. Now the agent is saying that although there has been no contact between the two parties, something might be done when they do start to talk.

Its not much, but the way I read between the lines, it would seem to me that Mankins has made the first move toward coming to some accommodation. Now its up to the Pats to come to the table with an offer.

The Pats already made an offer. Instead of Mankins throwing a sh*t fit over it, hopefully he makes a counter offer and the two can work together. If he had done that before, they may already have a deal in place by now.

I really hope they can work out a deal that keeps everybody in place- Mankins and Light at LT- with Vollmer at LT next year keeps Brady upright and healthy for a lot more seasons!

 

[Metaphors]

The Pats already made an offer. Instead of Mankins throwing a sh*t fit over it, hopefully he makes a counter offer and the two can work together. If he had done that before, they may already have a deal in place by now.

He wants 8M, they offered 6.5M. Settle on 7M and adjust the guaranteed money and incentives to sweeten the deal. Not that hard.

 

[Criptonite]

actually I find this article to be quite encouraging. Where as before it was presented that the Mankins camp had made the irrevocable decision to leave the Pats. Now the agent is saying that although there has been no contact between the two parties, something might be done when they do start to talk.

Its not much, but the way I read between the lines, it would seem to me that Mankins has made the first move toward coming to some accommodation. Now its up to the Pats to come to the table with an offer.

I agree. It looks like coming to an agreement may be a possibility now. It sounded like there was no chance of it before this article came out. After that big outburst by Mankins there's been complete silence. Maybe he now realizes he was out of line. He made it perfectly clear he would not play for the Patriots again. This article indicates that they no longer feel that way.

 

[BradyManny]

He wants 8M, they offered 6.5M. Settle on 7M and adjust the guaranteed money and incentives to sweeten the deal. Not that hard.

True.

Frankly, I don't think he's worth 7M a year, anyway, so I'm rooting against such a deal occurring. I think the 6.5M deal is a little rich when we have other priorities.

Let's put it this way - we've won Super Bowls with much less heralded guards. We haven't won Super Bowls without Brady, or without a stout DL, or without a group of quality LBs. I do think we have to factor in Scar's ability to coach up players when looking at how much Mankins is worth over a potential replacement.

 

[Reckedtrek]

He wants 8M, they offered 6.5M. Settle on 7M and adjust the guaranteed money and incentives to sweeten the deal. Not that hard.

Yes- exactly! The way things went up in flames, you'd think the Pats offered $2M and he wants $15M. There are things that can be tweaked for the fine tuning. Like you said- Not that hard.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

For a guy with a client so intensely principled (aka so mad he can't see straight), his agent sounds remarkably pragmatic... Perhaps Logan would be well served to let him handle his business. Not sure at this juncture however if the FO will consider this a first move on the players side absent Logan himself doing a mea culpa to the guy who actually signs the checks and having his agent submit a realistic counter offer. Apparently the good news is team Mankins wants us to know they have no issues with Bill. Which is almost comical given the fact that Bill has total control of football ops, including deciding the limits on what you get paid contractually in relation to the rest of your teamates...What remains to be seen is if team Kraft has lingering issues with the way the player publicly conducted himself. And how he intends to conduct himself going forward.

 

[jmt57]

I agree with the others that if anything Bauer's comments make it seem that there is some hope of a deal happening; if nothing else it would appear to be more likely than I would have that it would be a month ago. That's not to say it will happen or is likely to happen; just saying it appears he may be willing to compromise whereas a month ago it appeared there was zero chance of that happening.

Rapoport seems to focus more on the 'zero communication' and 'we're principled guys' portion of Bauer's comments. I'd prefer to focus on the following portion of the comments: “I think any time the door opens, a deal can get done,” Bauer said. “Look, I’m good friends with Bill (Belichick), I know Bob Kraft real well. But (labor) circumstances came out and turned everything sideways. … But you never know who is going to pick up a phone and say, ‘We need to get this thing done."

One other thing: when Bauer says "if everyone is making $8 million, I’m making $8 million”, was that a reference to Evans' contract, or just a coincidence that he used that number?

 

[mgteich]

Teams that require public apologies for outbursts from players not even under contract before they make saound business decisions are called "losers".

I think that it is ludicrous to think that "Not sure at this juncture however if the FO consider this a first move on the players side absent Logan himself doing a mea culpa to the guy who actually signs the checks and having his agent submit a realistic counter offer." Also, it is nice that you think that Mankins should "handle his business". That's what agents are for.

Apparently you know much more about negotiation strategy than either the FO or the player and his agent.

The bottom line is that team made an offer that it probably knew the player would not accept. The player considered it a non-starter, that is an offer that was not worthy of a response. I have no criticism for either party. They each have different priorities, as they should.
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BOTTOM LINE

Many here don't think Mankins is worth what the patriots offered, never mind more. Also, we have NO IDEA regarding the guaranteed money in the patriot offer. Finally, it is still over a month until any of this matters much. After all, the patriots have several guards who need the practice time.

For a guy with a client so intensely principled (aka so mad he can't see straight), his agent sounds remarkably pragmatic... Perhaps Logan would be well served to let him handle his business. Not sure at this juncture however if the FO will consider this a first move on the players side absent Logan himself doing a mea culpa to the guy who actually signs the checks and having his agent submit a realistic counter offer. Apparently the good news is team Mankins wants us to know they have no issues with Bill. Which is almost comical given the fact that Bill has total control of football ops, including deciding the limits on what you get paid contractually in relation to the rest of your teamates...What remains to be seen is if team Kraft has lingering issues with the way the player publicly conducted himself. And how he intends to conduct himself going forward.

 

[Rob0729]

He wants 8M, they offered 6.5M. Settle on 7M and adjust the guaranteed money and incentives to sweeten the deal. Not that hard.

According to Tom E Curran, they already had offered him $7 million a year. From his article yesterday:

The question then becomes, how far is Mankins willing to push this? His agent Frank Bauer told the Boston Herald on Thursday, "Logan's pretty, pretty, pretty upset over this whole thing. I'll tell you one thing, I'm old school; he's old school. We're two highly principled guys. If everyone's making two bucks, I'll make two bucks. If everyone is making $8 million, I'm making $8 million."

The $8 million reference is to the contract signed earlier this offseason by Saints guard Jahri Evans – a seven-year, $56 million deal that reportedly had $12 million guaranteed and $25.7 million in the first three years.

But there's a difference between "everyone," as Bauer states, and one Jahri Evans. League sources told me the Patriots have offered Mankins a deal that pays him about $7 million per season. Solid. No funny money. It's a deal that my source said will make him either the third- or fourth highest-paid guard in the league depending on how you want to view it.

Who'll blink first?

So the Pats seem to have tried to negotiate with Mankins on a good faith effort and Mankins just wants to be the highest or second highest paid guard.

 

[BestQB]

The answer to this is very obvious. Let him go out and find what his true worth is, not what some team might be whispering in his agent's ear. If the Pats can live with it, they match it. If they can't, they try and trade him.

I'm assuming this has happened already and Mankins and his agent didn't like what was out there. Thus, they come back with a somewhat more conciliatory tone.

I think he realizes that his best opportunity for the salary that he's looking for is in New England unless a guard on a Super Bowl caliber team goes down. This, I'm guessing, is the reason he's open to coming back to the Patriots.

 

[cstjohn17]

Ian's Daily Blog - Ian Rapoport of the Boston Herald has a blog entry this morning regarding the unsettled situation between the Patriots and guard Logan Mankins.* According to the report Mankins’ agent, Frank Baur, claims that since the incident there has been “zero” communication between the two sides. “I think any time the door opens, a deal can [...]

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See you in week 10 Logan,

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Teams that require public apologies for outbursts from players not even under contract before they make saound business decisions are called "losers".

I think that it is ludicrous to think that "Not sure at this juncture however if the FO consider this a first move on the players side absent Logan himself doing a mea culpa to the guy who actually signs the checks and having his agent submit a realistic counter offer." Also, it is nice that you think that Mankins should "handle his business". That's what agents are for.

Apparently you know much more about negotiation strategy than either the FO or the player and his agent.

The bottom line is that team made an offer that it probably knew the player would not accept. The player considered it a non-starter, that is an offer that was not worthy of a response. I have no criticism for either party. They each have different priorities, as they should.
=======================================
BOTTOM LINE

Many here don't think Mankins is worth what the patriots offered, never mind more. Also, we have NO IDEA regarding the guaranteed money in the patriot offer. Finally, it is still over a month until any of this matters much. After all, the patriots have several guards who need the practice time.

Reading comprehension is a lost art, particularly when you have a pre existing agenda.

I never said anything about a "public" apology. I feel an apology is in order any time you personally attack someones character, whether under contract to him or not, if you still expect him to pay you. And I suggested he let his pragmatic agent handle his business.

 

[Rob0729]

The answer to this is very obvious. Let him go out and find what his true worth is, not what some team might be whispering in his agent's ear. If the Pats can live with it, they match it. If they can't, they try and trade him.

I'm assuming this has happened already and Mankins and his agent didn't like what was out there. Thus, they come back with a somewhat more conciliatory tone.

I think he realizes that his best opportunity for the salary that he's looking for is in New England unless a guard on a Super Bowl caliber team goes down. This, I'm guessing, is the reason he's open to coming back to the Patriots.

Sure, let him do a Deion Branch so the Jets can offer him a bogus offer of $10 million a year just to screw with the Pats. Then the Pats refuse to trade him and Mankins files a greivance where the league will then force the Pats to trade Mankins rather than allowing the arbitrator to set a presidence. Already saw this movie, didn't like the way it ended. Don't want to see the sequel

 

[MoLewisrocks]

The bottom line is that team made an offer that it probably knew the player would not accept. The player considered it a non-starter, that is an offer that was not worthy of a response. I have no criticism for either party. They each have different priorities, as they should.
=======================================
BOTTOM LINE

Many here don't think Mankins is worth what the patriots offered, never mind more. Also, we have NO IDEA regarding the guaranteed money in the patriot offer. Finally, it is still over a month until any of this matters much. After all, the patriots have several guards who need the practice time.

Curren seems pretty convinced that his sources debunk your rhetoric. No funny money. 3rd or 4th highest paid at his position depending on how you look at the deal...

What a freakin' insult...

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Sure, let him do a Deion Branch so the Jets can offer him a bogus offer of $10 million a year just to screw with the Pats. Then the Pats refuse to trade him and Mankins files a greivance where the league will then force the Pats to trade Mankins rather than allowing the arbitrator to set a presidence. Already saw this movie, didn't like the way it ended. Don't want to see the sequel

No kidding. What's that saying, if you fail to learn the lessons of history it's bound to repeat itself... Make him play, even only for 6 weeks and the playoffs. How many here wined that had we done that with Deion...Reche Caldwell wouldnt' have cost us an AFCC and a shot to face the mighty Bears for another Lombardi.

Mankins isn't going to hold out once the season starts no matter how old school he is. Risk $7M over a shot at $8M a year later...provided there is a season and or the new cap isn't more restrictive or teams aren't a little leery of you after your essentially lost season...

You never make that money up between what it would have earned for you in the interim and being a year closer to out of the league...

 

[upstater1]

I have to admit I know nothing about Mankins' personal situation, but from afar, I've always wondered how a western valleybound cowboy likes it in New England.

 

[spacecrime]

True.

Frankly, I don't think he's worth 7M a year, anyway, so I'm rooting against such a deal occurring. I think the 6.5M deal is a little rich when we have other priorities.

Let's put it this way - we've won Super Bowls with much less heralded guards. We haven't won Super Bowls without Brady, or without a stout DL, or without a group of quality LBs. I do think we have to factor in Scar's ability to coach up players when looking at how much Mankins is worth over a potential replacement.

This is how I feel, also. Early on, if you had asked me, "Do I want Mankins?" I would have replied, "Of course. Is this a trick question?"

But now, thinking about it, how do I feel about Light-Kaczur-Koppen-Neal-Volmer and $8 million to spend on a RDE or RB or OLB, I say, "HELL YEAH!!!!"

 

[Deus Irae]

So the Pats seem to have tried to negotiate with Mankins on a good faith effort and Mankins just wants to be the highest or second highest paid guard.

Since nobody has the terms of the deal, claims like this are simply guesses.