Reiss: Mankins demands trade, will not sign RFA tender

[BelizePats]

Re: Reiss with bad news on Mankins

So the Pats have offered Mankins about 2 million more per year than the starting LT (Light) makes. I like Mankins but I'm not down with this. If 6.5 million is an insult, then this guy and his agent have lost all sense of reality.

 

[JackBauer]

Re: Reiss with bad news on Mankins

Well, I see Mankins' *****-fit is in full swing.

I'm glad they're not offering him a Jahri Evans-like contract, because Mankins ain't the player Evans is.

 

[Rob0729]

Re: Reiss with bad news on Mankins

I really like Mankins, but his trade value could be worth more than his value. The guards' salaries in this league are out of control. The best guard in the league is still a guard. Still not as important as a LT. He is clearly the Pats' best lineman and there are a lot of question marks on the line, but take another first rounder for the guy if he wants to play games.

I think ultimately this gets resolved at least for the 2010 season. Unfortunately, it looks like it won't end well. If Mankins is looking to be paid as the top guard, I don't blame them. If they are just being stingy, it is a stupid move.

 

[Rob0729]

Re: Reiss with bad news on Mankins

Wow! After reading Reis' article, I kinda sign with the Pats. Mankins is peissed about getting 7 years, $45 million or $6.5 million a year. I only say kinda because it might not be the money, but how the contract is structured.

I thought Jahri Evans got far too much. People on this board argued that Revis shouldn't get Asomugha money because the Raiders grossly overpaid him. I argue the same about Mankins since Evans was grossly overpaid.

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: Reiss with bad news on Mankins

Well, I see Mankins' *****-fit is in full swing.

I'm glad they're not offering him a Jahri Evans-like contract, because Mankins ain't the player Evans is.

Mankins is a top level guard. Assuming for the moment (since it's the info we currently have) that the agent's comment about the 20% lower offer is true, the Patriots are trying to lowball Mankins, comparatively speaking.

 

[stevedogc]

Re: Reiss with bad news on Mankins

look at it this way, any team in the league could have made him an offer and it would have cost them a 1st and 3rd. No one did. I doubt we would get anything close to that in a trade.

 

[cstjohn17]

Re: Reiss with bad news on Mankins

look at it this way, any team in the league could have made him an offer and it would have cost them a 1st and 3rd. No one did. I doubt we would get anything close to that in a trade.

On the bright side this matches my Mankins for Albert Haynesworth trade rumor.

 

[JoeShmoe]

Re: Reiss with bad news on Mankins

Mankins is a top level guard. Assuming for the moment (since it's the info we currently have) that the agent's comment about the 20% lower offer is true, the Patriots are trying to lowball Mankins, comparatively speaking.

Only if you believe that what Evans was paid was sensible for a guard. Which most people (and front offices) do not

This is what happens when teams give players silly money (Asamougha, Haynesworth etc)

 

[Rob0729]

Re: Reiss with bad news on Mankins

BTW, the Titans made Eugene Amano one of the highest paid guards in the league this February and he only got 5 years, $26.25 million with $18.375 over the first three years. Evans screwed the market.

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: Reiss with bad news on Mankins

Only if you believe that what Evans was paid was sensible for a guard. Which most people (and front offices) do not

This is what happens when teams give players silly money (Asamougha, Haynesworth etc)

Whether, or not, Evans was paid something "sensible for a guard" is irrelevant to what I posted.

 

[JackBauer]

Re: Reiss with bad news on Mankins

Mankins is a top level guard. Assuming for the moment (since it's the info we currently have) that the agent's comment about the 20% lower offer is true, the Patriots are trying to lowball Mankins, comparatively speaking.

I agree Mankins is a top-level guard.

I do think that Evans is clearly a better player, and as such am relieved to see the Patriots are not willing to offer him similar money.

There is certainly question as to whether what they've offered is fair or not.

 

[Synovia]

Re: Reiss with bad news on Mankins

I really like Mankins, but his trade value could be worth more than his value. The guards' salaries in this league are out of control. The best guard in the league is still a guard. Still not as important as a LT.

The best Guards don't make nearly what the best LTs make. Good LTs are getting 10+/year.


Also, guard salaries going up indicates that the league doesn't agree with you, and thinks good guards are very important.

 

[signbabybrady]

Re: Reiss with bad news on Mankins

Whether, or not, Evans was paid something "sensible for a guard" is irrelevant to what I posted.

this is what you posted

Mankins is a top level guard. Assuming for the moment (since it's the info we currently have) that the agent's comment about the 20% lower offer is true, the Patriots are trying to lowball Mankins, comparatively speaking.

So let me get this straight what you are saying is that whether or not a deal was sensible is irrevelant to whether or not another team is low balling a player at the same position when compared to said contract????

in your opinion did we low ball Vince?

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Re: Reiss with bad news on Mankins

I don't blame Mankins or any of the other RFA for being pissed or holding out (Revis, Jackson, etc.). They are getting screwed, and whether it is the NFLPA's fault or not they need to take care of themselves.

Just to be clear, Revis is not an RFA.

 

[Sciz]

Re: Reiss with bad news on Mankins

Well in the case of Evans, I read somewhere that guards are much more important to the Saints because Brees is so short for a QB that an inside pass-rush is more effect than against Brady, for example. I don't know the validity of this, but it could help explain why the Saints paid so much for Evans when they didn't need to.

 

[Synovia]

Re: Reiss with bad news on Mankins

I thought Jahri Evans got far too much. People on this board argued that Revis shouldn't get Asomugha money because the Raiders grossly overpaid him. I argue the same about Mankins since Evans was grossly overpaid.

Evans didn't get overpaid. He pretty much got exactly the same money that Steve Hutchinson got 5 years ago. He got less money than Eric Steinbach and Leonard Davis and Jason Brown.

6 years 45m or 7 years 50M is about what a top shelf guard goes for these days.

FOOTBALL OUTSIDERS: Innovative Statistics, Intelligent Analysis | Under the Cap: Top Ten Guards and Centers

 

[Rob0729]

Re: Reiss with bad news on Mankins

The best Guards don't make nearly what the best LTs make. Good LTs are getting 10+/year.


Also, guard salaries going up indicates that the league doesn't agree with you, and thinks good guards are very important.

Does the league not agree with or do the Saints not agree with me? I don't think there are many or any guards making more than what the Pats offered Mankins other than Evans. If the Pats offered to make Mankins the second highest paid guard in the league and he considers it an insult (I don't know if this is true, but I am throwing out the hypothetical), how is this meaning the league disagrees with me. Kinda supports that the league agrees with me. Mankins is one of the best guards in the league, but not THE BEST guard in the league.

 

[ScottieC]

Re: Reiss with bad news on Mankins

Man, I hate this.

Look, he guards Tom Brady - Brady likes him, pay him.

Hell, for that matter, Pay them both now.

This is going to blow up big tonight. Too bad the Celtics don't play tonight.

 

[Rob0729]

Re: Reiss with bad news on Mankins

Evans didn't get overpaid. He pretty much got exactly the same money that Steve Hutchinson got 5 years ago. He got less money than Eric Steinbach and Leonard Davis and Jason Brown.

6 years 45m or 7 years 50M is about what a top shelf guard goes for these days.

FOOTBALL OUTSIDERS: Innovative Statistics, Intelligent Analysis | Under the Cap: Top Ten Guards and Centers

So Evans is the highest paid guard in the league, but there are guards who make more than him? How exactly does that work? Evans gets paid paid $X more than every other guard in the league, but three guards make more?

Hutchinson got a seven year $49 million contract. Which was a million dollars a year less than Evans' contract. Granted it may be higher than what Mankins was offered. But in a seven year deal, it is how it is written and how much money is up front because most players signed to a seven year deal never see the end of the contract. They might stay with the team, but the contract is ripped up or renegotiated at some point.

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: Reiss with bad news on Mankins

this is what you posted


So let me get this straight what you are saying is that whether or not a deal was sensible is irrevelant to whether or not another team is low balling a player at the same position when compared to said contract????

I'm saying that Mankins' agent was using the Evans contract as the comparison, and the purported Patriots' offer of 20% less than said contract would be lowballing in comparison to said contract. Whether the amount is sensible is irrelevant to my post.

Or, to put it another way and remove if from the context of the Patriots, when the next 4-3 DT compares his contract to Haynesworth, the sensibility of Haynesworth's contract will be irrelevant to the comparison. Where it will be relevant will be in comparison to every other contract given out for a 4-3 DT. I hope that clarifies things.

in your opinion did we low ball Vince?

At first? Clearly.

In the end? Vince seems happy and is the highest paid NT in the game. At that point, it's tough to say whether or not he ended up low balled, because there's no longer a player above him to judge by. I'll say that the NT position in general gets the shaft, but Wilfork's pay for the position ended up being generous enough to keep him around and content.