OT: Irsay stirring the pot? "Manning will be the highest paid player in the league"

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

Colts' Jim Irsay: Peyton Manning will be 'highest-paid player in the league' - The Huddle: Football News from the NFL - USATODAY.com

Maybe I am taking this the wrong way,but it seems since Manning and Brady are both entering their Payday all of a sudden Irsay has to proclaim that Peyton will be the highest paid player in the game this offseason.

I think this could stir the pot with the inevitable Kraft and Brady negotiations if Irsay gets totally ridiculous with the cash we can expect him to pay to Peyton who is the best QB in the game today but also to a guy that is nearing his mid 30s to me I don't know if he is worth the highest pay but you know Irsay will find a way to try and make Kraft look cheap and not as dedicated to retaining his franchise player through retirement.

I know Brady gives us the song and dance routine saying everyone in the league is overpaid and he just plays because he loves the game, but you know a high double digit million contract to the only QB who is of his class in today's league could make things interesting in Brady's negotiations.

 

[Rob0729]

Re: Irsay stirring the pot? "Manning will be the highest paid player in the league"

Cmon, you are reading too much into this. Irsay said nothing that stirred the pot in any way and he was basically stating the obvious. Manning has 4 league MVPs and since he signed his last contract, he has been to two Super Bowls and come Sunday could win them both. Obviously, he will be the highest paid player in the league. No player means more to his team the Manning.

Irsay saying that Manning's and Brady's contract situations being intertwined is also stating the obvious. Whoever gets the new deal first will he the basis the other player's agent will try to structure a new deal.

When Brady signed his current contract, Manning and Vick were already making more than what Brady signed for. Brady was willing to take less to stay with the Pats. This time, both QBs are looking at contracts around $20 million a year if they want to push the issue. Whatever Manning does, Brady knows the basic value and will either take a hometown discount or not.

Not everything the Colts say are deliberate swipes at the Pats.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

Re: Irsay stirring the pot? "Manning will be the highest paid player in the league"

Cmon, you are reading too much into this. Irsay said nothing that stirred the pot in any way and he was basically stating the obvious. Manning has 4 league MVPs and since he signed his last contract, he has been to two Super Bowls and come Sunday could win them both. Obviously, he will be the highest paid player in the league. No player means more to his team the Manning.

Irsay saying that Manning's and Brady's contract situations being intertwined is also stating the obvious. Whoever gets the new deal first will he the basis the other player's agent will try to structure a new deal.

When Brady signed his current contract, Manning and Vick were already making more than what Brady signed for. Brady was willing to take less to stay with the Pats. This time, both QBs are looking at contracts around $20 million a year if they want to push the issue. Whatever Manning does, Brady knows the basic value and will either take a hometown discount or not.

Not everything the Colts say are deliberate swipes at the Pats.

However the question lies.... Is or should Brady be in the neighborhood of Manning's contract if they both are in negotiations? - Without a cap issue right now I don't see why he should not be paid as much as Peyton.

 

[Patspsycho]

Re: Irsay stirring the pot? "Manning will be the highest paid player in the league"

Cmon, you are reading too much into this. Irsay said nothing that stirred the pot in any way and he was basically stating the obvious. Manning has 4 league MVPs and since he signed his last contract, he has been to two Super Bowls and come Sunday could win them both. Obviously, he will be the highest paid player in the league. No player means more to his team the Manning.

Irsay saying that Manning's and Brady's contract situations being intertwined is also stating the obvious. Whoever gets the new deal first will he the basis the other player's agent will try to structure a new deal.

When Brady signed his current contract, Manning and Vick were already making more than what Brady signed for. Brady was willing to take less to stay with the Pats. This time, both QBs are looking at contracts around $20 million a year if they want to push the issue. Whatever Manning does, Brady knows the basic value and will either take a hometown discount or not.

Not everything the Colts say are deliberate swipes at the Pats.

This is why it's important we get Brady's extension done first, so that the Colts can go bankrupt trying to raise the ante on that.

Then we go after Wilfork.

 

[Rob0729]

Re: Irsay stirring the pot? "Manning will be the highest paid player in the league"

However the question lies.... Is or should Brady be in the neighborhood of Manning's contract if they both are in negotiations? - Without a cap issue right now I don't see why he should not be paid as much as Peyton.

They both deserve to be paid around the same amount. Manning's agent is Tom Condon so Peyton probably won't be looking to give any hometown discounts.

Brady has repeately said that he is more concerned about his legacy than being the highest paid player. He has plenty of money. So does Gisele (in 2007, she was the 16th richest woman in entertainment with a net worth of $70 million). So I expect as long as the Pats don't totally lowball him, he will sign a new contract without much fighting for a decent amount less than Manning will.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Re: OT: Irsay stirring the pot? "Manning will be the highest paid player in the leagu

Irsay said that Manning's deal is easy compared to trying to keep his mid-level players, and he wants to have a balanced deal that will allow him to keep a strong supporting cast.

"You have to be able to keep the (Pierre) Garcons and (Austin) Collies," he said. "They're going to be coming up."

Jim isn't the sharpest tool in the drawer, which is why he has Polian. The last time he signed Peyton to a contract that made him the highest paid player in the league, he relied on the salary cap growth to accommodate it. Almost didn't happen when the CBA almost unraveled in 2006. Now, with the liklihood of a tighter cap (and potentially one rolled back to 2008 levels out of the gate to boot) in any new CBA and with the investments they have made in their defense, good luck on navigating this minefield... But he is right that the top deal on any team is always the easiest one to settle on parameters of, and that should always be your QB or what's the point...

Brady will likely be extended at something in excess of the second tier deals that recently got done and where Peyton lands, with somewhat less guaranteed money/signing bonus and probably a much different structure although he may take home almost as much as Peyton over the first x number of years depending on whose spinning it... That's the way it went last time, too, when Irsay had to sell his personal memorabelia collection to help fund Peyton's $34.5M signing bonus. Brady took $26.5 and allowed the team to split his bonus into signing ($14.5M) and option ($12M)bonuses paid over the first two seasons so they could spread it better and also so they could have a few bucks left each season for other guys bonuses...He didn't require the phony backloaded salaries to fluff his deal, which he may presently be regretting...

Dont' be shocked if both get 7 or more year deals so that the cap hits can be spread/managed via restructure if necessary and they don't get caught potentially tagging them at 39... The goal in most deals is to be able to walk away from a guy approaching his final season, but in the case of HOF QB's it's not heartbreaking to have to pay a little in parting if you had them productive and happy for 90% of the term of the deal... You're likely not going to be a ton at the position for some time after they leave.

I don't honestly anticipate $18-20M per for Manning. He's entering his mid 30's and this will be his to retirement deal. $15M is presently the high water mark, and there may not be much exponential movement above that for a while given the cap situation. What both may get is more guaranteed money than Albert, which is only fair since they are a far better bet to deliver long enough to fully amortize it... Brady can't give the max discount every contract because that undercuts his position with his teamates and union peers, but he won't squeeze the FO for his own reasons.

Brady is really wired a little differently than most of his peers. I remember in 2003 or 04 when he wasn't named to the pro bowl and Felger tried to get a rise out of him over it he told him off the record (which is one reason Felger no longer has access, indiscretion) he didn't give a F about pro bowls, he was going to the HOF...

 

[BradyFTW!]

Re: OT: Irsay stirring the pot? "Manning will be the highest paid player in the leagu

This has nothing to do with Tom Brady's contract- it's just the Colts acknowledging what everyone already knew- that Manning is going to make a ton of money on his next contract. So should Brady.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

Re: OT: Irsay stirring the pot? "Manning will be the highest paid player in the leagu

This is all nothing but heIRSAY *lolzzzzzzzzzzzzz*

 

[Joker]

Re: OT: Irsay stirring the pot? "Manning will be the highest paid player in the leagu

uh..if THAT is comedy..well...don't quit your day job...

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Re: OT: Irsay stirring the pot? "Manning will be the highest paid player in the leagu

Dont' be shocked if both get 7 or more year deals so that the cap hits can be spread/managed via restructure if necessary

The most recent CBA specifically prevents such workarounds (bonuses could not be prorated more than six years, or five years in the final capped year).

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Re: OT: Irsay stirring the pot? "Manning will be the highest paid player in the leagu

The most recent CBA specifically prevents such workarounds (bonuses could not be prorated more than six years, or five years in the final capped year).

Manning's last deal was for 9 years that voided to 7. It allowed Polian over time to spread the cap hits on the roster bonuses sprinkled throughout Peyton's deal in years 3,4,5. Some of that amortization is sitting in the voided years, so they will have to deal with that still impacting their cap going forward. The rules of an expiring CBA in 2006 precluded Polian from converting that final roster bonus and he was berserk. However, once the new deal was entered into he was again able to because all the restrictions evaporated.

The Patriots did more of a straight line deal with Tom, I think because they preferred to pay as you go with the cap exploding, although they restructured a couple of times when they still needed room which is why he even has minimal dead cap now at the end of that deal. I think they did that intending on extending him in 2008. But nothing got done after the owners pulled the plug on the CBA, not to mention the plug got pulled on Brady's season. This time around knowing that the cap may be stunted if not rolled back they may have to plan for some end game dead cap when these two go by extending the deal past initial ability to amortize. Again, it's not likely they will have another QB in place immediately taking up anything approaching even 10% of cap. If they use an option bonus or two or a series of roster bonuses with Brady those will ultimately be treated according to whatever the new amortization rules are in a 2011 CBA. I can't imagine they won't revert to 6, thereby allowing you to use all 7 or more years of any new deal to advantage (at least until we approach at another expiring CBA...).

I could see Brady getting close to $50M guaranteed on a $100M+ total value in his next deal because that just amortizes to $8M per over the life of the deal. HOF QB's as consistent as these two are among the limited number of players who easily warrant committing to that even in their early 30's. If at the end of the deal you find yourself taking a sevearl million dollar dead cap hit, that's not significant as long as you have a replacement in place who isn't (yet) taking up nearly as much cap as his predecessor... As long as you then have the position covered within unit limits you're okey dokey cap wise (at least).

The tough part for this organization is Belichick's belief the QB should not count for more than 10-12% of cap on average and we're presently in the dark as to where the cap may be heading over the next 6-7 seasons. Conservatively estimating it will still reach at least $145M should make the max average for Brady no more than $16M and hopefully closer to $15M based on the assumption that the cap will lie somewhere in the vacinity of $135M at the midpoint of the deal.

7 years, $100M+, $25M signing bonus, $20M option bonus (guaranteed) in year 3, $50M+ over the first 3, $50-60M over the last 4-5 with a voidable 8th season for amortization and fluffing purposes that the 3rd year option bonus picks up. And lots of nice little performance incentives. If he walks away in season 7 or 8 the dead cap is manageable because his replacement will likely be counting in the single digits...

 

[tanked_as_usual]

Re: OT: Irsay stirring the pot? "Manning will be the highest paid player in the leagu

is there not the same kind of concern in signing wilfork long-term to signing brady long term?

for all that brady has done, is it not prudent to look at brady and see what you will get out of him over the next 3,4, or 5 years and pay him based on that rather than winding up with a guy who is on the books for 20M who can no longer do what he used to do?


I mean how much longer does anyone believe brady is going to be effective or even want to play? he is a different player and a different personality than the player who won 3 SB's....or does nobody see that?

are they going to wrap their hands around brady's ankles the way the celtics did for bird and mchale?

just like any other position, is it not wise to be working on your next 'full time QB' at this point? or is everyone thinking that the pats will just find another tom brady in the 6th round in the next year or 2.

 

[JoeSixPat]

Re: Irsay stirring the pot? "Manning will be the highest paid player in the league"

However the question lies.... Is or should Brady be in the neighborhood of Manning's contract if they both are in negotiations? - Without a cap issue right now I don't see why he should not be paid as much as Peyton.

Actually I agree with you... Irsay knows that the Patriots want to get a deal done before Manning, in part because they don't want Manning setting the market, even if Brady as expected takes less than top market value.

Since less money at QB means more money at other positions, anything Irsay can do to drive up Brady's price makes the Patriots weaker.

He'd be a fool not to try this tactic. Whether it works is another matter.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Re: OT: Irsay stirring the pot? "Manning will be the highest paid player in the leagu

is there not the same kind of concern in signing wilfork long-term to signing brady long term?

for all that brady has done, is it not prudent to look at brady and see what you will get out of him over the next 3,4, or 5 years and pay him based on that rather than winding up with a guy who is on the books for 20M who can no longer do what he used to do?


I mean how much longer does anyone believe brady is going to be effective or even want to play? he is a different player and a different personality than the player who won 3 SB's....or does nobody see that?

are they going to wrap their hands around brady's ankles the way the celtics did for bird and mchale?

just like any other position, is it not wise to be working on your next 'full time QB' at this point? or is everyone thinking that the pats will just find another tom brady in the 6th round in the next year or 2.

Big uglies don't last as long as cerebral QB's. And they are far more easily replaced than legitimate franchise QB's let alone HOF'ers. We've won three Superbowls with 3 different NT's.

Aside from the ACL Brady has been as durable as any QB in this generation. He and Manning were #2 and #3 behind the ultimate warrior... Other than the ACL that timing wise cost him a season, he never missed a start in 8 seasons and plays well above average even through injuries.

There is nothing wrong with Brady's attitude or drive. That some here persist in thinking so says more about their psyche than his. He has been as clear as he can be about his intention to continue playing and at a high level for as long as he can and hopefully until he's 40. Cerebral, pure pocket passers like Manning and Brady are better equipped to than guys like gunslingers like Warner and Farve have ever been because they rely more on their brains than their arms or legs. And Warner would have come back for another season had it not been for his growing concern over the effects of multiple concussions that really piled up on his this season. He was clearly worth the $12M+ per Arizona paid him in 2009, as was Favre of the $13M the Vikings paid him, even though in that case the end game was fairly predictable. The Vikings are praying he comes back again because even competent QB's who just give you a chance don't grow on trees, and absent at least that you're season is an exercise in futility out of the gate.

Fans here who don't want to pay Brady what he's worth don't seem to understand that fans, FO's, and ownerships of at least 25 other franchises would kill for the chance to trade places and have stability at the position for several more seasons. There is plenty of time for this team to find and develop a successor, though whether they ever effectively replace Brady or not remains to be seen. They and we would be beyond fortunate if they ever do. Which is why the rush to move beyond him some seem to periodically exhibit would be comical if not so ludicrous.

Be grateful and appreciative of the fact he wants to remain here for several more seasons. Soon enough you will all be pining for the good old days when our QB was arguably sparring from season to season with a handful of past and one present contenders for GOAT. They won't break the bank to end his career here, and he won't ask them to. They will give him a deal they are both comfortable living with, and fans should take their lead from them.

 

[Zeus]

Re: OT: Irsay stirring the pot? "Manning will be the highest paid player in the leagu

Great negotiating tactic by Irsay. Hey Jim, bend over and grab your ankles. I'm sure that Peycheck will be only too happy to oblige.

 

[tanked_as_usual]

Re: OT: Irsay stirring the pot? "Manning will be the highest paid player in the leagu

Big uglies don't last as long as cerebral QB's. And they are far more easily replaced than legitimate franchise QB's let alone HOF'ers. We've won three Superbowls with 3 different NT's.

Aside from the ACL Brady has been as durable as any QB in this generation. He and Manning were #2 and #3 behind the ultimate warrior... Other than the ACL that timing wise cost him a season, he never missed a start in 8 seasons and plays well above average even through injuries.

There is nothing wrong with Brady's attitude or drive. That some here persist in thinking so says more about their psyche than his. He has been as clear as he can be about his intention to continue playing and at a high level for as long as he can and hopefully until he's 40. Cerebral, pure pocket passers like Manning and Brady are better equipped to than guys like gunslingers like Warner and Farve have ever been because they rely more on their brains than their arms or legs. And Warner would have come back for another season had it not been for his growing concern over the effects of multiple concussions that really piled up on his this season. He was clearly worth the $12M+ per Arizona paid him in 2009, as was Favre of the $13M the Vikings paid him, even though in that case the end game was fairly predictable. The Vikings are praying he comes back again because even competent QB's who just give you a chance don't grow on trees, and absent at least that you're season is an exercise in futility out of the gate.

Fans here who don't want to pay Brady what he's worth don't seem to understand that fans, FO's, and ownerships of at least 25 other franchises would kill for the chance to trade places and have stability at the position for several more seasons. There is plenty of time for this team to find and develop a successor, though whether they ever effectively replace Brady or not remains to be seen. They and we would be beyond fortunate if they ever do. Which is why the rush to move beyond him some seem to periodically exhibit would be comical if not so ludicrous.

Be grateful and appreciative of the fact he wants to remain here for several more seasons. Soon enough you will all be pining for the good old days when our QB was arguably sparring from season to season with a handful of past and one present contenders for GOAT. They won't break the bank to end his career here, and he won't ask them to. They will give him a deal they are both comfortable living with, and fans should take their lead from them.

I'll be pining for nothing........I watched the team crash after fairbanks left, I watched the team crash after the 1985 season, and I watched the team 'crash' after parcells left.......and for that fact, I may be already watching the team crashing right now. things happen that way.

do I want brady to be here? hell yes......does he deserve manning money? hell no

 

[Clonamery]

Re: OT: Irsay stirring the pot? "Manning will be the highest paid player in the leagu

I'll be pining for nothing........I watched the team crash after fairbanks left, I watched the team crash after the 1985 season, and I watched the team 'crash' after parcells left.......and for that fact, I may be already watching the team crashing right now. things happen that way.

do I want brady to be here? hell yes......does he deserve manning money? hell no

Tankfully it's not your choice.

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

Re: OT: Irsay stirring the pot? "Manning will be the highest paid player in the leagu

I'll be pining for nothing........I watched the team crash after fairbanks left, I watched the team crash after the 1985 season, and I watched the team 'crash' after parcells left.......and for that fact, I may be already watching the team crashing right now. things happen that way.

do I want brady to be here? hell yes......does he deserve manning money? hell no

Well Brady has not had a player the talent of Reggie Wayne for the past decade and a tight end with the awesomeness of Clark if you want to set a defense for Tom...If Reggie Wayne had been a Patriot and stayed and Clark had been a TE here and also stayed,Brady could have been much closer to Mannings stats the past couple of years.

Problem is the Pats won't pay more than what they think a receiver is worth thus we will likely never see a long term good WR here nor will we see a TE like Clark remain here for years.

It is what it is and I may get flamed for this but the Patriots for the past 5 years have not really helped Brady in his prime by keeping top talent for Brady to throw to year after year (Gaffney,Branch,Givens let go for example) If Brady had top flight receivers and steady ones who were not let go,I am sure both QBs would be neck and neck the past half decade.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

Re: OT: Irsay stirring the pot? "Manning will be the highest paid player in the leagu

I'll be pining for nothing........I watched the team crash after fairbanks left, I watched the team crash after the 1985 season, and I watched the team 'crash' after parcells left.......and for that fact, I may be already watching the team crashing right now. things happen that way.

do I want brady to be here? hell yes......does he deserve manning money? hell no

I wouldn't be so sure he doesn't. While Manning may possibly be ahead of the Brady-Manning debate with a win Sunday, you have to remember the history of the rivalry. It has changed so many times IMO, for example after 2006 the clear consensus was Manning, in 2007 it became Brady, and now it's shifting towards Manning again. One or two years could change everything... Brady needs to be locked up IMO.

 

[SanAngeloState]

Re: OT: Irsay stirring the pot? "Manning will be the highest paid player in the leagu

Much of what has been said is true, but I have a different take on things.

Yes, Manning is much better than Brady. Yes, Brady didn't play as well this year, locked onto receivers, etc. Hopefully that's just injuries and the post ACL etc.

However Indy can AFFORD to pay Manning top $. Why? Because they can fill out their roster with guys off the street and pay them nothing. Their starting OG was living in his parents' basement before playing for the colts!! Contemplate that for a minute. While we're paying huge money to AD Thomas and making FOOLS out of ourselves, Polian is plugging in randoms and WINNING.

We can't afford to pay Brady "Manning money " because we need the money to fill out our roster. Apparently JAG guys can't be coached up here in our scheme to win. We have to hire expensive FAs. And even with Thomas and 3 #1 picks on our defense we get SMOKED.

Polian could literally get a bunch of guys off the waiver wire and field a top notch defense and offense too. Either Manning makes everyone better or our coaching just ISN'T THAT GOOD.