The 2009 Colts and the 2009 Patriots

[Jangles]

I agree that Gracon is a better reciever than Aiken. The point I am attempting to make is that Garcon is better primarily because of better coaching, better playcalling and better schemes.

It isn't coaching when the ball hits you in the hands and you drop it

Aiken is not and will never be a good WR

 

[emoney_33]

Really?

link for proof?

FOOTBALL OUTSIDERS: Innovative Statistics, Intelligent Analysis | Week 17 DVOA Ratings

I know a number of readers disagree with the opponent adjustments that give Brady the season lead in passing value. As I noted in an Extra Points post a couple weeks ago, Brady has played against the hardest schedule of opposing pass defenses of any quarterback in the past 17 years. Six of his games came against the top four pass defenses according to DVOA, with four others against the Ravens (7), Saints (9), and Dolphins (11). Against all of these defenses, except for New Orleans, Brady outplayed most or all of his contemporaries. He had the second and fifth-highest DYAR totals allowed by the Jets this year. He had the highest DYAR total allowed by the Broncos, the highest DYAR total allowed by the Dolphins (in the Week 9 game), and the third-highest DYAR allowed by the Panthers. His 250 DYAR against the Bills in Week 1 was double what any other quarterback did against them for the rest of the season.

 

[Jangles]

FOOTBALL OUTSIDERS: Innovative Statistics, Intelligent Analysis | Week 17 DVOA Ratings

Excellent

thank you

 

[Brady_12]

Somebody seems a little butthurt today

lose money on a game?

Nope, I don't bet. Sorry to disappoint.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

And Edelman broke his arm early in the year.

He also hurt his ankle/foot in the preseason.

 

[Jangles]

Nope, I don't bet. Sorry to disappoint.

Why would it disappoint me that you don't bet?

 

[Brady_12]

Why would it disappoint me that you don't bet?

Somebody seems a little butthurt today

lose money on a game?

You asked the question.

You seem to be fairly active in the forum so I found it hard to believe you could have missed the numerous threads that referenced this fact.

 

[Jangles]

You asked the question.

You seem to be fairly active in the forum so I found it hard to believe you could have missed the numerous threads that referenced this fact.

If these threads popped up last week, I was on vacation

so.......

 

[Brady_12]

If these threads popped up last week, I was on vacation

so.......

It's been a couple of weeks. Anyhow, we've established the fact that you missed the references and I don't bet. Moving on.
so........

 

[BillBelichickFan79]

we were a better team than indy when we played them. now if they had their CB's and bob sanders, i don't know if we would have dominated that game the way that we did.

the fact is, with welker healthy, we went down there and pretty much took it to them all game. maroney doesn't fumble at the freakin one yard line and we undoubtedly win that game.

i think if we had played them in the playoffs, we would have beaten them. they just arent that good of a team IMO.

it makes you wonder how the season would have turned out if not for that soul crushing loss at Indy. I think that loss definitely lingered on throughout the rest of the season. I mean how could it not be in the back of the players' and coaches' minds?

 

[Joker]

all of us will feel much better tomorrow afternoon when the Chargers humiliate, horrify,hound,harrass and hang the rotten stinking green rats by their leathery little rat tails.

 

[HEY BRO! WHAT UP?]

The difference between the Colts and the Patriots is a fast defense with a great pass rush. Having bookends such as Freeney and Mathis will always give you chance. Their defense played a great game tonight.

 

[patsfan-1982]

the colts have that smaller. faster D that runs around and stops the run and there DB's make plays and it helps haveing the two best pass rushers in the NFL


most teams now run a smaller faster D even the 3-4 teams like denver and the steelers and cowboys who have a smaller front that can get aftter the QB


the pats big body defense. works when they have the players to run it but when the pats went with there smaller package this year they looked better they need a top pass rushing OLB that teams have to game plan around. they need a seymour, type at DE. they need a biger ILB to play next to mayo on runing downs. ( and please no more 40 year olds )


they need to pay Leigh Bodden, and bring in Carlos Rogers from washington. that would give the pats two 6ft. corners. that can run. and i would feel a lot better with Darius Butler, at nickel over. Jonathan Wilhite,



as far as the offense. goes payton manning, had special meetings with he's WR's befor the season to learn how they like to catch the ball and how they like to run there routes all brady, did was have hissy fits on the side lines to get he's WR cut. i was never a big fan of the pats signing 37 year. old galloway, but there was no reason to cut him when there was only 3 WR's on the roster and two QB's playing WR and Brandon Tate, should have never played this year.


the pats need to bring in a top WR in FA Kevin Walter, Antonio Bryant, or Terrell Owens, none of them would brake the bank. but all of them would be a big up grade. for the pats.


all the 30 something RB's need to go. they need to draft a big power runer


pay mankins, and up grad the RG and C


if the pats can do all that then they should be a top team again

 

[Deus Irae]

The Colts are 4 deep at WR, have a top pass catching TE and use their backs to catch the ball regardless of what down it is.

 

[Deus Irae]

I agree that Garcon is a better reciever than Aiken. The point I am attempting to make is that Garcon is better primarily because of better coaching, better playcalling and better schemes.

Aiken has been on the Patriots for years, under some of the best coaching in the business. Garcon is better than Aiken because Garcon is better than Aiken.

 

[Disco Volante]

You can't definitively say a QB made his WR when that WR has never played with another NFL QB, thus giving you no previous comparison.

 

[tanked_as_usual]

the pats offense will be better off with a damned offensive coordinator

not sure what BB is trying to prove, but the staff is now void of experience when compared to almost all other teams....even the youngsters (mangini and mcdaniel) are off coaching other teams....does BB have some kind of budget for assistant coaches and gets to keep any $$ he doesn't spend?

 

[RhodyPatriot]

After again watching the colts, I am now convinced that almost our total need is to find playmakers on defense.

COMPARING THE OFFENSES
1) The colts are in no way a running team. Their running backs and running game are no better than ours.
2) Were Collie and Garcon great? Naah! They were better coached. The playcalling and the communication between OC, QB and the receivers is really a level above anything we have. I have no doubt that the colts and their OC would have done fine plugging in Edelman, Aiken, Galloway or Lewis or Nunn for that matter.

COMPARING THE DEFENSES
There are no words.

I'll give you some words - Joe Flacco
Let's see how this average at best Colt defense does against Philip Rivers and the Chargers. The Ravens didn't have a chance (I made that prediction before the game) because they don't have a QB or wideouts that scare anyone. The Patriots made the Ravens look so good because they never showed up to play on O/D or special teams. This dysfunctional Patriot offense with Tom Brady having an offyear put up 34 on the Colts and left lots of points on the field with 2 red zone TO's and horrrendous clock management in the 4th qtr. Let's see what Philip having an MVP year Rivers and his arm can do. In fact you won't have to wait. Watch what Philip Rivers does today against a Jet defense that's much better than the Colts.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

I don't think that the patriots would have been any better off with Garcon and Collie. Now, if we also added their OC, that would be a different story.

But they would have if they came with Wayne. Forget Clark 'cause he'd be a blocker here...but that would be OK too since we have Welker/Edleman...

You don't know what your watching for openers. Totally different offense predicated on Manning's pre snap reads. His WR's aren't asked to make post snap adjustments, just get to a spot on time. Since Harrrison departed with the deep threat the key is quickness. It's a bit like Lombardi's philosophy of running the same plays over and over, just out executing the opposition who knows they're coming. It doesn't work unless Manning has 4 solid receiving options.

Maybe if we added their OL coach our OL wouldn't look like a doormat. Amazingly no one here ever goes there...

Polian assembled this offensive coaching staff a decade ago with Mora at the helm. And if and when they depart he will promote from within. It's all about consistency and execution. Dungy was brought in to build him a cheap and efficient defense. After he left his no name assistant was promoted from within. Amazing they can win without hiring the biggest available names on the market. Even more amazing they lasted in the absence of more than a mere superbowl in Manning's first decade. Polian must know something we don't, like how it's up to players to execute and make plays...

Brady made this OL look more talented than it was for years. He did it with quick release and accuracy and solid if unspectacular receivers he could trust. He doesn't have that luxury any more. Aside from Welker his options are a crap shoot. A deep threat whose more decoy than weapon unless you force him to play underneath like a fish out of water, rookie conversion projects and special teamers...who as midseason replacements are as likely to zig as zag and Brady knows that...

The most glaring thing I notice watching the games this week is just how much having Moss on the field for every freakin' snap has slowed down this offense by comparison and made it painfully predictable. The speed and agility of these receivers makes him look like he's running in cement. They may not go deep but they go all out on every snap. TE's tied up in knots as blockers, Brady desperately waiting to see if anyone not named Welker can get open...knowing if they do the throw has to be perfect because they won't battle for a catch all the while knowing they may also fail to adjust to coverage as anticipated because they are playing out of their element. And knowing while he won't necessarily get sacked often he will invariably get hit. No wonder they pay him the big bucks...

That he got this uncharacteristic 2009 team to 10-6 with Welker out for 3 games and while playing much of the season nursing broken ribs and a broken finger on his throwing hand is just testamant to what a tough minded SOB he truly is. He deserves better committment from management and his teamates. Not to mention an irrational fan base.

 

[condon84]

Take a look at the common opponent breakdown. Brady > Manning in 2009 any way you slice it. Fact is Manning gets to play frequently against CRAP pass defenses. Brady had to play against the most difficult pass defense schedule of the last 17 years.

In other news I'm tired of repeating that last sentence

:ugh: Wow. Even for a homer, this is mind-boggling. Only on these boards would this sentence be formed and not laughed at.

You should really watch games and let your eyes do the comparison. Did we just not watch Manning shred the Ravens D apart, the same D that Brady mightily struggled against?

SMH.