OT: Seahawks fire Jim Mora, set sights on Carroll

[BelichickFan]

Re: Pete Carroll Returning?

Mora had one season as overseer of the M*A*S*H unit that was Seattle. Carrol's failed at multiple stops in the NFL

Carrol only got one year in NY. He was so-so, at best, here but that was 10 years ago and he has had a smidgen of success since; albeit not in the NFL.

 

[Deus Irae]

Re: Pete Carroll Returning?

Carrol only got one year in NY. He was so-so, at best, here but that was 10 years ago and he has had a smidgen of success since; albeit not in the NFL.

But this is for an NFL gig.

 

[Rob0729]

Re: Pete Carroll Returning?

Little Mora has done nothing as a HC, I'm not sure if Petey will be successful in the NFL in his next try but based on his time at USC I'd try him over Mora.

We have found out that Carroll is a great college coach and what makes him a great college coach makes him a poor NFL coach. Players in Seattle are already chomping at the bit to see if they hire a new GM to go with it so they can "sneek up the backstairs" to his office to go around Carroll.

Sorry Carroll is "great in the living room" (i.e. talk up high school prospects to come to USC) and can fire up young players, but his "Jacked and Pumped" act is the exact opposite of what works in the NFL. NFL players don't need a buddy or father figure, they need a leader and a task master.

 

[Boots Electric]

Re: Pete Carroll Returning?

We have found out that Carroll is a great college coach and what makes him a great college coach makes him a poor NFL coach. Players in Seattle are already chomping at the bit to see if they hire a new GM to go with it so they can "sneek up the backstairs" to his office to go around Carroll.

Sorry Carroll is "great in the living room" (i.e. talk up high school prospects to come to USC) and can fire up young players, but his "Jacked and Pumped" act is the exact opposite of what works in the NFL. NFL players don't need a buddy or father figure, they need a leader and a task master.

^This.

This is kind of weird because last night on NFL Network, it was Top 10 Coaches Who Belong in College (or something like that) and he was on as number 9. His "rah rah" act does not translate well in the NFL.

 

[Rob0729]

Re: Pete Carroll Returning?

I know many here will disagree, but I honestly don't think that Pete Carroll has clearly established that he isn't qualified to be a good NFL HC.

First, let me state the obvious -- BB is to Pete Carroll what Red Auerbach is to Pitino or something.

That said, unlike Pitino Carroll has never had a reasonably fair shot in the NFL. His one year with the Jets barely counts. His three years here were marked by two things mostly:

1. a GM who undercut him at every opportunity

2. a GM who absolutely SUCKED at drafting players.

I'm not sure that BB could have done that much better than Carroll's 10-6, 9-7 and 8-8 records if he had been stuck with Bobby Grier either, is really what I'm saying.

You forgot how Carroll had GM who blasted Barry Manalow records through the head set system to make him blow every two minute drill and get the plays in late almost all the time. And remember the game the GM made Carroll force Bledsoe to take a knee with like a minute twenty in the half and the Pats on like the 20. All of Carroll's problems were all Bobby Grier's fault from personnel decisions to play calling to clock management.

Sorry, Carroll was a horrible coach. Grier made matters worse, but Carroll made Herm Edwards look like the master of the two minute drill.

 

[TrueBeliever]

Re: OT: Seahawks fire Jim Mora

Funny, I was going to mention in the thread about Mangina not being fired that generally I don't think a coach should ever be fired after a single season, unless he goes 0-16 or he's Mangina. And now this happens.

So what happens if the guy from Minnesota turns them down? Pete Carroll would be nuts to take this or any pro job. Nothing against the guy, in fact I like him, but he's not meant to be a coach in the NFL.

 

[BelichickFan]

Re: Pete Carroll Returning?

But this is for an NFL gig.

Right, yeah, I forgot

I'm not saying that Petey is a good bet to be a top HC in the NFL. But his failure in NY and mediocrity in NE were over 10 years ago. His success one level down since then makes him an intriguing candidate IMO.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

Re: Pete Carroll Returning?

Why would Carroll leave USC where he is pretty much legendary status for another chance to fail in the NFL and knock his approval rating down again.

 

[RobertWeathers]

No way Carroll comes back unless he has final say on personnel. He has said that in the past.

That FO in NJ was a mess in 1994. Steinberg had stomach cancer and when he left his duties, Carroll lost his political cover.

He got passed over for the 49ers gig b/c they wanted an offensive guy as HC and had had enough of a defensive guy leading the team (Siefert) which led them to Mariucci.

We all know what Grier did/din't do which hurt Carroll.

Clearly, Carroll isn't close to BB-quality but to say he was awful and terrible is a bit harsh IMO....

 

[RobertWeathers]

Re: Pete Carroll Returning?

Why would Carroll leave USC where he is pretty much legendary status for another chance to fail in the NFL and knock his approval rating down again.

Hes run out of co-eds to live with (according to Weis)

 

[Rob0729]

Clearly, Carroll isn't close to BB-quality but to say he was awful and terrible is a bit harsh IMO....

Carroll was pretty bad as a Patriots coach. There were too many times that he just looked lost in key situations. He had no killer instinct and would choose to take a knee with enough time left in the half to make a two minute drill with a QB with a cannon of an arm rather than try to at least three points. If he didn't inherit talent from the Parcell years, this would have been a disaster right away.

Yes, Bobby Grier was a worse GM than Carroll was as a head coach, but Carroll is best described as Herm Edwards Lite. He coached like Herm Edwards, just not as good.

 

[bam15]

Carroll was pretty bad as a Patriots coach. There were too many times that he just looked lost in key situations. He had no killer instinct and would choose to take a knee with enough time left in the half to make a two minute drill with a QB with a cannon of an arm rather than try to at least three points. If he didn't inherit talent from the Parcell years, this would have been a disaster right away.

Yes, Bobby Grier was a worse GM than Carroll was as a head coach, but Carroll is best described as Herm Edwards Lite. He coached like Herm Edwards, just not as good.

Didn't he have Ernie Zampese as OC? Going from a Erhardt-Perkins system to Air Coryell is a dramatic shift.

 

[RobertWeathers]

Carroll was pretty bad as a Patriots coach. There were too many times that he just looked lost in key situations. He had no killer instinct and would choose to take a knee with enough time left in the half to make a two minute drill with a QB with a cannon of an arm rather than try to at least three points. If he didn't inherit talent from the Parcell years, this would have been a disaster right away..

All true but I do wonder how things would have gone differently for Carroll and his legacy here if they had Curtis Martin for those final games in 97 and had kept him for 98 and beyond. He had major issues on the offensive side of the ball too with OCs. Kennan was awful. Zampeze was ok, but he was a bad match w/ Beldsoe.

Yes, Bobby Grier was a worse GM than Carroll was as a head coach, but Carroll is best described as Herm Edwards Lite. He coached like Herm Edwards, just not as good.

No question.

 

[Rob0729]

Didn't he have Ernie Zampese as OC? Going from a Erhardt-Perkins system to Air Coryell is a dramatic shift.

Carroll was making the same mistakes year three as he had year one of his tenure. Let's not make excuses for the guy. You can say that shifting systems could have thrown him off for a month, maybe two, but three years?

 

[rabthepat]

Carroll is probably hitting the road before the NCAA starts to look more closely at the USC football program.

 

[bam15]

Carroll was making the same mistakes year three as he had year one of his tenure. Let's not make excuses for the guy. You can say that shifting systems could have thrown him off for a month, maybe two, but three years?

Yeah I'm not, trust me, I'm glad he was fired. Carroll's firing that paved the way for well you know who. But it is difficult going from say 1 Out Slot ZAC 80 Max Tin X-Q Ringo to SCAT ACE 984 F Swing.

 

[Rob0729]

All true but I do wonder how things would have gone differently for Carroll and his legacy here if they had Curtis Martin for those final games in 97 and had kept him for 98 and beyond. He had major issues on the offensive side of the ball too with OCs. Kennan was awful. Zampeze was ok, but he was a bad match w/ Beldsoe.

Zampese should have been a perfect match for Bledsoe. The Air Coryell offense is built for a pocket passer with a cannon of an arm. It doesn't rely much on the short passing game. Bledsoe should have had his best years with Zampese as his OC. Yes, the Zampese years did fail in part because of Bledsoe's buddies who blocked for him and the stupid move of not locking up Curtis Martin when they should have.

 

[Rob0729]

Yeah I'm not, trust me, I'm glad he was fired. Carroll's firing that paved the way for well you know who. But it is difficult going from say 1 Out Slot ZAC 80 Max Tin X-Q Ringo to SCAT ACE 984 F Swing.

Teams do it all the time and it doesn't take a coach and QB three years to get the terminology down. It doesn't change the fact Carroll played not to lose than to win. That was Carroll's biggest problem. He coached scared and safe rather than confident and aggressive.

 

[Sean Pa Patriot]

Caroll should stay where he is a college coach , He is a leader among boys, not men...

 

[Brono]

The way Brono sees it, Carroll timid, submissive. Players confront in office, close door, make him humble old country way.