House cleaning coming at end of season

[KY Pats Fan]

With the latest turmoil, who all (starters) do you see getting cut or traded at the end of the season. I'm throwing out:
Moss
Thomas
Springs

 

[ctpatsfan77]

With the latest turmoil, who all (starters) do you see getting cut or traded at the end of the season. I'm throwing out:
Moss
Thomas
Springs

Yeah, Moss is having issues, but I wouldn't throw him out just yet. It's not like he's getting paid tons of money and not producing.

Springs hasn't done very much at all; how much of that is injury-related, I don't know.

 

[Jangles]

I'm throwing out:
Moss

Moss for sure. He's a shadow of his former self and it's not like he was injured or anything. Those reports of him gimping around the locker room was probably just old age creeping on him.

I mean Moss is slacker with a measly 1058 yds (2nd in the league because Holmes played last night) and he only has 9 TDs!!!

What a bum

 

[Patriot_in_NY]

No chance on Moss. Don't read too much in to Wednesday's "send" home. Wednesday's are Moss's day off anyway and he lollygagged in. BB, for consistency sake, sent him too (prolly with a wink).

I know the world is watching for sign's of the "old" Moss during this time of Patriot struggle, but let's get real. Moss leads the league in yards (not counting Santonio who moved ahead with the extra game last night) and is right at the top with TD's.

His production is fine. We just don't have a legitimate 3rd. That is our SOLE WR issue. Well that and WW is taking a beating and I worry how long he can last at this rate.

 

[Jangles]

No chance on Moss. Don't read too much in to Wednesday's "send" home. Wednesday's are Moss's day off anyway and he lollygagged in. BB, for consistency sake, sent him too (prolly with a wink).

I know the world is watching for sign's of the "old" Moss during this time of Patriot struggle, but let's get real. Moss leads the league in yards (not counting Santonio who moved ahead with the extra game last night) and is right at the top with TD's.

His production is fine. We just don't have a legitimate 3rd.

No he's washed up

anything less than a 20 TD season is unacceptable and it's time we trade him

 

[BradyManny]

Moss stays.

Lost in all this turmoil is that his issues are NOT an effort thing, I believe it's about his health. While he's no longer listed on the report, it's not a stretch to assume he's still facing the injuries he was earlier in the year. With that in mind, Moss should be COMMENDED for playing through these injuries. Sure, it's affecting his play somewhat (haven't seen that jumping ability in a while), but the guy has clearly been in pain for multiple games this season and fought through it.

 

[ctpatsfan77]

His production is fine. We just don't have a legitimate 3rd. That is our SOLE WR issue. Well that and WW is taking a beating and I worry how long he can last at this rate.

If Edelman hadn't broken his arm against TEN, this probably wouldn't be an issue.

 

[mayoclinic]

Adalius Thomas, Derrick Burgess, Jarvis Green and Shawn Springs are as good as gone, IMHO. Underproducers, and worse in some cases.

Stephen Neal, Kevin Faulk, Pierre Woods and James Sanders are business decisions. All have value, but none are contributing to the value of their contracts (except Faulk, who will be 34).

I don't see us letting Moss go this offseason, unless something changes. He was voted a team captain this season, and he's had some good moments. He's still on of the best WRs in the game. I think he'll be given a chance to get with the program. If he doesn't, he won't be back after 2010.

 

[satz]

Adalius Thomas, Derrick Burgess, Jarvis Green and Shawn Springs are as good as gone, IMHO. Underproducers, and worse in some cases.

Stephen Neal, Kevin Faulk, Pierre Woods and James Sanders are business decisions. All have value, but none are contributing to the value of their contracts (except Faulk, who will be 34).

I don't see us letting Moss go this offseason, unless something changes. He was voted a team captain this season, and he's had some good moments. He's still on of the best WRs in the game. I think he'll be given a chance to get with the program. If he doesn't, he won't be back after 2010.

AD ,Burgess and Springs for sure. Green ??? why he is a very parttime rush 3-4 END. Use him as he is suppose to be used .he is not a starter.

Neall ?? when is out the rightside of the Oline just collaspes .we have 2 rookie and backup guy in their and they cannot block for crap.I know he has been injured but that is no reason to get rid of him so we can have crappy blocking again.

Faulk - wow


Woods - I think this is big the guy sets edge better than burgess and AD and also has more sack last year than burgess. But i think he will goto denver or kc and have a good career. He is much better than Banta was at the same stage. But i get it you want to get rid of the 26 yr old guy who leads the Spl teams. I can see steelers getting him after their spl team single handly beating them this season with the crappy play.

Sanders - When he was in the backfield you never said our secondary had mental errors and got them all lined up and ready to play. Now we see huge breakdown .I thinking one of the safety willl develop that skill if not heck we can live with huge breakdown in the secondary till they do.

 

[JackBauer]

Adalius Thomas, Derrick Burgess, Jarvis Green and Shawn Springs are as good as gone, IMHO. Underproducers, and worse in some cases.

Stephen Neal, Kevin Faulk, Pierre Woods and James Sanders are business decisions. All have value, but none are contributing to the value of their contracts (except Faulk, who will be 34).

I don't see us letting Moss go this offseason, unless something changes. He was voted a team captain this season, and he's had some good moments. He's still on of the best WRs in the game. I think he'll be given a chance to get with the program. If he doesn't, he won't be back after 2010.

Agreed with this 100 percent. Also count me among those who think Moss probably has injury issues. Back problems can be very, very difficult to get rid of, especially in the middle of a football season.

 

[JackBauer]

Green ??? why he is a very parttime rush 3-4 END. Use him as he is suppose to be used .he is not a starter.

Because he's basically worthless, it seems, in any role and is definitely not worth what they're paying him in salary.

 

[tanked_as_usual]

add taylor and morris to the list. get some younger guys

jarvis green is useless as a starter. he could be helpful if the just use him on passing downs

 

[mayoclinic]

AD ,Burgess and Springs for sure. Green ??? why he is a very parttime rush 3-4 END. Use him as he is suppose to be used .he is not a starter.

Green is a pass rushing 3-4 DE with 0 sacks. He'll be 31. He's making $2.5M base this season, with a $5M cap hit. His contract expires after this season. Good chance he is not re-signed.

Neall ?? when is out the rightside of the Oline just collaspes .we have 2 rookie and backup guy in their and they cannot block for crap.I know he has been injured but that is no reason to get rid of him so we can have crappy blocking again.

Neal is one of our best linemen when healthy, but he's been increasingly injury prone and is 33. His contract is $3.5M. If we re-sign or tender Mankins then I can't see us keeping Neal at that price, when he hasn't been able to stay on the field. It's possible he re-signs for a lesser deal and stays.

Faulk - wow

I'm in the minority here. And I have nothing against Faulk as a player - he's been clutch for us. But he's 34, and $4M for a 3rd down back is too much, and his contract is up after this year. He could re-sign for reasonable money, but I think there's a good chance we go with a younger alternative.

Woods - I think this is big the guy sets edge better than burgess and AD and also has more sack last year than burgess. But i think he will goto denver or kc and have a good career. He is much better than Banta was at the same stage. But i get it you want to get rid of the 26 yr old guy who leads the Spl teams. I can see steelers getting him after their spl team single handly beating them this season with the crappy play.

Woods is a fine STer, but he hasn't proven he can be a regular LB. $1.5M is a lot to pay for a STer.

Sanders - When he was in the backfield you never said our secondary had mental errors and got them all lined up and ready to play. Now we see huge breakdown .I thinking one of the safety willl develop that skill if not heck we can live with huge breakdown in the secondary till they do.

What are you talking about - when he was in our backfield all you ever heard were criticism about missed tackles and wrong angles.

I like Sanders, but $3M for a 4th safety is a lot to pay. As a 2nd/3rd safety it was fine. As a 4th safety it's a lot.

Do you see the theme here? The issue is payment for performance. When Belioli took over they went out and signed as many $500K free agents as they could. Those guys then overperformed. Now we have a bunch of expensive guys who are underperforming. I don't see that being tolerated. I think BB wants a hungry team of overachievers, not a fat, lazy team of underachievers.

JMHO.

 

[thodoks]

I think BB wants a hungry team of overachievers, not a fat, lazy team of underachievers.

Interesting how the nature of this team has evolved. Seems to me this team has, at least in part, turned into the antithesis of what he sought to build at the outset of this decade.

I too hope he decides to go long on guys with mental fortitude and pride, and short on paycheck players this offseason.

 

[Jimke]

AD ,Burgess and Springs for sure. Green ??? why he is a very parttime rush 3-4 END. Use him as he is suppose to be used .he is not a starter.

Neall ?? when is out the rightside of the Oline just collaspes .we have 2 rookie and backup guy in their and they cannot block for crap.I know he has been injured but that is no reason to get rid of him so we can have crappy blocking again.

Faulk - wow


Woods - I think this is big the guy sets edge better than burgess and AD and also has more sack last year than burgess. But i think he will goto denver or kc and have a good career. He is much better than Banta was at the same stage. But i get it you want to get rid of the 26 yr old guy who leads the Spl teams. I can see steelers getting him after their spl team single handly beating them this season with the crappy play.

Sanders - When he was in the backfield you never said our secondary had mental errors and got them all lined up and ready to play. Now we see huge breakdown .I thinking one of the safety willl develop that skill if not heck we can live with huge breakdown in the secondary till they do.

Green let it slip earlier in the season that he wanted to finish out

his career with the Saints.

 

[satz]

Green is a pass rushing 3-4 DE with 0 sacks. He'll be 31. He's making $2.5M base this season, with a $5M cap hit. His contract expires after this season. Good chance he is not re-signed.

The problem we do not have anyone to replace him.I think its not reasonable to look each contract by year. He has been good for overall money given. This might suprise you but no player will sign a year by year contract.

Neal is one of our best linemen when healthy, but he's been increasingly injury prone and is 33. His contract is $3.5M. If we re-sign or tender Mankins then I can't see us keeping Neal at that price, when he hasn't been able to stay on the field. It's possible he re-signs for a lesser deal and stays.

Again overall contract number.He is 33 and we can sign him to be a good backup and develop another gaurd.

I'm in the minority here. And I have nothing against Faulk as a player - he's been clutch for us. But he's 34, and $4M for a 3rd down back is too much, and his contract is up after this year. He could re-sign for reasonable money, but I think there's a good chance we go with a younger alternative.

He is still producing and plays every game,I am not a big believer in get rid of good players especially his final year in a contract is big. It will always be big towards the end of the contract.

Woods is a fine STer, but he hasn't proven he can be a regular LB. $1.5M is a lot to pay for a STer.

Veteran minimun is over 1 million. so we can sign a veteran and save a few hundred thousand or get a UDFA for cheap .But can he lead the team in spl team tackles and be good .
or can saving ) 0.5% of the cap is worth carring a weaker spl team.

What are you talking about - when he was in our backfield all you ever heard were criticism about missed tackles and wrong angles.

I like Sanders, but $3M for a 4th safety is a lot to pay. As a 2nd/3rd safety it was fine. As a 4th safety it's a lot.

Again cap money not real money .He is a good 4th safety and cheap considering you cut him and then pay some guy vet minium the same real money.

Do you see the theme here? The issue is payment for performance. When Belioli took over they went out and signed as many $500K free agents as they could. Those guys then overperformed. Now we have a bunch of expensive guys who are underperforming. I don't see that being tolerated. I think BB wants a hungry team of overachievers, not a fat, lazy team of underachievers.

JMHO.

The problem is no more july cap cuts due the balloning of cap , with more team running 3-4 team put a preminium of such players and having cap room over pay, with the spread of BB and his recruiting staff another 2001 will never happen. Its NFL team build of retread and have happened only once in NFL history. So i do not want wait 40 yrs for them to win another with a similar team.

 

[Jimke]

You can't cut everyone on the team. Bodden, Burgess, Faulk,

Green, Hanson, Neal, Seau, Watson, and Wilfork are all free

agents. I do agree that Springs and Thomas should be cut.

How Moss plays the last four games may decide his future.

The Patriots will need another draft like 2009 to fill numerous

vacancies.

 

[dhamz]

There certainly will be a lot of guys moving on. There really are every year. Last year was Cassel, Vrabel, Hobbs, Gaffney, Seymour, Bruschi, and Harrison so I doubt this year will be a group that tops that one.

The issue I'm much more interested in will be who is coming on board for 2010. There haven't been many additions the last few offseasons who are making a big impact.

 

[Bill B.]

I'm surprised no one mentioned it yet, but I think Maroney is gone next year. Not because of any issues off the field, but because I don't think he is that effective on the field. He is also a free agent. Belichick usually overhauls one position in the off-season and I think the running back position is next. With the exception of Faulk, I don't see Taylor, Morris, or Maroney back next year. We will probably get a RB with one of the seond round picks, and also sign a couple of free agents.

 

[Urgent]

I could actually see quite a bit less turnover than previous years.
There were 25 new players on the team this year.
Normal is more like 13-15.
I could see as few as 10-12 new players next season - half the turnover in 2009.

Potential turnover, offense to defense:

Maroney?
BJGE - could be upgraded, didn't do much in absence of Morris and Taylor

Ben Watson

1 OL?

LB Overhaul
Adalius Thomas - no penalty to release under uncapped system
Derrick Burgess - no production, picks are sunk cost
Pierre Woods - no production in critical year, could compete in training camp for ST
Shawn Crabel - never did anything, never healthy, could compete in training camp for ST
Junior Seau

Shawn Springs - healthy scratch
Terrence Wheatley - overshadowed by Wilhite and Butler but cheap, could compete for ST

Always some additional churn, and potential free agent losses.

But with all the new young players this year, many seeming to play well, there is a stronger secondary corps than in previous years.
The Pats should certainly be players for most of their free agents, especially under an uncapped system.