D giving up 2 + more points per game than SB D in '04??

[RhodyPatriot]

WOW!! I could not believe it when Steve DeOssie came out with that stat today. Very interesting and it backs up my assertion that it's the offense who is the real culprit with this 7 - 5 team. Nobody is saying this is anything but an adequate (by today's NFL standards) D at best but they've been hung out to dry in quite a few games this year by an O that goes to sleep in the 2nd half of games.
DeOssie also had an interesting point in saying that there are no great defenses in the NFL this year and the teams that max out their O's will be the most successful, i.e. Indy, NO, Minn etc.

 

[pats1]

WOW!! I could not believe it when Steve DeOssie came out with that stat today. Very interesting and it backs up my assertion that it's the offense who is the real culprit with this 7 - 5 team. Nobody is saying this is anything but an adequate (by today's NFL standards) D at best but they've been hung out to dry in quite a few games this year by an O that goes to sleep in the 2nd half of games.
DeOssie also had an interesting point in saying that there are no great defenses in the NFL this year and the teams that max out their O's will be the most successful, i.e. Indy, NO, Minn etc.

I was thinking about that second point last night. There really isn't a dominating defense this season. Specifically, I can't think of any dominating cornerbacks.

 

[PatsFaninME]

Not sure that I agree with the premise that this D if even average but I do agree that the offese has to carry this team if they're to go anywhere this season. I think the offensive playcalling has got to improve. For that matter, so does the D playalling. Did anyone else feel that something good happened every time the Pats rushed more than 3-4 guys.

Let all the haters go away because the bus was too crowded with them anyway. I'd love for Pats to be written off come playoff time. Giants proved in '07 that a team can get "hot" and win without being the best team. We just need our O to get hot and our D to continue to improve.

Let's remember that lasst year most of us (me included) were saying they were old and slow and needed to get younger and faster. Not many teams can go 7-5 (and I believe they'll finish 11-5) and win there division during such a transition phase.

 

[Deus Irae]

WOW!! I could not believe it when Steve DeOssie came out with that stat today. Very interesting and it backs up my assertion that it's the offense who is the real culprit with this 7 - 5 team. Nobody is saying this is anything but an adequate (by today's NFL standards) D at best but they've been hung out to dry in quite a few games this year by an O that goes to sleep in the 2nd half of games.
DeOssie also had an interesting point in saying that there are no great defenses in the NFL this year and the teams that max out their O's will be the most successful, i.e. Indy, NO, Minn etc.

1.) The offense is still winning the TOP battle, leaving the defense on the field for fewer minutes. It's just not converting in, or near, the red zone, and that's been the difference in every loss but one.

2.) The Patriots have played a lot of lousy offenses.

 

[BionicPatriot]

1.) The offense is still winning the TOP battle, leaving the defense on the field for fewer minutes. It's just not converting in, or near, the red zone, and that's been the difference in every loss but one.

2.) The Patriots have played a lot of lousy offenses.

Thank you. Against good offenses, they struggle. In game winning situations outside of the miracle against the Ravens, well lets not talk about that.

This defense is so overrated it's freaking ridiculous. If I hear one more stupid "re-building" excuse from someone I'm gonna slam my head in the monitor cuz I've heard that talk since 2005 and it isn't getting better.

That said, this OL is killing this team. They really need to fix the right side.

 

[DougFlutie]

2.) The Patriots have played a lot of lousy offenses.

The Patriots have played horrible Bucs and Titans defenses which have skewed their offensive stats. The Patriots were shut down by two rookie Colts corners in the 2nd half. The Patriots offense was shut down by a Saints defense missing 2 starting corners and with 1 starting safety who signed a week before.

In the 5 losses the offense has averaged 3.5 points in the 2nd half.

In the past 27 minutes of the Dolphins game the Patriots offense scored 0 points.


The offense is largely responsible for most of this 7-5 team's 5 losses.

 

[RhodyPatriot]

1.) The offense is still winning the TOP battle, leaving the defense on the field for fewer minutes. It's just not converting in, or near, the red zone, and that's been the difference in every loss but one.

2.) The Patriots have played a lot of lousy offenses.

1) TOP is so misleading. WHEN is the Patriots offense dominating in TOP?
In the 4th quarter when the D needs some help?? Nope!!!
They dominated TOP in the Dolphins game in the 1st quarter and did nothing after that.
Take the Colts game.
The D forced Peyton Manning into 7 punts and 2 INT's.
Problem was Peyton Manning was allowed FOURTEEN possessions. 14!!
This Patriot offense did not use ball control to manage the clock thus keeping Manning on the sidelines in the 4th quarter.
The D ran literally out of defensive front bodies in the 4th quarter and needed the O to burn some clock.
Did it happen? Nope!
TOP is important in the 4th quarter when trying to close out a game.
The Patriots have been awful against the good teams.

2) What kind of offenses did the '04 Pats face?? Anyone as good as Brees and these Saints??

 

[Patspsycho]

I was thinking about that second point last night. There really isn't a dominating defense this season. Specifically, I can't think of any dominating cornerbacks.

Revis says hi. He shut down Moss and TO basically.

 

[Deus Irae]

The Patriots have played horrible Bucs and Titans defenses which have skewed their offensive stats. The Patriots were shut down by two rookie Colts corners in the 2nd half. The Patriots offense was shut down by a Saints defense missing 2 starting corners and with 1 starting safety who signed a week before.

In the 5 losses the offense has averaged 3.5 points in the 2nd half.

In the past 27 minutes of the Dolphins game the Patriots offense scored 0 points.


The offense is largely responsible for most of this 7-5 team's 5 losses.

See, this is the sort of ignorance that must be stomped out. The defense made Chad Henne look like Peyton Manning, and you're *****ing about the offense. It's been a team failing all season long.

Now, since you were banned, why are you here?

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

2 points is a significant dropoff, but it's not bad considering offense is supposed to be a clear strength on this team now. Aside from the NO loss and partially the Colts loss, the offense and it's 2nd half ineptitude has been the culprit. And why do people keep bringing up the supposed weak opponents? That's how it is every year... you face some good teams and you face alot of bad teams. So we faced awesome teams week in week out in 2004?

 

[Deus Irae]

2 points is a significant dropoff, but it's not bad considering offense is supposed to be a clear strength on this team now. Aside from the NO loss and partially the Colts loss, the offense and it's 2nd half ineptitude has been the culprit. And why do people keep bringing up the supposed weak opponents? That's how it is every year... you face some good teams and you face alot of bad teams. So we faced awesome teams week in week out in 2004?

We bring it up because we've seen the crap the Patriots have faced. Sanchez twice, Henne twice, a Titans team with a QB who had one of the worst games in NFL history, Mr. Johnson for the Buccaneers, Trent Edwards and the Bills... that's a smorgasbord of suck.

 

[DougFlutie]

The offensive stats are misleading. Even now this offense is top-5 in the league in average points per game. It is misleading.

Dig a little deeper and find that this team averages 3.5 points in the 2nd half of this team's 5 losses.

Take the Colts game.
The D forced Peyton Manning into 7 punts and 2 INT's.
Problem was Peyton Manning was allowed FOURTEEN possessions. 14!!

Exactly.

Giving the opponent 14 different possessions is incredible. It is Bledsoe-esque in getting tons of 3-and-outs and leaving your defense out to dry.

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

We bring it up because we've seen the crap the Patriots have faced. Sanchez twice, Henne twice, a Titans team with a QB who had one of the worst games in NFL history, Mr. Johnson for the Buccaneers, Trent Edwards and the Bills... that's a smorgasbord of suck.

Meanwhile other teams are facing powerhouses such as Brady Quinn, Jamarcus Russel, Matt Cassel (sorry), Jason Campbell, Kyle Boller, Jay Cutler the fraud, whoever Atlanta's backup is, the list goes on and on. What's your point, there are alot of bad teams in the league and every defense benefits from it.

 

[Deus Irae]

Meanwhile other teams are facing powerhouses such as Brady Quinn, Jamarcus Russel, Matt Cassel (sorry), Jason Campbell, Kyle Boller, Jay Cutler the fraud, whoever Atlanta's backup is, the list goes on and on. What's your point, there are alot of bad teams in the league and every defense benefits from it.

How does "every team benefits" impact my point? The Patriots defense has been artificially propped up by playing terrible offenses and, even there, its problems have been easy to see for those bothering to look. When it's played quality offenses, it's gotten waxed.

 

[RhodyPatriot]

See, this is the sort of ignorance that must be stomped out. The defense made Chad Henne look like Peyton Manning, and you're *****ing about the offense. It's been a team failing all season long.

The ignorance is yours.
Chad Peyton Manning Henne scored a whopping 22 points against this Patriot D, a Patriots D that was left on the field all game long in warm Miami by this impotent O. The Patriots offense scored a whopping 21 points (7 points in the last 3 quarters) against the Steel Curtain....err I mean this average Miami Dolphin defense.
The shear blindness of so many Patriot fans is embarrassing.
Is it the star power or binky love that prevents so many from justifiably calling out the O??

 

[cmasspatsfan]

We can analyze the offense and defense to death but this team has lost all but one game by a small margin and thats because no one stepped up and made that play that gets us over the top, in fact thyey've been making mistakes at the wrong time when a big play should be made. Ill admit most of that time its been the offense that hasnt come up with that play.

 

[mgteich]

When your offense is so bad that it scores only 3.5 points a game in the second half, then we need a premier defense like we had in 2004.

See, this is the sort of ignorance that must be stomped out. The defense made Chad Henne look like Peyton Manning, and you're *****ing about the offense. It's been a team failing all season long.

Now, since you were banned, why are you here?

 

[Lockdown06]

the 2004 team faced such worldbeaters as Josh McCown, Drew Bledsoe/J.P. Losman, AJ Feeley/Jay Fiedler, and either kelly holcomb or luke mccown, I can't remember who started for the browns by that game in 04

 

[PATSYLICIOUS]

How does "every team benefits" impact my point? The Patriots defense has been artificially propped up by playing terrible offenses and, even there, its problems have been easy to see for those bothering to look. When it's played quality offenses, it's gotten waxed.

Because it shows that it's just the norm to play alot of bad offenses, so why just hold it against THIS defense only? Go back and look at the QB's/offenses the 2004 team played and you can formulate a list similar to the one you posted. It's a senseless point/list when both defenses have faced some crap QB's.

 

[Deus Irae]

The ignorance is yours.
Chad Peyton Manning Henne scored a whopping 22 points against this Patriot D, a Patriots D that was left on the field all game long in warm Miami by this impotent O. The Patriots offense scored a whopping 21 points (7 points in the last 3 quarters) against the Steel Curtain....err I mean this average Miami Dolphin defense.
The shear blindness of so many Patriot fans is embarrassing.
Is it the star power or binky love that prevents so many from justifiably calling out the O??

You're equating the points scored with how Henne looked. He was 29 of 52 for 335, with 2 TDs.


Yeah, pimp that "D"!