Brief observations from Pats vs. Colts replay on NFLN

[Patspsycho]

Just some brief observations, no more comments on that 4th down.

We no longer have 3rd/4th WR problems:

Isiah Stanback is the real thing. On the 40 reps he took in the game, not once was he out of place, and not once did the other players have to motion him. This tells me that not only does he have the plays down cold, but he also has the slotting and positions down, as well. He was in step with everyone else. And of course we have Edelman back.

Colts scoring 14 points on us in 4th quarter was from inexperience:

My eyes were exclusively on the defense during the last 5 minutes, and it did not seem like they were gassed. As you all know, Manning was in no huddle, but the no huddle he ran was pretty fast, even for no-huddle standard. He did not even allow our D to motion, align, or set. As a result our D was stuck in the same formation on consecutive downs (McGowan kept motioning to the same spot to pick up Clark). There were some confusion- you could see helmets turning.. a lot of what, who, where's. Since this is basically a raw defense unit, it is fairly safe to say that this is the first time they've faced an elite quarterback in complete control of the game, dictating tempo, dictating pace, and calling the shots. A great experience for them. In this regard, I am actually glad we lost, because players remember lessons from losses far more than wins, so you can bet that if we face them in the AFCC, they will be ready for that.

Burning timeouts was a huge factor:

Watching the game in the context of the timeouts and looking at them from the point of view that we lost all of our timeouts before the critical 2 minute warning, it became a huge factor, in my eyes. Like it or not, this was simply bad game management, period. The offense just slipped out of their groove on that dumb timeout when the play didn't match up with the personnel. You can see Faulk lose it, when Brady calls timeout.

Phantom PI call on Butler was a gamechanger:

I realized that in context of that first drive, the PI call was a huge factor. Not only do the Colts offense move 30 yards, but it was a huge break that allowed the Colts offense to regroup. It also broke the rhythm and concentration of our D which was in a great rhythm up to that point, and really clicking.. they were tuning into Manning's tempo, and I am fairly confident that he would have had turned the ball over had that PI call not occured. I am sure that our D corp from the last few years would have maintained concentration without losing a beat, but again this is a young corp, and they will learn from this.

In short, I have to conclude that this was a great learning experience for the D. They went up against an elite QB, top-notch game-planning, very hostile crowd and environment, playoff atmosphere and buzz.

They can only learn from this and get better, with experience.

 

[ALP]

taht is good news.....hopefully they learn


we all expetected growing pains

 

[convertedpatsfan]

I'm surprised/impressed you could watch this game so shortly after it happened. I say I've moved on, but I don't know if I could endure a replay so soon

But there are a lot of positives to take from this game. Stanbeck really impressed me as well. I know it wasn't a huge impact on the game, but he made some plays, and didn't hurt the team with silly penalties (Galloway, I'm looking at you). And 40 plays shows BB's faith in him.

The PI call was just awful. That was probably the single play that upset me the most out of the entire game.

And without re-hashing the 4th down call, I'd also include the way BB has handled the aftermath may also help the team down the road. He isn't whining about the PI call or the bad spot. He didn't throw any of his players under the bus to try and protect himself.

He took full responsibility onto himself and I think the players are really going to respond to it in a positive way. I can see this team going on a 2007-style roll where they blow people out and score a bunch of FU touchdowns.

 

[RayClay]

Just some brief observations, no more comments on that 4th down.

We no longer have 3rd/4th WR problems:

Isiah Stanback is the real thing. On the 40 reps he took in the game, not once was he out of place, and not once did the other players have to motion him. This tells me that not only does he have the plays down cold, but he also has the slotting and positions down, as well. He was in step with everyone else. And of course we have Edelman back.

Colts scoring 14 points on us in 4th quarter was from inexperience:

My eyes were exclusively on the defense during the last 5 minutes, and it did not seem like they were gassed. As you all know, Manning was in no huddle, but the no huddle he ran was pretty fast, even for no-huddle standard. He did not even allow our D to motion, align, or set. As a result our D was stuck in the same formation on consecutive downs (McGowan kept motioning to the same spot to pick up Clark). There were some confusion- you could see helmets turning.. a lot of what, who, where's. Since this is basically a raw defense unit, it is fairly safe to say that this is the first time they've faced an elite quarterback in complete control of the game, dictating tempo, dictating pace, and calling the shots. A great experience for them. In this regard, I am actually glad we lost, because players remember lessons from losses far more than wins, so you can bet that if we face them in the AFCC, they will be ready for that.

Burning timeouts was a huge factor:

Watching the game in the context of the timeouts and looking at them from the point of view that we lost all of our timeouts before the critical 2 minute warning, it became a huge factor, in my eyes. Like it or not, this was simply bad game management, period. The offense just slipped out of their groove on that dumb timeout when the play didn't match up with the personnel. You can see Faulk lose it, when Brady calls timeout.

Phantom PI call on Butler was a gamechanger:

I realized that in context of that first drive, the PI call was a huge factor. Not only do the Colts offense move 30 yards, but it was a huge break that allowed the Colts offense to regroup. It also broke the rhythm and concentration of our D which was in a great rhythm up to that point, and really clicking.. they were tuning into Manning's tempo, and I am fairly confident that he would have had turned the ball over had that PI call not occured. I am sure that our D corp from the last few years would have maintained concentration without losing a beat, but again this is a young corp, and they will learn from this.

In short, I have to conclude that this was a great learning experience for the D. They went up against an elite QB, top-notch game-planning, very hostile crowd and environment, playoff atmosphere and buzz.

They can only learn from this and get better, with experience.

Well I'm glad you're glad. Sheesh, the rationalization that goes on in this forum is just mind boggling sometimes.

May I contend that actually trying to defend Manning for 70 yards might have been an even better learning experience?

What's the downside? You can't lose more than once. They might have even made a play or two, we'll never know.

 

[BelichickFan]

I have no idea how you could watch it. I watched about 10 minutes but even when we were doing well it made me too sad.

Stanback and Edelman do seem to be a viable pair; not only what you said about Stanback but he was also asked to do a variety of things like chipping Freeney and blocking downfield. It's interesting that he chose the Patriots because they'd let him play QB but now he's at WR again.

If/when we play again I wonder if Belichick will have Wilhite (with help) on Wayne again. It would have seemed like the more experienced Bodden would have been a better choice.

I do agree that this terrible ending will help down the road and although we will have to play @Indy now if we meet in the playoffs, I can't say that sounds overly scary after building such a commanding lead. And I do think we have the combination of talent and coaching on defense that they will be better for it - hopefully later this year not waiting until next year though.

Understanding different CB match up differently to different WR, of the Bodden, Butler, Wilhite trio what order do you like them in right now ?

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

Well I'm glad you're glad. Sheesh, the rationalization that goes on in this forum is just mind boggling sometimes.

May I contend that actually trying to defend Manning for 70 yards might have been an even better learning experience?

What's the downside? You can't lose more than once. They might have even made a play or two, we'll never know.

When did Ian sign you as board clown? Bozo wanted too much guarenteed money so he signed with "ganggreen"?

The OP gave some observations that are insightful, interesting, and informative.

Even if the 4th and 2 was called correctly, that shouls have zero bearing on a fan's evaluation of our chances going into Indy in January.

 

[BSR]

Well I'm glad you're glad. Sheesh, the rationalization that goes on in this forum is just mind boggling sometimes.

May I contend that actually trying to defend Manning for 70 yards might have been an even better learning experience?

What's the downside? You can't lose more than once. They might have even made a play or two, we'll never know.

Er...I don't think saying you have an inexperienced defense is a rationalization.

 

[upstater1]

On Syanback: On the crucial third down where Brady threw the ball away in the 4th--Brady was being rushed, stepped up into the pocket clear as day, could maybe run the ball for 5 yards and chew up clock, but he felt pressure from behind, turned his head for a glimpse of oncoming rusher, and purposely sailed it way high beyond Moss--Stanback had broken free downfield on a crossing pattern about 30 yards away. He may not have top speed but he was gone for a TD if Brady had seen him.

It would not say that burning timeouts was bad game management. I think it was bad organization. The final timeout needed to be taken because it was before the most crucial play of the game. If you don't call it there and fail, you will get a lot of second-guessing, especially because the chances of needing a challenge flag are miniscule. Plus the chances of the booth overturning that call? Not bloody likely.

One thing to consider about meeting the Colts in Indy again is that they will scheme against what the Patriots offense did, and they will likely contain Brady better. Then again, if Edelman and Stanback stay healthy, and Fred Taylor returns, this offense will be more dangerous when/if we come back for round 2. If the Patriots grab the second bye and host, say, the Bengals, while the Colts grab the first bye and host the Steelers/Chargers, we may not go through Indy at all for the championship game.

 

[aluminum seats]

Colts scoring 14 points on us in 4th quarter was from inexperience:

My eyes were exclusively on the defense during the last 5 minutes, and it did not seem like they were gassed. As you all know, Manning was in no huddle, but the no huddle he ran was pretty fast, even for no-huddle standard. He did not even allow our D to motion, align, or set. As a result our D was stuck in the same formation on consecutive downs (McGowan kept motioning to the same spot to pick up Clark). There were some confusion- you could see helmets turning.. a lot of what, who, where's. Since this is basically a raw defense unit, it is fairly safe to say that this is the first time they've faced an elite quarterback in complete control of the game, dictating tempo, dictating pace, and calling the shots. A great experience for them. In this regard, I am actually glad we lost, because players remember lessons from losses far more than wins, so you can bet that if we face them in the AFCC, they will be ready for that.

Burning timeouts was a huge factor:

Watching the game in the context of the timeouts and looking at them from the point of view that we lost all of our timeouts before the critical 2 minute warning, it became a huge factor, in my eyes. Like it or not, this was simply bad game management, period. The offense just slipped out of their groove on that dumb timeout when the play didn't match up with the personnel. You can see Faulk lose it, when Brady calls timeout.

Phantom PI call on Butler was a gamechanger:

I realized that in context of that first drive, the PI call was a huge factor. Not only do the Colts offense move 30 yards, but it was a huge break that allowed the Colts offense to regroup. It also broke the rhythm and concentration of our D which was in a great rhythm up to that point, and really clicking.. they were tuning into Manning's tempo, and I am fairly confident that he would have had turned the ball over had that PI call not occured. I am sure that our D corp from the last few years would have maintained concentration without losing a beat, but again this is a young corp, and they will learn from this.

In short, I have to conclude that this was a great learning experience for the D. They went up against an elite QB, top-notch game-planning, very hostile crowd and environment, playoff atmosphere and buzz.

They can only learn from this and get better, with experience.

Excellent points--I had many of the same rewatching last night. (I confess I'm not in the misery many of you seem to be. The Pats losses the last few years in the playoffs--to Denver, the Colts, the SB loss--have been brutal to me. A regular season loss just doesn't measure up.) Specifically, it was jarring just how ridiculous the timeouts were--clean that stuff up, Bill. Yikes.

But your points about the defense are spot-on, and you allude to something that there's WAY too little of on this board, or anywhere with Pats fans. Credit to the other team. The Colts starting scoring at the end not because the Pats were too tired, or suddenly bad, etc. The Colts started scoring because one of the best quarterbacks of all time started making plays. Imagine that. You're right that the defense will be more seasoned next time around, which could make all the difference.

 

[aluminum seats]

On Syanback: On the crucial third down where Brady threw the ball away in the 4th--Brady was being rushed, stepped up into the pocket clear as day, could maybe run the ball for 5 yards and chew up clock, but he felt pressure from behind, turned his head for a glimpse of oncoming rusher, and purposely sailed it way high beyond Moss--Stanback had broken free downfield on a crossing pattern about 30 yards away. He may not have top speed but he was gone for a TD if Brady had seen him.

It would not say that burning timeouts was bad game management. I think it was bad organization. The final timeout needed to be taken because it was before the most crucial play of the game. If you don't call it there and fail, you will get a lot of second-guessing, especially because the chances of needing a challenge flag are miniscule. Plus the chances of the booth overturning that call? Not bloody likely.

Good observation on Stanback. Disagree on the use of timeouts, though (although I agree that bad organization is probably a more precise term.) Watching the game again, it was clear the last timeout was taken because of confusion--Brady was coming off the field and looked surprised they weren't punting. You have to try and hold on to that one--40+ more seconds could have won the Pats the game.

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

Excellent points--I had many of the same rewatching last night. (I confess I'm not in the misery many of you seem to be. The Pats losses the last few years in the playoffs--to Denver, the Colts, the SB loss--have been brutal to me. A regular season loss just doesn't measure up.) Specifically, it was jarring just how ridiculous the timeouts were--clean that stuff up, Bill. Yikes.

But your points about the defense are spot-on, and you allude to something that there's WAY too little of on this board, or anywhere with Pats fans. Credit to the other team. The Colts starting scoring at the end not because the Pats were too tired, or suddenly bad, etc. The Colts started scoring because one of the best quarterbacks of all time started making plays. Imagine that. You're right that the defense will be more seasoned next time around, which could make all the difference.

I agree with the OP that the back end of the defense wasn't gassed. However, the D line was certainly getting there. frankly, I thought Burgess played very well and the line did much to disrupt the indy timing.

However, without TBC/Green/Warren in the rotation, it does get tougher in the 4th qtr. I would not be suprised it that played a major role in going to "prevent" with 5 minutes left. Hell, in the first half Collinsworth noted that Wright and Vince were looking gassed and having guys missing would be a problem.

 

[Number 2]

Thanks for breaking that down, great observations.

Here is a quick video of Stanback with a lot of praise from Michael Irving

Isaiah Stanback

 

[Tunescribe]

One irritating thing about that game is it's now going to be in NFLN's rotation of "Classic Games." They show the 2006 AFCCG too often already.

 

[upstater1]

Good observation on Syanback. Disagree on the use of timeouts, though (although I agree that bad organization is probably a more precise term.) Watching the game again, it was clear the last timeout was taken because of confusion--Brady was coming off the field and looked surprised they weren't punting. You have to try and hold on to that one--40+ more seconds could have won the Pats the game.

I think the Colts could take their sweet time in that final drive and bring seconds off the clock regardless. One timeout, and they can still milk it. If you're more concerned about getting the ball back then stopping them, the best way to do that is to let Addai score, rather than relying on 1 timeout to have any impact. Remember, the Colts scored on second down, so even after a timeout, they can grind the clock down.

 

[aluminum seats]

I think the Colts could take their sweet time in that final drive and bring seconds off the clock regardless. One timeout, and they can still milk it. If you're more concerned about getting the ball back then stopping them, the best way to do that is to let Addai score, rather than relying on 1 timeout to have any impact. Remember, the Colts scored on second down, so even after a timeout, they can grind the clock down.

They scored with what, 13 seconds left? So say the Pats would have called the TO with 50 seconds left, before the second down play. If the Colts run the same play and score, the Pats have the time. At the very least, that would have given the Pats time to regroup and think, so if the Colts ran the ball they probably would have let them score.

Two other points on the end. One, the Pats' first down play should have gone to Maroney. If he's your top back, you're got to give him the ball there, not Faulk. Two, Brady can't throw a nine yard pass on the last play of the game. I understand it's miracle time, but you've got to go deep with the hope Moss grabs one and either scores or gets out of bounds for a FG attempt.

 

[oldskool138]

But there are a lot of positives to take from this game. Stanbeck really impressed me as well.

He didn't impress you enough so that you'd spell his name correctly.

 

[fillylabinga]

I agree with what seems to be the general gist of this thread--despite giving up 35 points the D held up pretty well. I haven't been willing to give the D too much credit this year since so many of the teams they have beaten have pretty terrible offenses, but I think they played well on Sunday.

It's more of a tip-the-cap type of situation I think. You have to give credit to Manning after watching him thread some of those passed in there. I thought the D-backs were on top of their assignments the whole game. Manning just made better throws--the final TD included I thought Whilhite had pretty good coverage.

Of course, it didn't help the D that the D-line was hurt going in and they were down to about 3 LBs by the end of the game. Why do injuries to the D always seem to happen against the Colts??

Anyway, I was more disappointed in the O. In particular:
1. Kaczur getting abused by Mathis
2. The inability to run the ball to put the game away (Corey where are you?)

Maybe Light's return (to RT?) will solve the first and getting Taylor back will solve the second. Solve those and we're looking at a deep playoff run...

 

[patsfaninpittsburgh]

Putting up 34 points on 35 minutes TOP and almost 500 yards against a supposed top defense isn't that bad. If you want to get mad, look to the Maroney fumble.

Also, a Morris/Taylor return should go toward solving the "hard running" problem.

Mathis had a decent game. however, his "abuse" is really more of him making some plays vs the other 10 guys getting abused.

 

[SVN]

Putting up 34 points on 35 minutes TOP and almost 500 yards against a supposed top defense isn't that bad. If you want to get mad, look to the Maroney fumble.

Also, a Morris/Taylor return should go toward solving the "hard running" problem.

Mathis had a decent game. however, his "abuse" is really more of him making some plays vs the other 10 guys getting abused.

i dont know running backs are the problem as much. committing to it is. they shouldve run on 3rd and 2. Even a QB sneak .instead brady almost threw a pick. Critical short 3rd downs in a shotgun, everyone know its going to welker .Personally thats what bothers me. Maybe they miss JMcd.Why not do a QB sneak on 3rd and 2. Make then use a timeout or get to the 2 min andthen talk it over. This was most unpatriotlike. Last yr BB did something simialr calling atimeout on a succesful 4th down conversion which cost them..

 

[Mark Morse]

My observations were of how badly Dan Connolly played replacing Neal which caused Faulk to be tackled for loss on second down. Also Jerod Mayo was out of place on Addai's last two runs. He couldn't see who had the ball.