Let's Be Real About Seymour's Situation

[cmasspatsfan]

Except that's my point: if the article I cited above is correct, the ball is currently in Oakland's court, not New England's.

If he doesnt report and take a physical its in NE's. Then they could work out another deal with Oakland and throw the ball into their court or just take him back which I dont see happening.

 

[spacecrime]

As I wrote in:

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...ur-trade-not-done-deal-page3.html#post1490859



"This makes the most sense.

He has three children just starting the school year tomorrow fer crying out loud.

These people are human beings. You can't expect them to easily uproot themselves within 24 hours in those situations."

Players have no problems saying it's a business when they change teams and go to the highest bidder or when they hold out for more money.

With the good (big $$$) comes the not so good. Their bodies are used roughly and they are subject to being cut or traded. If they are not willing to accept the not so good, they had no business accepting the good.

The rights and opportunities do not flow one way.

His kids have to change schools. Lots of people making twenty thousand are laid off and have to move. It is very hard to feel sorry for a many making $10 million to do the same.

His kids can change schools. Does it really matter that it happens a week ahead of time (like you make it a big deal to be) or three months? Either way, they were in one school last year and will be in a different school the next. How horrible. Very few kids go to one school all their lives, kids who are far less fortunate than Seymour's kids.

Seymour did a fine job in 2001 and 2003. Could not have won those superbowls without him, and for that I am grateful to him. But it is time for him to stop whining. He received millions and millions of dollars over the years. Now he will earn millions in a new city. Wah wah wah.

I will remember him upending Charlie Garner in a third and one in the Snow Bowl that prevented the Raiders from running out the clock and forcing them to punt the ball back to the Pats. THat play was as important as Vinatieri's kick. But enough already.

 

[JoeSixPat]

I didn't find any of Rodney's comments offensive... and don't think anyone really should... he's right about it all, especially how Seymour might not be enthrallled at the thought of being franchised by Oakland.

I suppose there's an inherent warning that Belichick might be sending to other players who are entering negotiations.

Try to play hardball and you might just find yourself in Oakland!

That threat might wind up speeding up negotitions in the future!

 

[shmessy]

Players have no problems saying it's a business when they change teams and go to the highest bidder or when they hold out for more money.

With the good (big $$$) comes the not so good. Their bodies are used roughly and they are subject to being cut or traded. If they are not willing to accept the not so good, they had no business accepting the good.

The rights and opportunities do not flow one way.

His kids have to change schools. Lots of people making twenty thousand are laid off and have to move. It is very hard to feel sorry for a many making $10 million to do the same.

His kids can change schools. Does it really matter that it happens a week ahead of time (like you make it a big deal to be) or three months? Either way, they were in one school last year and will be in a different school the next. How horrible. Very few kids go to one school all their lives, kids who are far less fortunate than Seymour's kids.

Seymour did a fine job in 2001 and 2003. Could not have won those superbowls without him, and for that I am grateful to him. But it is time for him to stop whining. He received millions and millions of dollars over the years. Now he will earn millions in a new city. Wah wah wah.

I will remember him upending Charlie Garner in a third and one in the Snow Bowl that prevented the Raiders from running out the clock and forcing them to punt the ball back to the Pats. THat play was as important as Vinatieri's kick. But enough already.

I don't argue with any of that.

Just that it can't easily be done unexpectedly on the fly within 24-48 hours of the first day of school. I think he'll report - - just that he may need 3 days or so to get his family business in order. Your examples don't take into account the TIME element.

The rules say he has 5 days to report. 'Nuf ced. You expect him to not take the time he's allowed in order to drop his family and rush off to Oakland?

It's a logistics thing. These folks are humans.

 

[mgteich]

It is not a matter of excuses. It is a matter of priorities and league rules. If Seymour isn't required by league rules to be on the next plane to Oakland, then he won't be on the plane. The consensus understanding is that Seymour can wait and report in a week in response to a formal letter (pursuant to league rules) or even later if he is willing to sacrifice a paycheck.

I agree that Seymour can choose to go to Oakland without his family if and when the business aspects are worked out. As another poster indicated, Seymour may choose not to report until Oakland agrees not to franchise him, the same deal Samuel got from the patriots.

What is in doubt is the exact words of the contract, whether there is a clause regarding the trade being depending on a physical, and whether this clause has been waived. It is most unlikely that anyone in the media has that information.

I'm not buying the excuse about kids in school. We're talking a four month season here. Yes, it will be tough, but in four months the family will be together again. I've been through this and plenty of other people have. Whether they move now or later, the kids will be fine.

 

[patsox23]

I'm not sure where Rodney's "trashing" the Patriots.

 

[shmessy]

I'm not sure where Rodney's "trashing" the Patriots.

Many of us in this thread have been scratching our heads about that one.

The quotes are all very complimentary of Belichick and the organization.

If anything, Rodney is telling him, 'yeah it's a rough break, but man up - that's reality'.

 

[BelichickFan]

All this "family" stuff is a joke. NFL players miss more time away from the family in one season than most of us do in the 18 years a kid grows up. He wants more money, end of story.

 

[shmessy]

All this "family" stuff is a joke. NFL players miss more time away from the family in one season than most of us do in the 18 years a kid grows up. He wants more money, end of story.

Ugh, once again, it's not "being away from the family" that is probably the issue. It is "leave your family (with three kids starting school tomorrow) within 24-48 hours, when by league rule you have 5 days to report" that is the issue.

If you owe $1,000 for income tax, do you write the check out for $1,500?

 

[BelichickFan]

Ugh, once again, it's not "being away from the family" that is probably the issue. it is "leave your family (with three kids starting school tomorrow) within 24-48 hours, when by league rule you have 5 days to report" that is the issue.

It's not all that different, some players don't even live in the same city as their families - Harrison's family lived in Atlanta, for example. It's a different lifestyle that shouldn't be compared to yours or mine any more than their outrageous salaries should.

 

[mgteich]

OK, I exagerrated. What Rodney in effect said was to tell the raiders and patriots to take their trade and shove it. Harrison publically advised Seymour to hold out and not show up unless the raiders contractually agreed not to franchise him next year (ala Samuel). You are correct though. Harrison did indeed say that the patriots are a great organization. But business is business.

And just BTW, do you think that Oakland is fine with giving a 1st to have Seymour for one year, in the hope that they can convince him to stay (as KC did with Cassel)? If not, they will not agree to the franchise term, and will void the trade when he doesn't show in 5 days.

And then guess what happens? Seymour reports to practice at Foxboro.

I'm not sure where Rodney's "trashing" the Patriots.

 

[cmasspatsfan]

And then guess what happens? Seymour reports to practice at Foxboro.

The precise protocol is determined by the terms of the trade. "Traditionally the first condition is that the trade is contingent upon the player or players reporting and passing a physical," Signora said.

If the player doesn't report, the two teams can try to come up with a new agreement, or the trade could be called off. The only leverage that can be exerted against the player is the dreaded "five-day letter," a precursor to placement on the reserve/left squad list.

"The club sends a letter to the player warning him that, in five days, the club has the right to place him on the reserve/left squad list," Signora said. "It explains to him that if they do place him in that category, he cannot play again this season, etc. After sending that letter and the expiration of the five-day period, the club does not have to place the player on the reserve/left squad list, but it may do so."

Once on the reserve/left club list, Seymour would be unable to play for anyone in 2009, and his contract would toll by a full year, with his salary of roughly $3.7 million applicable in 2010, if he decides at that point to show up.

Seymour could eventually get "five-day letter" | ProFootballTalk.com

 

[mgteich]

Who do think sends him the letter? Why wouldn't Oakland simply void the deal instead>?

The precise protocol is determined by the terms of the trade. "Traditionally the first condition is that the trade is contingent upon the player or players reporting and passing a physical," Signora said.

If the player doesn't report, the two teams can try to come up with a new agreement, or the trade could be called off. The only leverage that can be exerted against the player is the dreaded "five-day letter," a precursor to placement on the reserve/left squad list.

"The club sends a letter to the player warning him that, in five days, the club has the right to place him on the reserve/left squad list," Signora said. "It explains to him that if they do place him in that category, he cannot play again this season, etc. After sending that letter and the expiration of the five-day period, the club does not have to place the player on the reserve/left squad list, but it may do so."

Once on the reserve/left club list, Seymour would be unable to play for anyone in 2009, and his contract would toll by a full year, with his salary of roughly $3.7 million applicable in 2010, if he decides at that point to show up.

Seymour could eventually get "five-day letter" | ProFootballTalk.com

 

[shmessy]

It's not all that different, some players don't even live in the same city as their families - Harrison's family lived in Atlanta, for example. It's a different lifestyle that shouldn't be compared to yours or mine any more than their outrageous salaries should.

Once again - - I'm not talking about living in the same city with their families.

I'm talking about having to take care of business within 24-48 hours versus needing 4-5 days to settle everything for a family with three kids during the first week of school.

Harrison is a TERRIBLE analogy. He was cut by SD and had the luxury of visiting with teams before deciding on his own where he would go. No one told him to pack up and move himself within 24-48 hours.

5 days should be plenty for Seymour to get the basics settled for his family during the first week of school and move to the other coast.

No one is complaining about him having to move. We're talking about TIME - - time which is within the league limits - not more than the limits. the league sets the limits - -and he has every right to take up to the limit.

Please, stop moving the argument to one that is not there.

 

[GullyFoyle]

What would you do in the 24-48 hours after you are informed that you have been traded to the raiders with no previous notice, and your kids were starting school on Tuesday morning. I would do the following

1) i'd have a long talk with my wife and start to decide how to make decisions about school, housing and other such matters.

2) I'd have a more than one long talk with my agent.

3) Presuming that I received a call from Oakland, I would tell them that I have not received the paperwork from the patriots (the 5 day letter) and that the team should discuss things through my agent.

Seymour has five days for him, his family and his agent to get their act together.

If my agent and I wanted to negotiate a contract before playing any games, then I would do that. Any contract would add any missing pay to the signing bonus.

Oh yeah, I'd have by buddy Rodney trash the patriots and tell the world how pi$$ed off I am.

I would thank God for letting me make millions playing a kids game instead of punching a clock at a factory

 

[Tunescribe]

As I wrote in:

http://www.patsfans.com/new-england...ur-trade-not-done-deal-page3.html#post1490859



"This makes the most sense.

He has three children just starting the school year tomorrow fer crying out loud.

These people are human beings. You can't expect them to easily uproot themselves within 24 hours in those situations."

Shmess, I seldom disagree with you but NFL players (and their families by extension) don't live in the real world. As multimillionaires they have the means to ease such transitions. So, daddy will be gone for a while as things get sorted out. If it was a less lucrative line of work I'd feel a bit more compassion.

 

[Pats726]

If the patriots want him to go and Seymour doesn't go, they need to send him a 5-day letter. Otherwise, the patriots owe him his game pay next Monday.

The Patriots owe him NOTHING... Seymour leaving classless just shows his lack of character....It's all about the money and I am GLAD he's gone..his actions are showing exactly what he's about.

 

[DarrylS]

I would thank God for letting me make millions playing a kids game instead of punching a clock at a factory

The voice of reason, albeit simplistic, nonetheless very effective..

 

[patchick]

It is not a matter of excuses. It is a matter of priorities and league rules. If Seymour isn't required by league rules to be on the next plane to Oakland, then he won't be on the plane. The consensus understanding is that Seymour can wait and report in a week in response to a formal letter (pursuant to league rules) or even later if he is willing to sacrifice a paycheck.

This kind of reminds me of the line of reasoning that players under contract are "allowed" to sit out as long as they pay fines. Seymour isn't "allowed" to not report. The 5-day letter is part of the protocol for players who are in serious violation of league rules, warning them that they face suspension.

 

[NEGoldenAge]

This kind of reminds me of the line of reasoning that players under contract are "allowed" to sit out as long as they pay fines. Seymour isn't "allowed" to not report. The 5-day letter is part of the protocol for players who are in serious violation of league rules, warning them that they face suspension.

I was originally under this same impression, but read a pretty convincing post that said it was a players option to do such things, and not a violation of their contract. Now I don't know what to think.