Collinsworth on D&C this morning re: Brady

[BradyManny]

Did anyone catch Collinsworth on D&C this morning? When asked about the Patriot offense, he literally wouldn't say one positive thing and instead focused on Carson Palmer and how he "never was the same" the year following the ACL injury.

What he failed to mention was Palmer threw for over 4000 yards and nearly 30 TDs that year, and that Brady had a 5 month headstart on the rehab process.

I understand its a very legitimate concern about how someone comes back from an injury of this magnitude, but I, for one, think the Palmer comparison is flawed - especially if we are going to ignore Palmer's statistical success in the year he returned.

Another interesting tidbit, unrelated to Brady, was that they played for Collinsworth a clip of Hasselbeck absolutely ripping Favre's work ethic [from a WEEI interview w/ Hasselbeck this offseason] (talking about how he'd ask them to move up QB meetings up to 10:30 so he could make a tee-time, and then show up late at 12 anyway). What's funny is Collinsworth turns around, goes right on ESPN 890 after hanging up w D&C and is talking about how Favre is going to fit in great for the Vikings, the teammates will love him, blah blah blah.

 

[nashvillepatsfan]

I know some people on here like Collingsworth, but ive never liked him. Ive always ranked him pretty low on the scale. Kind of like Jamie Dukes

 

[Rob0729]

I still don't get the perception that Palmer sucked ever since he came back. The stories in 2006 was how Palmer rebounded as if he never left and showed courage in the pocket. Joe Theismann famously commented how he was amazed about Palmer's mental toughness in returning from his injury as if he never left.

It is funny, three years later the story on Palmer has changed. He went from rebounding without much of a drop off with courage in the pocket to never being the same and timid in the pocket.

 

[Rob0729]

As for Collinsworth flip-flop, it is common with national commentators to change their opinions based on their audience. It is not uncommon for a commentator to go on one local radio station and say that he thought the hometown team will crush the opposition and then go on the opposition's local radio station and say he likes their team's chances.

 

[Kontradiction]

Collinsworth sucks in every way possible. They couldn't have picked a more boring successor to John Madden. Oh wait. Yeah they could have. I forgot about his old running mate on NFL Network, Bryant Gumbel.

 

[Rob0729]

Collinsworth sucks in every way possible. They couldn't have picked a more boring successor to John Madden. Oh wait. Yeah they could have. I forgot about his old running mate on NFL Network, Bryant Gumbel.

Gumbel's problem isn't that he was boring. He didn't understand football.

 

[Sicilian]

Eh, whatever, what did you expect from a national guy? What's a more interesting story to watch for people outside of NE: Brady being Brady and dominating the league again, or the idea that the Golden Boy might fall from grace?

Not to get too philosophical, but it's like all ancient myths: There's an equal number of stories about the tragic downfall of heroes as there are inspirational stories of triumph. It's human nature to want an interesting story, not an accurate or uplifting one.

 

[Kontradiction]

Gumbel's problem isn't that he was boring. He didn't understand football.

No, boring was his biggest problem. He grasped the general concept of football (something a five year old can do) and that was good enough for him considering Collinsworth did play in the NFL and could make up for it. But listening to Gumbel was like listening to paint dry... if you can actually do that.

Put him and Collinsworth together and I was snoozing faster than I could have if I had been watching HGTV.

 

[AzPatsFan]

Gumbel's problem isn't that he was boring. He didn't understand football.

And a bigotted racist as well.

 

[Rob0729]

No, boring was his biggest problem. He grasped the general concept of football (something a five year old can do) and that was good enough for him considering Collinsworth did play in the NFL and could make up for it. But listening to Gumbel was like listening to paint dry... if you can actually do that.

Put him and Collinsworth together and I was snoozing faster than I could have if I had been watching HGTV.

Sorry, I remember one NFL Network broadcast where Gumbel was asking questions of Collinsworth that most 5 year olds would know the answers to. Gumbel clearly didn't know the game enough to be calling the play by play. He couldn't even figure out where the down marker was on most downs. He was clueless.

 

[Bella*chick]

Perhaps Carson's Palmer's problem was less his injury recovery and more the fact that the team has been imploding for a while now. One guy can't do it all.

 

[Kontradiction]

Sorry, I remember one NFL Network broadcast where Gumbel was asking questions of Collinsworth that most 5 year olds would know the answers to. Gumbel clearly didn't know the game enough to be calling the play by play. He couldn't even figure out where the down marker was on most downs. He was clueless.

Heh. I've heard that before. Personally, I can take guys that know next to nothing about football. That's why I can stomach guys like Dennis Miller and Tony Kornhole. If Gumbel had been lively, I could have at least been able to stomach him as well. As it stands, he's just absolutely boring which is why I hated him. His complete lack of football knowledge only shown through that much more BECAUSE he was so boring.

 

[pencilneckgeek]

Perhaps Carson's Palmer's problem was less his injury recovery and more the fact that the team has been imploding for a while now. One guy can't do it all.

No doubt, but that doesn't focus on personality enough, so the national media has to say that he's not the same, when the truth of the matter is that the team isn't the same. How a team falls apart so thoroughly and yet the coach keeps his job is a mystery.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Perhaps Carson's Palmer's problem was less his injury recovery and more the fact that the team has been imploding for a while now. One guy can't do it all.

Yup, that plus he was never as good as advertised. Got all the measurables, not so much the intangibles. I have the feeling Brady could have made more out of bad coaching, questionable personnel decisions and managing egos. He did at Michigan. That's the big difference. Palmer never had to do much more than show up at USC, Pete had the rest covered. Tom had to fight for playing time and manage egos and coach his own receivers...and he brought that intangible skillset with him to NE as well. Once he got here he had a HC willing to utilize all his skills as well as provide him with the elite coaching he'd been lacking. And the rest, as they say, is history.

BTW Palmer is dinged up...again. Tom plays through his non ACL injuries, and plays well. They all get hurt routinely, so that is really what NFL durability is about - playing well hurt.

 

[MoLewisrocks]

Collinsworth sucks in every way possible. They couldn't have picked a more boring successor to John Madden. Oh wait. Yeah they could have. I forgot about his old running mate on NFL Network, Bryant Gumbel.

Collinsworth is the anthesis of Madden, therefore a lousy choice as his replacement. Madden brought an energy and intensity and passion to the broadcast that was the perfect balance to his ultra professional play by play partner. Collinsworth exudes an uptight air of intellectual superiority bordering on contempt and a disdain for the everyman fan's passion. Similar to Gumel in that annoying respect. He's a stiff... better suited to be the play by play guy than his foil or sidekick.

Madden saved the broadcast of XXXVI with his analysis of what the upstart Patriots were doing and how they were doing it. And it didn't matter when they did things he as a former SB winning HC and acknowledged authirity could not predict or even advised against. He was able to shift gears seemlessly and openly admire the result. And his admiration never sounded grudging as a result. Collinsworth's more often than not does, particularly where this team is concerned.

 

[PatsFanSince74]

Whether or not the Palmer comparison is a fair one (and I don't think it is), if it is Collinsworth's opinion that Palmer isn't the same QB since his injury, then that's his opinion. After all, Palmer is a QB of great promise who's now pushing 30 with not a whole lot to show for it beyond a couple of very good seasons, a 32--33 record as a starter, one Playoff game and a Pass Rating of 88.9--good but not spectacular; some of that is injury-related, some of that is team-related, but it is not what was expected of him when he was the number one overall draft pick.

The bottom line here (and we better get used to it for most of this season) is that there is no "story" (outside of New England) if Brady returns as his old self, which we all expect him to do; the only story that the rest of the country is interested in is the possibility (hope?) that Brady is not himself and the Patriots' offense is not as formidable as a result.

Folks like Collinsworth are going to beat the "Is he really the same Tom Brady?" drum until the cows come home or at least until Tommy definitively shuts them up; we have to live with that.

 

[RobertWeathers]

I also was able to listen to the interview on EEI and I don't recall it going that way at all. CC was asked about Brady and he gave his honest opinion which I think is valid. He used what Brady himself said (wish I got hit) as his arguement for measuring how close and what the steps are to returing to his pre-injury form. It would have been nice if he said, "Brady will be fine" but he didn't. Oh well.

890 is a ESPN station so of course he will suck-up to the Farve-lovers.

With regard to Palmer, in back to back years after his injury, Palmer made all his starts, threw for 4000yds over 28 & 26 TDs and completed over 64% of his throws. Certainly he not as good as Brady qb-wise, but the numbers are not shabby at all. That team has coaching, defense and running game issues. Hes in a spot. No he doesnt have TJ Houh.

I do agree that CC is a horse's @$$ and takes his contrarian viewpoint to the extreme sometimes. In addition he throws out compliments like man-hole covers. But I do think his football knowledge is pretty good.

 

[Rob0729]

Collinsworth is the anthesis of Madden, therefore a lousy choice as his replacement. Madden brought an energy and intensity and passion to the broadcast that was the perfect balance to his ultra professional play by play partner. Collinsworth exudes an uptight air of intellectual superiority bordering on contempt and a disdain for the everyman fan's passion. Similar to Gumel in that annoying respect. He's a stiff... better suited to be the play by play guy than his foil or sidekick.

Madden saved the broadcast of XXXVI with his analysis of what the upstart Patriots were doing and how they were doing it. And it didn't matter when they did things he as a former SB winning HC and acknowledged authirity could not predict or even advised against. He was able to shift gears seemlessly and openly admire the result. And his admiration never sounded grudging as a result. Collinsworth's more often than not does, particularly where this team is concerned.

Not a huge fan of Collinsworth, but haven't been much of a Madden fan the last decade or so. Madden had became the Master of the Obvious in his analysis over the years. In his heyday he would be able to breakdown plays and give analysis with the best of them. In recent years, I felt he would just state things like "if they can score here, they will get back into this game" type of analysis.

 

[Deus Irae]

Carson Palmer has suffered with the curse of not being Peyton Manning or Tom Brady. He's been a distant #3, and that's unforgivable to a lot of people. Combine that with having to play on a team from the Ohio Penal league and sugar in 2 major injuries, and you have people insisting that he's a bust, mediocre, etc....

 

[mgcolby]

Sorry, I remember one NFL Network broadcast where Gumbel was asking questions of Collinsworth that most 5 year olds would know the answers to. Gumbel clearly didn't know the game enough to be calling the play by play. He couldn't even figure out where the down marker was on most downs. He was clueless.

Aside from being boring and having an annoying whiney voice. He didn't seem to ever be watching the same game that I was.

I remember one game a team attempted a FG and the ball landed in the middle of the end zone. Gumbel's response: And it is good [starts talking with Collinsworth, stops]...nope they are waving it off the FG attempt is no good.

He should have been fired on the spot.