Biggest offseason loss?

[PatsBoy12]

In lieu of PATRIOT64's thread asking which new players will make the biggest contribution in 2009, I thought I'd present the converse. Which departure leaves the biggest hole/need to fill? Which player, coach, or front-office personnel was the biggest offseason loss to the organization? Note, I'm not asking for opinions on the most disappointing departure. I'm asking who you all think will be the toughest departure to replace (will we perhaps see early season struggles in a particular position/with a particular unit).

I included a poll to give some ideas . . .

 

[ALP]

right now im going with lonnie...

i was about to say matt cassel, but so far, with what ive read of our new long snappers, they arnt the definition of perfection...hopefully that changes by season start

but those situations can at times become mightily important...but well see, im hoping lonnie can get replaced w/o any headaches

 

[Frezo]

My vote was also for Paxton. It's hard to find players at any position that can execute their role with the positive consistency that he did.

 

[Pat the Pats Fan]

My first thought was Cassel, too, but changed it to a non player, Pioli.

Belechick has replaced players and coaches and continued to win. Let's see about front office personnel.

 

[PatsBoy12]

My first thought was Cassel, too, but changed it to a non player, Pioli.

Belechick has replaced players and coaches and continued to win. Let's see about front office personnel.

How would you rate Belichick's first draft without Pioli? Many think he did a masterful job of moving around and the Pats walked away with two 2nd-round picks for next season's draft.

 

[ausbacker]

Pardon my rudeness, but isn't there a separate topic mimicking this exact thread that was started last week?

 

[mgteich]

Vrabel was a major loss, IMHO, the only major loss. There have been perhaps thousands of posts discussing how we will deal with the "situation" at OLB. That points to a serious concern in filling the void left by Vrabel.

On the other hand, consider that Harrison's retirement is not considered something that is in any way an issue. Belichick drafted a safety, re-signed another, signed a third; business as usual.

I do agree that Paxton was important, but Hodel is also one of the very best. Also, Ingram was the best in the NCAA last year. We have the long snapper position in good hands.

BTW, Belichick will do just fine with front office stuff. He has already done well in the Cassel situation, the draft, in 2009 cap management, and of course in the deals that he didn't make.

 

[PatsBoy12]

Pardon my rudeness, but isn't there a separate topic mimicking this exact thread that was started last week?

I checked before I created this and the other one is "most disappointing" thing this offseason and it included things that did not happen (i.e. signing Jason Taylor, Julius Peppers, etc.). So no, they are not the same. I wanted to know what the biggest hole would be to fill, not what we all think has been the most disappointing offseason occurrence.

 

[ALP]

Vrabel was a major loss, IMHO, the only major loss. There have been perhaps thousands of posts discussing how we will deal with the "situation" at OLB.

I do agree that Paxton was important, but Hodel is also one of the very best. Alos, Ingram was the best in the NCAA last year. We have long snapper taken care of.

thats my point....we trully wont know about that until the LS is tested...

as for vrabel...i dont see him as a major loss, he could not rush the QB anymore, and was only good at setting the edge on runs

i hope we can replace his edge setting, while upgrading the QB pressure...and age

 

[PatsBoy12]

thats my point....we trully wont know about that until the LS is tested...

as for vrabel...i dont see him as a major loss, he could not rush the QB anymore, and was only good at setting the edge on runs

i hope we can replace his edge setting, while upgrading the QB pressure...and age

I agree that his ability to get to the QB had declined since the second half of the 2007 season, but you can't say his loss wasn't a HUGE one in terms of his leadership, experience and, most importantly, his intelligence, especially in big games and critical situations. We'll have a few big ones, especially as the season draws to a conclusion, so the Pats will miss that immensely. The same goes for Rodney. They were definitely old and, perhaps, even past their twilight. However, for all the speed and durability potential that the youth movement brings, it lacks experience and leadership.

 

[Calciumee]

I think Lonnie could be biggest short term lose.

Where as, Pioli has the potential of being the biggest long term.

Losing Harrison and Vrabel could be a huge loss in the locker room!

 

[Feep50]

My first thought was Cassel, too, but changed it to a non player, Pioli.

Belechick has replaced players and coaches and continued to win. Let's see about front office personnel.

I agree with this post. Players come and go. That's the nature of a 53 player squad. Pioli may turn out to be a crucial loss........ I hope not though.

 

[HEY BRO! WHAT UP?]

Player loss - Vrabel, only because the Pats didn't do anything to upgrade their situation

Front Office - Scott Pioli. First it was Demitroff, now it Pioli. The Pats front office is getting cleaned out.

 

[PatsBoy12]

To all those who feel it was Pioli, how would you all grade BB's first draft without him? Also, how much influence do you all think Pioli had on the FA acquisitions - Galloway, Taylor, Bodden, Springs, et al.?

 

[farn]

I think Lonnie could be biggest short term lose.

Where as, Pioli has the potential of being the biggest long term.

Losing Harrison and Vrabel could be a huge loss in the locker room!

I agree with your Pioli analysis... can't say I follow on the Lonnie lovin'. Sure, we all love Lonnie. But does anyone think we're going to fall apart with the new long-snappers ? Or that we should have spent the cash to outbid Denver ?

I think the Pats have survived bigger losses than a long-snapper.

 

[Feep50]

To all those who feel it was Pioli, how would you all grade BB's first draft without him? Also, how much influence do you all think Pioli had on he FA acquisitions - Galloway, Taylor, Bodden, Springs, et al.?

Point well taken PB12! I think it was an excellent draft. Time will tell how good it was. I have no doubt in BB as an outstanding football talent evaluator. It's more of how much he takes upon himself, I think our track record with Pioli on board was pretty darn good and losing him weakens the team in general.

There's no other coach I want besides BB..... Past or present!

 

[PatsBoy12]

Point well taken PB12! I think it was an excellent draft. Time will tell how good it was. I have no doubt in BB as an outstanding football talent evaluator. It's more of how much he takes upon himself, I think our track record with Pioli on board was pretty darn good and losing him weakens the team in general.

There's no other coach I want besides BB..... Past or present!

Man, you said it. I remember once as a kid I questioned my father about why so many head coaches get heat when teams lose. I remember telling him that a coach can't do much without talent, and you can't blame them for all the losses if they don't have the players. Let's just say I've totally reevaluated since watching BB's mastery over the last decade.

(Well, I also watched guys like Phil Jackson and Greg Popovich)

 

[ALP]

I agree with your Pioli analysis... can't say I follow on the Lonnie lovin'. Sure, we all love Lonnie. But does anyone think we're going to fall apart with the new long-snappers ? Or that we should have spent the cash to outbid Denver ?

I think the Pats have survived bigger losses than a long-snapper.

umm, yea we have, kinda like kicker?

do i need to remind u of the a specific game where 99% of the time he would have kicked...and instead went for it on a 4th down?

 

[PatsFanSince74]

Pioli in the office, Paxton on the field. Overall to Pioli.

 

[NumenorBlader]

Toss up between Mikey V and Pioli. Gave the nod to Vrabel. As I said in the other thread, I've been watching replays of last season's games and noticed that although Vrabel punch through as much, he was as consistent as they come, and extremely intelligent on the field. Moreover - he was another defensive leader. Harrison was already getting phased out, and in terms of longetivity with the Pats there's only Bruschi left. Vrabel will be missed, and because we haven't filled his role (unlike SS, WR, QB haha etc.), he will be missed the most.

As for Pioli, he's a close second and would probably have been 1st had BB not shown us that he's still the man on draft day. Well - we'll see that for sure at TC, whether the rookies are good enough... but for the moment, BB seems to have done rather well without Pioli - stack of eager rookies and a stack of picks for next year... not bad.

Blader.