RE: Cornerback - More confidence in Bodden or Springs?

[AzPatsFan]

This is a much better discussion than the ones we have had about Hank Poteat... or some of the guys that have come through here.

Isn't this better, discussing long time starters instead of debating the merits of marginal reserves?

 

[VJCPatriot]

I have confidence in both playing well but at 37 years of age you have to have some doubts regarding Springs durability. I expect he'll get a lot of time off which is good b/c I'm really hoping for good things out of Butler, Wheatley, and Wilhite.

Umm Springs is 34, not 37. That's a BIG difference.

 

[SyN65]

Umm Springs is 34, not 37. That's a BIG difference.

Yeah, I was going to correct him on that but I don't know how well a 34 yr old corner can do.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Yeah, I was going to correct him on that but I don't know how well a 34 yr old corner can do.

Well he was pretty good at 33 and 32...

 

[JoeShmoe]

Were actually pretty spoiled at CB now with Wheatley, Wilhite and Butler ready to challenge for a no.2 spot. Butler could be a pro-bowler in 3 years if he lives up to his promise and Wheatley/Wilhite showed a lot of promise last year in difficult circumstances

 

[farn]

This is a much better discussion than the ones we have had about Hank Poteat... or some of the guys that have come through here.

Poteat. Earthwind-Moreland. Troy Brown. These are the CBs of championship seasons !

 

[DarrylS]

Poteat. Earthwind-Moreland. Troy Brown. These are the CBs of championship seasons !

If you are satisfied with this group, advocate for bringing them back..personally much more confident right now in our CB situation, than have been in a couple of years... you forgot Randall Gay and some of the others..

 

[BTTA]

Poteat. Earthwind-Moreland. Troy Brown. These are the CBs of championship seasons !

Yeah, exactly. Let's keep in mind that the problem Samuels gave the Pats coaching staff is exactly the same behavior that got him so much positive notoriety - taking risks that sometimes paid off in interceptions. Yo don't have to be a super athlete to be a good CB in this defensive scheme. The "Just do your job" theme applies to this position as well.

This is more CB talent than this team has had in a long, long time.

FWIW, if forced to answer this question, I'd go with Bodden only because 34 year old football players are vulnerable to losing some quickness and injury. But if Springs stays healthy, both of these guys should be solid starters.

 

[NumenorBlader]

Springs has the wealth of experience which is always good in getting that first step/awareness of what's going on.

Bodden is young, and has faced and succeeded against some top receivers in his time. Last year was a blimp because of the team around him. If the D-Line doesn't pressure the QB, they will look like Marino/Manning/Brady....

But all in all - probably Bodden. I see him taking quite the bulk of top WRs because he can shut things down, whereas with Springs probably #2/Nickel CB.

To be honest though, every CB will play an important role this year. Who knows when the ball may come your way for the game-winning INT... who knows.

Blader.

 

[Feep50]

After reading through the previous 29 posts of this thread, my overall impression is that, in general, posters here see our CB depth and ability as vastly improved from a year ago. Which I agree with.......

Once Bodden and Springs were acquired BB had the confidence to let Hobbs go to Philly. That says a lot to me personally.

Springs, Bodden, Wheatley, Wilhite and Butler looks to be a very competitive group at CB. If Butler is pushing for more and more playing time as the season unfolds, that would be a great thing for all concerned. TC, pre-season and the first 4 games of 2009 should, could get very interesting indeed!

As to the main topic of the thread: Bodden or Springs better in 2009? I really don't have any idea. MY gut says Springs if he can stay away from injuries, but I'm hoping Bodden plays to his potential also...

Good thread, excellent posts!

 

[HEY BRO! WHAT UP?]

Would you really sign up a corner from an 0-16 team to a contract longer than 1 year? - I wouldn't

Bodden had a subpar year last season,its not like he was a world beater at stopper at corner on that pathetic team,the only player who showed up in games last season for the Lions seemed to be Calvin Johnson but he didn't have a QB to throw it to him. - Its simply a show me year for Leigh and if he is decent I would'nt worry about the future.

He played in a defense he isn't accustomed to. Bodden likes to be the guy who shadows the opposing team's #1 receiver. He's more of a man to man CB instead of a cover 2 zone CB that the Lions played last season. But don't the Pats play zone? In my opinion and observation, their CB's were in a zone because they had too. In fact, their CB's were small and jamming opposing WR's wasn't in their repertoire. The days of the Pats CB's giving 10 yard cushions should be over. I expect BB to go to more of a man to man scheme for his secondary. And when they do play zone, both CB's have to ability to jam receivers at the line which will really help throw off the timing of the opposing offense. The Pats secondary had their best seasons when they played this type of defense (2001 and 2003).

But to answer the original question, I have more confidence in Bodden, just because I worry that Springs get nicked up from time to time.

 

[PYPER]

Umm Springs is 34, not 37. That's a BIG difference.

My bad. I got his age confused with Galloway's.

Either way, I expect that we'll see a healthy rotation with Bodden, Springs and the youngsters.

 

[jmt57]

Regarding Leigh Bodden, here's a couple of recent local articles that may be of interest.


Bodden not content with biding his Pats time on the corner by Glen Farley of The Quincy Patriot Ledger

“It is behind me,” Bodden said during a break at the New England Patriots’ three-day minicamp that was to conclude today, “but I just always remember how I came in and how hungry I was to make a team.

“It’s no different as I get older. I just have to work and continue to get better because I know there are guys in my position, undrafted, or just a rookie coming in and trying to establish himself in the league.”

“It’s going good,” said Bodden. “I just have to continue to keep working on the things I need to work on, stay in the playbook and just try to get better and better every day to help this team going forward in training camp and the season.”

Bodden hungry to start winning by Rich Garven of The Worcester Telegram & Gazette

“It was a unique experience,” he recalled with UN-like diplomacy. “But you can take positives from that situation. I was in Cleveland where we had bad years — we didn’t go oh-and-everything, but it was still bad — and you just have to play and work hard no matter what the circumstances are. You still try to go out there and win ballgames, unfortunately we just didn’t and that’s just how it went last year.”

At 6-foot-1 and 193 pounds, Bodden has striking speed to go with that impressive size, making him tough to run against and, more importantly, tougher to run pass routes against. Although he only had one interception last season, it should be noted the Lions had a paltry four as a team and utilized a defensive scheme (Tampa 2) the aggressive Bodden may have been miscast in.

 

[jmt57]

And also some articles on Shawn Springs, mostly about his notebook on NFL receivers.


Springs is a noted student by Andy Vogt of Metro West Daily

"I've got to know how Adalius Thomas will play a play, or how James Sanders will play a play," Springs said. "On defense, you can only run so much stuff. It's about communication and guys playing together."

That bridge is slowly being built with his fellow members of the secondary. Springs and Bodden are by far the veterans in the Patriots' current group, accumulating 20 years of NFL service. By comparison, the Patriots' other top four corners - Terrence Wheatley, Jonathan Wilhite, Mike Richardson and rookie Darius Butler - have played in 32 NFL games combined. That said, all but Butler have spent a season with the Pats, so the exchange of information isn't a one-way street.

"(Springs and Bodden) don't really know all the calls and signals yet, and even though we're young, we still know it form last year," Wheatley said. "But it goes both ways. They're helping us with techniques. When Shawn does something I've never seen before, I'll go, 'well, what did you see there?' "

Springs plans to play it by the book by Shalise Manza-Young of The Providence Journal

"I keep notes on all receivers over the years. These guys are too good not to know them. T.O., Moss, I still have notes around from Tim Brown. I have a lot of it up here too," Springs said, pointing to his head.

It makes sense that Springs' dossier on Owens would be the thickest – the two have played in the same division for much of their careers: first the NFC West, when Springs was drafted by Seattle and Owens by San Francisco; then the NFC East, as Springs moved to Washington and Owens played for Philadelphia and Dallas. Now, Springs is with New England and Owens the Bills.

He may have his notes, but they aren't a substitute for watching film.

"No, no, no, no, no. Tape is amazing. You still need tape," he said.

Being bookish pays off for Shawn Springs by Karen Guregian of The Boston Herald

Retired Reds Sox pitcher Curt Schilling was a well-known note taker. Between innings during his starts, he was often seen scribbling hitters’ tendencies in a notebook.

“Anybody that is any good in any profession - I’m not talking about good, I’m talking about the best in the world - they pay attention to detail at some level or some facet of the job that no one else does,” Schilling once said.

It should come as no surprise, then, that former Pro Bowl cornerback Shawn Springs also keeps a journal. And during his 12 seasons in the NFL, the Patriots’ newly acquired defensive back has pieced together quite a log on receivers he’s covered.

Easy to take note of Springs' Success by Chris Price of WEEI

In a high-tech world, Shawn Springs is a low-tech cornerback.

While other players rely solely on film work or some other sort of game video to try and gain an edge on an opponent, the veteran cornerback, who signed with the Patriots on March 11, is decidedly retro when it comes to his preparation. When he needs to get an edge, he goes to his notebook.

Not Macintosh. More like Trapper Keeper.

“I keep notes on all receivers over the years. I’ve developed notes on all receivers,” the 34-year-old Springs said after Thursday’s minicamp session on the practice field behind Gillette Stadium. “So when I’ve played Randy [Moss], I’ve had a game plan against him. Whether it was Marvin Harrison or going way back to Jimmy Smith or Chad Johnson. That’s one of the things -- I’m a big note taker.”

 

[jmt57]

One more short article on Bodden (and Paris Lenon):

Hey, Leigh and Paris, welcome to winning by Jeff Howe of Boston Metro

“I just wanted to go to a winning program,” said Bodden, a six-year veteran who has never played in the playoffs. “I didn’t want to go pretty much in the same direction. I decided to come here, and I was happy that they wanted me as well.”

 

[Ring 6]

Would you really sign up a corner from an 0-16 team to a contract longer than 1 year? - I wouldn't

Bodden had a subpar year last season,its not like he was a world beater at stopper at corner on that pathetic team,the only player who showed up in games last season for the Lions seemed to be Calvin Johnson but he didn't have a QB to throw it to him. - Its simply a show me year for Leigh and if he is decent I would'nt worry about the future.

No disrespect intended, but how many Lions games did you watch last year?
What are you basing your opinion that 0-16 means 52 of 53 players didn't 'show up'?

 

[PATRIOTSFANINPA]

No disrespect intended, but how many Lions games did you watch last year?
What are you basing your opinion that 0-16 means 52 of 53 players didn't 'show up'?

I saw 2 games of the Lions last year,one on Thanksgiving of course and no player on that defense was any better than the other in stopping the opposing offense - Does that mean Bodden will not be any better on this team? - No

But there are no guarantees he will either,Lets get him in pads and adjusted to this defense then we will know but still I don't give a player who is not a superstar more than a 1 year deal until he shows his stuff in his new home.