Out On A Limb Regarding Linebackers

[mgteich]

INSIDE LINEBACKER
We are fine for the forseeable future with Thomas, Mayo and Guyton. For 2009, we still have Bruschi inside. We need a developmental fourth for the future. Hopefully, that is McKenzie. In the meantime, we will have six OLB's and 3 ILB's, with Thomas moving inside in case of injury and in certain situations. Obviously, at least two of the OLB's will take lost of reps as special team specialists, as backup linebackers always do.

OUTSIDE LINEBACKERS
I think that there will be an addition in the next month. I also think that Belichick sees the future in Crable, Redd, Woods and even Banta-Cain.

BOTTOM LINE
We are still in transition at linebacker. This year should see the last year of Bruschi and further development of Mayo, Guyton, Crable, and Redd. Woods And Tully may stay after 2009 or not. They are fine special teamers. We should see another free agent addition. First there was Vrabel. Then there was Thomas and now there is ........

 

[PATRIOT64]

I think you are going on a limb with Guyton,While Mayo seems to be the real deal I think Guyton may not be as good as you might think, he appears to me to be sporadically good but I would like to see what he can do more often on the field this year. - IMO Don't think ahead too fast about GG

 

[mgteich]

I expect Thomas and Mayo to start in 2010, with Guyton as a situational backup.
I expect Bruschi and Mayo to start in 2009, with Guyton sharing the load with Bruschi.
I don't think this is too much to expect from Guyton.
And the reality is that there will be another backup here for 2009 and another for 2010.

I think you are going on a limb with Guyton,While Mayo seems to be the real deal I think Guyton may not be as good as you might think, he appears to me to be sporadically good but I would like to see what he can do more often on the field this year. - IMO Don't think ahead too fast about GG

 

[tanked_as_usual]

with who they have, thomas is outside.....period........he's the only one they have who has any kind of pass rush.......the rest of the OLB's are currently flotsam

the pats are in worse shape this year than they were in 2005 with bruschi out

 

[RayClay]

INSIDE LINEBACKER
We are fine for the forseeable future with Thomas, Mayo and Guyton. For 2009, we still have Bruschi inside. We need a developmental fourth for the future. Hopefully, that is McKenzie. In the meantime, we will have six OLB's and 3 ILB's, with Thomas moving inside in case of injury and in certain situations. Obviously, at least two of the OLB's will take lost of reps as special team specialists, as backup linebackers always do.

You had to move our outside linebacker in and plug in an unproven FA. Yeah, we're set forever.

OUTSIDE LINEBACKERS
I think that there will be an addition in the next month. I also think that Belichick sees the future in Crable, Redd, Woods and even Banta-Cain.

Make that two additions if you're going to move our only proven starter at OLB to ILB. That's one unproven draft pick, two FAs and a proven failure. yeah, guess we'll be all set with another almost retired player plugged in.

BOTTOM LINE
We are still in transition at linebacker. This year should see the last year of Bruschi and further development of Mayo, Guyton, Crable, and Redd. Woods And Tully may stay after 2009 or not. They are fine special teamers. We should see another free agent addition. First there was Vrabel. Then there was Thomas and now there is ........

BOTTOM LINE We have two proven starters plus a soon to be retired one. We will be in a transition once we decide what we're transitioning to.

 

[patsfan-1982]

with who they have, thomas is outside.....period........he's the only one they have who has any kind of pass rush.......the rest of the OLB's are currently flotsam

the pats are in worse shape this year than they were in 2005 with bruschi out

i argee if the young guys dont step up and they have to move AD inside they are better off mixing in a lot more of the 4-3 i think they are deeper at D line then they are at LB

 

[MoLewisrocks]

If AD is an OLB at $6.4M, he is an OLB at $9.4M and $10.4M. He is not being paid to play ILB here on a regular basis. Yes, he was moved inside to learn the scheme in his first season, because we had the luxury to do so with Colvin on the roster. But it is not his best use. And unless push comes to shove you don't weaken two positions to cover one. Bill will develop, draft or trade for or sign out of FA another ILB in 2010. And even if Taylor has 2 seasons left in him he will also either be developing, drafting or trading for (or signing a FA) OLB come 2010. This year it remains Bruschi, Mayo and Guyton inside and AD and the proverbial player to be named later (Woods/Crabble or Taylor) opposite him. Otherwise Vrabel plays out the string at his $4M cap hit. Makes no sense to have traded him UNLESS someone already on the roster projects to deliver equal bang for far fewer bucks OR the bucks he would have commanded can be used to acquire far more bang.

 

[signbabybrady]

I think you are going on a limb with Guyton,While Mayo seems to be the real deal I think Guyton may not be as good as you might think, he appears to me to be sporadically good but I would like to see what he can do more often on the field this year. - IMO Don't think ahead too fast about GG

obviously we all expect great things from Mayo. But I see no reason not to expect good things from Guyton. He is really fast and performed well his rookie year. I expect him to get better.

 

[Ring 6]

I think there is a fact of life that everyone seems to want to ignore.
Our 2nd ILB plays half the time at most. WIth Mayo the long term answer as the primary ILB, we will not move Thomas inside, we will not draft an ilb high, we will not sign a major FA ILB. It is a part-time player at that position.
In the history of BBs defenses all the way back to the Giants the 2nd ILB has almost always been a JAG. That isnt changing. Think Gary Reasons, Steve DeOssie, Ted Johnson, etc.
At OLB I think there is talent there that we have not fully seen enough to evaluate but BB is way ahead of us on.

 

[pats63]

I think there is a fact of life that everyone seems to want to ignore.
Our 2nd ILB plays half the time at most. WIth Mayo the long term answer as the primary ILB, we will not move Thomas inside, we will not draft an ilb high, we will not sign a major FA ILB. It is a part-time player at that position.
In the history of BBs defenses all the way back to the Giants the 2nd ILB has almost always been a JAG. That isnt changing. Think Gary Reasons, Steve DeOssie, Ted Johnson, etc.
At OLB I think there is talent there that we have not fully seen enough to evaluate but BB is way ahead of us on.

I agree with you,brother.Bill is so far ahead of us.I am pretty sure he done this before.

 

[RoughingthePasser]

Gary Guyton could start-PERIOD.

He was a great acquisition and will play along side Mayo.

When I read the ranking of our defensive players on this board-I really feel some of the opinions are inaccurate.

This is a good thread though and appreciate you firing it up. This is certainly an area we need to consider but I think we'll work all that out in camp.

We should get more help

 

[stinkypete]

with who they have, thomas is outside.....period........he's the only one they have who has any kind of pass rush.......the rest of the OLB's are currently flotsam

I agree with the first part of this statement. Thomas is the team's OLB passs rush.

the pats are in worse shape this year than they were in 2005 with bruschi out

Um, a little panicked here? The 2005 team was starting Brown and Beisel. I understand that Guyton and Woods are JAGs by the powerful, mid-decade LB standards, but they have already proven to be better than Brown and Beisel.

 

[pats63]

We haven't seen much of Crable.Why would Verbal trade?Bill knows something we don't.I think he is not going take a chance of drafting or signing FA(taylor or Peppers) without a plan in mind.

 

[RoughingthePasser]

We haven't seen much of Crable.Why would Verbal trade?Bill knows something we don't.I think he is not going take a chance of drafting or signing FA(taylor or Peppers) without a plan in mind.

I have seen Crable play and he will hopefully develop into a starter.

 

[RoughingthePasser]

with who they have, thomas is outside.....period........he's the only one they have who has any kind of pass rush.......the rest of the OLB's are currently flotsam

the pats are in worse shape this year than they were in 2005 with bruschi out

Thomas is our leading OLB on paper, according to what we've seen (performance) and pay.
I agree that currently he is our leading pass rusher BUT to not include him in some inside support would be ridiculous.

You're incorrect though. The rest of our crew IS NOT flotsam. That is incorrect coach.

 

[Jimke]

Gary Guyton was good enough and smart enough to beat out a

veteran linebacker for a roster spot. Unless he levels off in 2009,

he should be even better and receive more playing time.

 

[mgteich]

Apparently, Belichick certainly does not see a great weakness at OLB. He definitely does not see Woods, Crable, Banta-Cain and Redd as flotsam.

Yes, there is always room for improvement and taking advantage of opportunties (as Taylor could be), but Belichick surely can't be counting on Taylor AND no injuries. He didn't bring in anyone but Banta-Cain in free agency. Belichick cut Robertson indicating that there was no room. He didn't draft ANY outside linebackers, not even on Day Two.

I really think that Belichick is well-satisfied with what he has. That being said, Woods and Banta-Cain are signed only for 2009. My suspicion is that he likes Crable and Redd alot.

 

[Jimke]

Apparently, Belichick certainly does not see a great weakness at OLB. He definitely does not see Woods, Crable, Banta-Cain and Redd as flotsam.

Yes, there is always room for improvement and taking advantage of opportunties (as Taylor could be), but Belichick surely can't be counting on Taylor AND no injuries. He didn't bring in anyone but Banta-Cain in free agency. Belichick cut Robertson indicating that there was no room. He didn't draft ANY outside linebackers, not even on Day Two.

I really think that Belichick is well-satisfied with what he has. That being said, Woods and Banta-Cain are signed only for 2009. My suspicion is that he likes Crable and Redd alot.

The wildcard at outside linebacker may be Redd. He is 6:6 and
260 pounds. Before he played at Liberty, he played for Al Groh at
Virginia. He has the size that BB likes on the outside.

 

[JoeSixPat]

INSIDE LINEBACKER
We are fine for the forseeable future with Thomas, Mayo and Guyton. For 2009, we still have Bruschi inside. We need a developmental fourth for the future. Hopefully, that is McKenzie. In the meantime, we will have six OLB's and 3 ILB's, with Thomas moving inside in case of injury and in certain situations. Obviously, at least two of the OLB's will take lost of reps as special team specialists, as backup linebackers always do.

OUTSIDE LINEBACKERS
I think that there will be an addition in the next month. I also think that Belichick sees the future in Crable, Redd, Woods and even Banta-Cain.

BOTTOM LINE
We are still in transition at linebacker. This year should see the last year of Bruschi and further development of Mayo, Guyton, Crable, and Redd. Woods And Tully may stay after 2009 or not. They are fine special teamers. We should see another free agent addition. First there was Vrabel. Then there was Thomas and now there is ........

I think you may have made a pre-draft report that essentially indicated that this team was in good shape with all its starters set BEFORE the draft.

Our depth has improved since then but I think all this talk about the NEED for an LB is exaggerated.

I think depth and future development is what we're talking about - and while I'd like to have more, barring injury (which is easier said than done) I'm not overly concerned about LB in 2009.

 

[RayClay]

Gary Guyton was good enough and smart enough to beat out a

veteran linebacker for a roster spot. Unless he levels off in 2009,

he should be even better and receive more playing time.

Who did he beat out?