So who exactly did the BB regime ever develop slowly and successfully?

[Fencer]

BB has a reputation for bringing players along slowly and making eventual stars of them. When I look for examples of that, however, the list I come up with is basically:

• Tom Brady
• Matt Cassel
• Asante Samuel
• David Givens (not a big star, but clearly a great value)
• Stephen Neal (ditto)

Who else, if anybody, am I missing? Seymour, Warren, Wilfork, Mayo, Light, Mankins, Koppen, and others all played significant roles their first seasons. Others -- especially lots of OL and LBs -- did well on STs or as reserves, but hardly became stars.

Is this story perhaps a bit exaggerated?

 

[ropese]

How about James Sanders?

 

[ropese]

Well, I guess with Sanders and a few others its making them into solid starters, not neccessarily stars.

 

[BradyFTW!]

You could maybe toss Brandon Meriweather in there, though that's kinda borderline. He showed flashes early, but didn't become a big-time contributor until late in his second season.

 

[efin98]

How about James Sanders?

He was constantly on the borderline cut area last preseason and his game films last year are a case of what not to do for a defensive back...he isn't a success, he's a borderline failure at this point.

 

[efin98]

Brady doesn't belong on there due to the specifics of his situation...he's in a situation all of his own.

 

[DarrylS]

How about:

Ellis Hobbs a former 3rd round pick
Mike Vrable a st player for Pittsburgh

 

[Fencer]

How about:

Ellis Hobbs a former 3rd round pick
Mike Vrable a st player for Pittsburgh

IIRC, Vrabel was playing a lot right away, and effectively. In particular, his pressure on Warner led to a key INT in the Super Bowl.

 

[Fencer]

Brady doesn't belong on there due to the specifics of his situation...he's in a situation all of his own.

Actually, the whole QB position is a case of its own when it comes to player development. Can you think of another position where a #1 overall pick isn't just assumed to be a likely Opening Day starter?

 

[DarrylS]

IIRC, Vrabel was playing a lot right away, and effectively. In particular, his pressure on Warner led to a key INT in the Super Bowl.

But he saw the talent and gave him the opportunity to excel..

 

[JackBauer]

He was constantly on the borderline cut area last preseason and his game films last year are a case of what not to do for a defensive back...he isn't a success, he's a borderline failure at this point.

Which is why they just resigned him to a three year contract?

Here's a dollar. Buy yourself a clue.

 

[AzPatsFan]

He was constantly on the borderline cut area last preseason and his game films last year are a case of what not to do for a defensive back...he isn't a success, he's a borderline failure at this point.

A "bordeline failure" who signed a contract for $3 million a year. Yeah Sure...

 

[Fencer]

But he saw the talent and gave him the opportunity to excel..

That's a different point.

My point in starting this thread is that there's an impression the Pats spend years spinning straw into gold, especially in Professor Dante's O-Line Academy.

I suspect that, while there's some truth to it, it's overstated.

 

[AzPatsFan]

How about:

Ellis Hobbs a former 3rd round pick
Mike Vrable a st player for Pittsburgh

And...

Asante Samuels a 4th round pick average fro his first two seasons
Pierre Woods an UDFA, now a starter at SOLB
Mike Wright an UDFA and a prime reserve DE, NT
Lonnie Paxton an UDFA now the highest paid LS
And of course the best for last...
Matt Cassel 7th round non player in college, The $60 million dollar man.

 

[efin98]

IIRC, Vrabel was playing a lot right away, and effectively. In particular, his pressure on Warner led to a key INT in the Super Bowl.

That's the point, until he came to New England he was essentially just a special teams guy who made some difference on defense but was mostly unnoticed.

He had more tackles his first year here than he had in four years in Pittsburgh combined, to go along with his anemic six sacks and three forced fumbles...the system here made his career.

 

[efin98]

A "bordeline failure" who signed a contract for $3 million a year. Yeah Sure...

And how many times did he get burned badly last year? How many TDs did he give up?

He barely made the cut last year and may not make it this year with someone there who can actually play safety drafted, I call that a failure.

 

[JackBauer]

And how many times did he get burned badly last year? How many TDs did he give up?

I don't know; since you seem privy to this information, why don't you tell us?

He barely made the cut last year ...

You know this, how?

... and may not make it this year with someone there who can actually play safety drafted, I call that a failure.

Completely and utterly preposterous. First, Chung has shown he can play safety... in college. In case you hadn't noticed, NFL football is an entirely different echelon. Second, everything BB has ever said about Sanders has been both positive and effusive (by BB standards). Third, even if Chung pans out, which I believe he will, Sanders will never be cut because there's simply not that much behind him in terms of depth.

Oh, and lest I forget. Do you really, really think they would have inked him to a three year deal, at a respectable salary no less, if there were any chance at all they were considering cutting him later on before/during the season? I mean, use your head.

 

[efin98]

And...

Asante Samuels a 4th round pick average fro his first two seasons
Pierre Woods an UDFA, now a starter at SOLB
Mike Wright an UDFA and a prime reserve DE, NT
Lonnie Paxton an UDFA now the highest paid LS
And of course the best for last...
Matt Cassel 7th round non player in college, The $60 million dollar man.

Wright and Woods lucked into playing with all the injuries to the defense, I would hardly put them into the group yet. Hell I don't even think Woods will be around after training camp. Wright may be on the rise, but I'm not sold on him yet. He could be the next Chris Sullivan but it is too early to tell.

I'll give one to counter my claim on them to be nice...Tully Banta-Cain, 7th rounder who went on to sign for decent money with San Fransisco.

How about Heath Evens, they sign him and he goes on to be one of the best blocking fullbacks in the league saving his career.

 

[JSn]

You can't keep changing the rules of a posting game...

Slow development, to me, is any player who is not a Day One Starter but who becomes a solid player by year's end or early the following.

I will go ahead and add Guyton to that list. I would not be the least bit surprised if he's starting opposite Mayo by week #6. I know we have added bodies at the position, but his growth and motivation are following similar lines to Mayo's (obviously not at the same speed).

To me, if a guy is game-day inactive or late-rotational and is able to competently play majority downs be season's end, you've seen a player brought along carefully and "slowly."

 

[JackBauer]

Hell I don't even think Woods will be around after training camp.

So, despite the fact they didn't draft an OLB this year, you think they're going to cut their best OLB after Adalius Thomas?