Is Cassel's future determined already?

[JSn]

Piecing some news and semi-reliable rumours together, I'm going to say I think there's a very good chance Herm is out of KC today and Shanny is in by Monday. Shanny's demands, since he will not be the personnel guy will be certainly include a better calibre of QB (this includes consistency) and can you think of anyone?

If a fresh start for Pioli and Shanny means cleaning up the Offense I think we're looking at a pick and an aging player for Cassel to KC.

So my prediction, on record and up for revisitation, is Cassel to KC for picks/and or players, being coached by Shanny.

**Edit: PFT is stealing some of my thunder, bastiches.
http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/01/22/herm-out-shanahan-in/

 

[BelichickFan]

Shanahan has had different kinds of QB, Elway and Cutler with flat out guns but then he did go with Plummer who didn't have a big arm. One things is consistent, he needs a QB who can move the pocket with his legs and Cassel certainly has that ability.

 

[BradyManny]

For some reason, I'd be surprised if Pioli traded for Cassel, or rather, if we can't get more from another team for Cassel.

For one, Pioli, based on experience, probably has confidence he can draft and develop a QB now. He's seen it work, he knows what to look for in a QB.

And second - to some extent, Pioli might not value Cassel to the same level as other GMs. I'm sure Pioli has the inside knowledge just to how much Cassel owes some of his success to Moss/Welker/Brady/McD/BB/the offense and all the other factors involved, whereas other GMs would not know, and may be more apt to ignore those issues and ship us more picks to obtain Cassel's services.

 

[BelichickFan]

For some reason, I'd be surprised if Pioli traded for Cassel, or rather, if we can't get more from another team for Cassel.

For one, Pioli, based on experience, probably has confidence he can draft and develop a QB now. He's seen it work, he knows what to look for in a QB.

And second - to some extent, Pioli might not value Cassel to the same level as other GMs. I'm sure Pioli has the inside knowledge just to how much Cassel owes some of his success to Moss/Welker/Brady/McD/BB/the offense and all the other factors involved, whereas other GMs would not know, and may be more apt to ignore those issues and ship us more picks to obtain Cassel's services.

The reason I think Cassel won't go to KC is it might have the look of Pioli having to run home to daddy to get himself a QB; I think Pioli is better off separating from trading for Patriots - that said, in the Peter King interview on WEEI he used the words "Pioli loves Cassel" although he may not have meant it as strongly as it sounded.

Cassel to Minnesota is still the perfect match IMO.

 

[Deus Irae]

Well, the Chiefs board has news/rumors backing up the Shanahan half of your equation:

Chiefs Jack Harry says it's Shanarat - ChiefsPlanet

Chiefs Shanahan's son: Mike will sign with the Chiefs - ChiefsPlanet

Time will tell on that, and it would definitely make things interesting in that division.

 

[j00fek]

yes, tb is the qb and cassel will be traded to rebuild the d

 

[upstater1]

KC will give us at best a second rounder for Cassell. They won't trade their first to us for him.

 

[Dagg]

I dont see Cassell as a HUGE upgrade to that kid they have now(drawing a blank on his name), and he is good scrambler as well. The difference isnt enough to warrant the cost to get Cassell.

 

[BradyManny]

The reason I think Cassel won't go to KC is it might have the look of Pioli having to run home to daddy to get himself a QB; I think Pioli is better off separating from trading for Patriots - that said, in the Peter King interview on WEEI he used the words "Pioli loves Cassel" although he may not have meant it as strongly as it sounded.

Cassel to Minnesota is still the perfect match IMO.

I agree 100%. I think it would be awkward if Pioli pulled off a trade for Cassel. I'm sure Pioli is a huge Cassel fan and appreciates what he did for the team. But I also think Cassel's value nationally skyrocketed so much that it moved past what the Patriots would value him at and - by extension, Pioli, following the Patriot way.

For instance, lets say Cassel gets 20 mill guaranteed, I don't see BB or Pioli giving him that.

Cassel to Minny makes a lot of sense, and it would also be nice to get him out of the AFC. I don't think Cassel is going to put Minny over the top either, so we're OK in that regards too. Minny might think Cassel will put them over the top, however, and fork over quite a bit for him.

Personally, I really think that whatever team hands over day 1 draft picks and a huge contract for Cassel might not quite end up satisfied with how he performs outside of New England, but that remains to be seen. I guess for a lot of these QB-starved teams, he will be a huge upgrade.

 

[signbabybrady]

I dont see Cassell as a HUGE upgrade to that kid they have now(drawing a blank on his name), and he is good scrambler as well. The difference isnt enough to warrant the cost to get Cassell.

Your thinking of Thigpen...

If I am Pioli I would probably draft a QB in the 2nd or 3rd and go with Thigpen for a year or two because the kid has a big arm and give him time and he may develope into a nice QB and they don't have to give up picks for him.


Even if Pioli decided he wants Cassel that would not mean Cassels future is determined because that would still leave Pioli having to pay the pyper and if he isn't willing to part with his one he may not be the high bidder and his one may just be a little to high to use in the deal.

 

[tanked_as_usual]

I don't think there would be any awkwardness in dealing cassel to the chiefs.....it would be almost seamless, and the pats will likely not face the chiefs for another couple of years

as long as the price is fair, I think it would be the smart thing to do........there's nothing like coming up with a mutually beneficial deal between pals.... where 2 decision-makers between non-rivals can work off each other to help each other's rosters.....the gloves only have to come off when they play each other

 

[Deus Irae]

I dont see Cassell as a HUGE upgrade to that kid they have now(drawing a blank on his name), and he is good scrambler as well. The difference isnt enough to warrant the cost to get Cassell.

I'd imagine that Cassel's 'actual' level is the big question for every team looking for a quarterback.

 

[ScottieC]

KC will give us at best a second rounder for Cassell. They won't trade their first to us for him.

So you have already talked to Pioli about this today?

Ask him how the weather is in KC.

 

[JSn]

So you have already talked to Pioli about this today?

Ask him how the weather is in KC.

No one will get a first-round quality QB for a second rounder.

Second rounder plus LJ and Gonzo? Done deal.

 

[Nunchucks]

Pioli trading for Cassel would be a risky GM move. A move that could put his new job at risk. The safe bet would be to just do what he thinks is right without giving making such a risky trade.

However, the great GMs take the risks and let those risks define them. The trading for Cassel could turn Pioli into a KC god...or make him a laughing stalk.

 

[Mangold74]

No one will get a first-round quality QB for a second rounder.

Second rounder plus LJ and Gonzo? Done deal.

I'm really curious to see if Cassell can play when he doesn't have 4 seconds in the pocket and two of the best recievers in the NFL. I really think he's an unknown at this point. I will give him props for the job he did this year. Considering the circumstances he played very well.

But Cassell beat the Chiefs, Jets, Fins, Bills, Bills, Rams, Seahawks, Cardinals (they didn't even show up), 49ers, Broncos, and Broncos.

He lost to the Chargers, Jets, Fins, Colts and Steelers.

The three good teams the Pats actually played this year the Chargers, Colts and Steelers they lost.

Cassel might turn out to be a good qb but based on this year he's drastically overrated. I'm sure as Pats fans that what you want so you can get as much for him as possible.

 

[mgcolby]

No one will get a first-round quality QB for a second rounder.

Second rounder plus LJ and Gonzo? Done deal.

They can keep LJ! I don't want his sorry ass running in New England!

 

[BradyManny]

I'm really curious to see if Cassell can play when he doesn't have 4 seconds in the pocket and two of the best recievers in the NFL. I really think he's an unknown at this point. I will give him props for the job he did this year. Considering the circumstances he played very well.

But Cassell beat the Chiefs, Jets, Fins, Bills, Bills, Rams, Seahawks, Cardinals (they didn't even show up), 49ers, Broncos, and Broncos.

He lost to the Chargers, Jets, Fins, Colts and Steelers.

The three good teams the Pats actually played this year the Chargers, Colts and Steelers they lost.

Cassel might turn out to be a good qb but based on this year he's drastically overrated. I'm sure as Pats fans that what you want so you can get as much for him as possible.

Cassel went from drastically underrated to somewhat overrated. It's all about expectations. This team has great receivers, a great offensive line, and great offensive coaching. The notion that suddenly the offense would be anemic without Brady never sat right with me. Maybe two years ago, sure, the offense would've been a disaster without Brady. 06, for instance.

My expectations for Cassel were higher, and I expected this team to go 12-4 with him. With those expectations, I do not consider him an elite QB in the league, but an above average one. There are people who were jumping off bridges after the first few weeks of him starting who now think he's near Brady/Manning level. Again, its all about expectations.

How other GMs fit in that regard will be intriguing. All that said, there's no doubt Cassel has a lot of great attributes and could help a lot of teams.

 

[Deus Irae]

I'm really curious to see if Cassell can play when he doesn't have 4 seconds in the pocket and two of the best recievers in the NFL. I really think he's an unknown at this point. I will give him props for the job he did this year. Considering the circumstances he played very well.

But Cassell beat the Chiefs, Jets, Fins, Bills, Bills, Rams, Seahawks, Cardinals (they didn't even show up), 49ers, Broncos, and Broncos.

He lost to the Chargers, Jets, Fins, Colts and Steelers.

The three good teams the Pats actually played this year the Chargers, Colts and Steelers they lost.

Cassel might turn out to be a good qb but based on this year he's drastically overrated. I'm sure as Pats fans that what you want so you can get as much for him as possible.

How the hell can anyone claim he's overrated when nobody has any idea of how coaches have him rated?

 

[upstater1]

So you have already talked to Pioli about this today?

Ask him how the weather is in KC.

That's for the snide remark, it's much appreciated.

In no way, shape or form, was I suggesting that the #3 pick in the ENTIRE draft is more valuable than a 1 year QB who is looking for a big payday.

Nope, I wasn't doing that. To do that would require a discussion with Scott Pioli, and since I don't have him on speed dial, it would be smart not to offer my opinion that the #3 choice in the entire draft is much too valuable for a 1 year QB.

Thank you for pointing out what is required.