New Thought Exercise

[dryheat44]

I, for one, am tired with qualifying all of the teams needs post with "pending free agency signings" or something similar. You know what? Let's just include free agency signings as well. In other words, construct your ideal Patriots roster for 2009, including FA signings and draftees. Be realistic...we're not going to sign every marquee FA in the league. I'll delineate a few scenarios -- Franchise tags have been given to Nnamdi Asomugha, TJ Houshmanzadeh, Karlos Dansby, Terrell Suggs, & Channing Crowder. You can have them, but it'll cost you two #1s. We'll assume their teams won't match. In addition, Brian Dawkins, Albert Haynesworth, and Julius Peppers sign extensions with their current teams, so they're off the market entirely. Lastly, Brady shows up at TC 100% healthy, taking most of the practice reps and running sprints with everybody else.

Some links that may help: Miguel's UNOFFICIAL 2009 Patriots Salary Cap Information Page
KFFL - 2009 NFL Free Agents

The KFFL site is a good index for free agents, but isn't 100% complete.

Now to go kill an hour!

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Are we building a 53 man roster or an 80 man roster?

 

[dryheat44]

Are we building a 53 man roster or an 80 man roster?

Wow...aren't you ambitious? I was thinking 53, but don't let me stop you if you want to include the TC competition.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

Wow...aren't you ambitious? I was thinking 53, but don't let me stop you if you want to include the TC competition.

I just find it difficult to even think about the 53 at this point in the process.

 

[bakes781]

Just because a FA to be has been slapped with a franchise tag doesn't automatically mean he'll cost another team 2 first rounders. We already know the Pats have indicated their intentions of tagging Matt Cassel & we all know that we're not going to get 2 first rounders. Obviously the idea behind it is to give them time to negotiate a sign & trade. Now yes those players would likely cost at least a 1st, so a trade for one of them is not likely going to happen with the Patriots.

With that said I would like to see the Patriots go after the other Ravens UFA LB, Bart Scott.

It's still a little early for me to think even semi-intelligently about the upcoming NFL draft.

 

[dryheat44]

Incidently both Monty Beisel and Duane Starks are unrestricted free agents. Just so you know.


Edit** The salary cap is killing me!

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Just because a FA to be has been slapped with a franchise tag doesn't automatically mean he'll cost another team 2 first rounders. We already know the Pats have indicated their intentions of tagging Matt Cassel & we all know that we're not going to get 2 first rounders. Obviously the idea behind it is to give them time to negotiate a sign & trade. Now yes those players would likely cost at least a 1st, so a trade for one of them is not likely going to happen with the Patriots.

With that said I would like to see the Patriots go after the other Ravens UFA LB, Bart Scott.

It's still a little early for me to think even semi-intelligently about the upcoming NFL draft.

This Bart Scott?

Do not want.

 

[cstjohn17]

Damn this is tough, once the franchise tag is applied to Cassel there is very slim pickings via free agency (less than $5M). There could be some real surprise cuts / trades (Vrabel retires, Faulk gets cut or Seymour is traded).

For those who think the Patriots should get younger, this is the year. With the cap restrictions they are going to need a monster draft.

The theme for the 2009 offseason will be "Prepare to be underwhelmed". No block buster signings, the core of the team remains and they should be in the upper class of the league.

Here is my first crack....

QB Brady, Gutierrez, O'Connell,
LWR Aiken, Slater,
RWR Moss, Washington,
SWR Welker,
LT Light, LeVoir,
LG Mankins, Yates,
C Koppen, Mack,
RG Neal,
RT Kaczur, Boone, O'Callaghan,
TE Watson, Thomas, Pascoe,
FB Branson,
RB Morris, Faulk, Maroney,

Defense
RDE Seymour, Green,
DT Wilfork, Suh,
LDE Warren, Smith,
ROLB Thomas, Cushing, Redd,
RILB Guyton, Bruschi,
LILB Mayo, Appleby,
LOLB Vrabel, Woods, Crable,
LCB Wilhite, Wheatley,
SS Sanders, Harrison, Ventrone,
FS Meriweather, Johnson, Spann,
RCB Hobbs, Mickens,

Special Teams
P Morstead,
K Gostkowski,
LS Paxton,

------------------------------------------------------------
Draft rankings are based on expert lists and my gut feel

Draft
1 Cushing, OLB, USC
2 Suh, DT/DE, Nebraska
2 Mickens, CB, Cincinnati
2 Mack, C/G, Cal
3 Johnson, FS, Alabama
3 Boone, OT, Ohio State
4 Appleby, ILB, Virginia
5 Pascoe, TE, Fresno State
6 Morstead, P, SMU
7 Branson, FB, Central Arkansas

------------------------------------------------------------

Veteran FAs ($ expressed in millions)
Cassel $14.00 Franchise, then traded for two #2s (2009, 2010)
Sanders $1.10 3 years $3.3 M
Paxton $0.80 veteran min
Harrison $1.00

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

This Bart Scott?

Do not want.

Best announcing team I heard that season and I second your vote, Scott can go to Dallas, they need a peace maker like that for their team.

 

[mcsully]

I'm not a cap guru and my numbers might be way off but I'm going to take a crack at this

1. Franchise Cassel - Yes you tie up a large amount of money in the QB position but the ability to pluck one or two draft picks from someone is tempting. I would specifically contact Detriot, Tampa, Chicago and the Vikings, probably around the Senior Bowl and advise them of Cassels availabilty.. (these seem like the likely targets)

2. Advise all said teams that by Feb 5th you best have your deal in place cause Cassel will be shippd out on the 6th.. Of course this revolves around his agent getting a deal done with his new team but I would trade his rights by no later than feb 6. I say this because Free Agency has just started and we'll free up the money.
Regarding the payment for Cassel, I think they can obtain
a. 2009 1st round pick between 18-23 picks (see said teams)
b. grab 3rd or 4th pick that moves up to 2nd or 3rd based on playing time
c. stay away from top 5 picks, to much money

*** the dates can be played with but you get my drift.. Set a deadline on the best offer ***



3. Speak to Wilfork and explain once the Cassel situation is resolved, his contract will be extended. I'd give him Warren type money.

3. Now this is iffy cause I'm not sure how this works but my understanding is as follows. Extending Richard Seymour would save us on the cap now, knock down the 9 million dollar cap figure.. Of course I might be wrong on this but that # needs to come down

4. Basing the players DRYheat44 Franchised or signed up, I'd stay away from each one. I'm a draft pick whore and wouln't give them up for any of those players

5. I'd sign James sanders to a friendly home discount. If he was offered more money else where, I'd let him walk.. to me he's jsut another JAG and would be my 3rd Safety

6. I'd go hard for Sean Jones. 6-1, 210 pounds.. He can play near the line and play deep and makeup space.. He's avg's about 5 int's the past few years.. He's a solid tackler and seems to understand the game.

7. Regarding the draft, I'm not sure how or what to pick.. But I've left the team with 8 picks in the first 4 rounds.. I would lean more towards defense (CB, LB and DL) but take a shot at RB and OL

8. Oh yea, cut D O'neal.. Can't stand him..

9. Draft a punter to compete with Hanson..

 

[ctpatsfan77]

2. Advise all said teams that by Feb 5th you best have your deal in place cause Cassel will be shippd out on the 6th.. Of course this revolves around his agent getting a deal done with his new team but I would trade his rights by no later than feb 6. I say this because Free Agency has just started and we'll free up the money.

The period for franchising players is 2/5 to 2/19. Free agency doesn't start until 2/27(ish).

 

[BradyManny]

I, for one, am tired with qualifying all of the teams needs post with "pending free agency signings" or something similar. You know what? Let's just include free agency signings as well. In other words, construct your ideal Patriots roster for 2009, including FA signings and draftees. Be realistic...we're not going to sign every marquee FA in the league. I'll delineate a few scenarios -- Franchise tags have been given to Nnamdi Asomugha, TJ Houshmanzadeh, Karlos Dansby, Terrell Suggs, & Channing Crowder. You can have them, but it'll cost you two #1s. We'll assume their teams won't match. In addition, Brian Dawkins, Albert Haynesworth, and Julius Peppers sign extensions with their current teams, so they're off the market entirely. Lastly, Brady shows up at TC 100% healthy, taking most of the practice reps and running sprints with everybody else.

Some links that may help: Miguel's UNOFFICIAL 2009 Patriots Salary Cap Information Page
KFFL - 2009 NFL Free Agents

The KFFL site is a good index for free agents, but isn't 100% complete.

Now to go kill an hour!

Nice, I like the line of thinking. My roster building always gets bogged down in the "well, James Sanders MAY be back, but I can't put him in YET" type stuff.

I've been trying to come up w a realistic ball park # of open spots to get an idea of how many draft picks in 09 have a shot of making it. I think I'll do it your way and just pencil in my own opinions rather than have positions half-filled and asterik'd with disclaimers about our own FA and RFAs.

 

[dryheat44]

Damn this is tough, once the franchise tag is applied to Cassel there is very slim pickings via free agency (less than $5M). There could be some real surprise cuts / trades (Vrabel retires, Faulk gets cut or Seymour is traded).

For those who think the Patriots should get younger, this is the year. With the cap restrictions they are going to need a monster draft.

You're not kidding. The good news is I was able to re-sign Mike Wright. The bad news was that I did it because after extending Wilfork, Mankins, and Gostkowski, Seymour refused to re-structure and I had to cut him. And I couldn't find a way to afford Asomugha, assuming that even if he was traded for, we'd need to come up with a package nearing Samuels's. I'm also counting on getting a pick in the first three rounds as part of the compensation for Cassel. Here's the 53:

QB Tom Brady
QB Kevin O'Connell
QB Matt Gutierrez
RB Laurence Maroney
RB Sammy Morris
RB Kevin Faulk
RB Heath Evans (re-signed to 2 year deal)
RB BenJarvus Green-Ellis
WR Randy Moss
WR Wes Welker
WR Bobby Engram (FA Seattle - one year deal)
WR Sam Aiken
TE Ben Watson
TE David Thomas
TE Chase Coffman (Draft Pick)
OL Matt Light
OL Logan Mankins
OL Dan Koppen
OL Stephen Neal
OL Nick Kaczur
OL Russ Hochstein (re-signed to two-year deal)
OL Mark LeVoir
OL Ryan O'Callaghan
OL Max Unger (Draft Pick)
DL Vince Wilfork
DL Ty Warren
DL Mike Wright (re-signed to three-year deal)
DL Jarvis Green
DL Titus Adams
DL LeKevin Smith
DL Ndamkong Suh (Draft Pick)
LB Adalius Thomas
LB Mike Vrabel
LB Pierre Woods
LB Shawn Crable
LB Vince Redd
LB Tedy Bruschi
LB Jerod Mayo
LB Gary Guyton
LB Andra Davis (FA Cleveland - two year deal)
CB Ellis Hobbs
CB Jonathan Wilhite
CB Terrence Wheatley
CB Alphonso Smith (Draft Pick)
CB Mike Richardson
S Brandon Meriweather
S Sean Jones (FA Cleveland - four year deal)
S Antwain Spann
S Patrick "Eugene" Chung (Draft Pick)
K Stephen Gostkowski
P Shane Lechler (FA Oakland - two year deal)
LS Lonie Paxton (re-signed to two-year deal)
SAK Matthew Slater

Hey...half an hour until I can go home...awesome.

 

[bakes781]

I can live with the idea of losing Seymour. The DL depth with Jarvis Green certainly helps, but I think there's a good chance that Seymour will go back to being a PUP every other year once he gets a long term deal.

 

[BradyManny]

I'm going to look to others for inspiration first before posting my 53, here's some reactions to what's above...

DryHeat...The roster looks strong. What kind of salary do you see Sean Jones getting? Personally, I still am penciling Sanders and then drafting a safety who can be a 3rd safety in nickel immediately and long-term answer as a starter (just as Meriweather was). I also don't have us spending for an ILB, maybe I'm just too thrifty, rather than Andra Davis, I'd rather get Spikes in the draft.

cstjohn17...Also like the looks of this, though depth at ILB looks like an issue to me. I'm still not ready to hand over SILB full-time to Guyton, even though earlier in the year I was. I'm not convinced, as I said above, I'd love to get Spikes and then I'd feel pretty comfortable between Mayo-Spikes-Guyton. That'd be an exciting group of young ILBs.

 

[cstjohn17]

I'm going to look to others for inspiration first before posting my 53, here's some reactions to what's above...

DryHeat...The roster looks strong. What kind of salary do you see Sean Jones getting? Personally, I still am penciling Sanders and then drafting a safety who can be a 3rd safety in nickel immediately and long-term answer as a starter (just as Meriweather was). I also don't have us spending for an ILB, maybe I'm just too thrifty, rather than Andra Davis, I'd rather get Spikes in the draft.

cstjohn17...Also like the looks of this, though depth at ILB looks like an issue to me. I'm still not ready to hand over SILB full-time to Guyton, even though earlier in the year I was. I'm not convinced, as I said above, I'd love to get Spikes and then I'd feel pretty comfortable between Mayo-Spikes-Guyton. That'd be an exciting group of young ILBs.

Not every position can be perfect, my thoughts were that AD would slide over to ILB in certain situations. So the LBs would look like Cushing, Thomas, Mayo and Vrabel. This is only try 1, I will update continuously.

 

[cstjohn17]

You're not kidding. The good news is I was able to re-sign Mike Wright. The bad news was that I did it because after extending Wilfork, Mankins, and Gostkowski, Seymour refused to re-structure and I had to cut him. And I couldn't find a way to afford Asomugha, assuming that even if he was traded for, we'd need to come up with a package nearing Samuels's. I'm also counting on getting a pick in the first three rounds as part of the compensation for Cassel. Here's the 53:

Free Agents
RB Heath Evans (re-signed to 2 year deal)
WR Bobby Engram (FA Seattle - one year deal)
OL Russ Hochstein (re-signed to two-year deal)
DL Mike Wright (re-signed to three-year deal)
LB Andra Davis (FA Cleveland - two year deal)
S Sean Jones (FA Cleveland - four year deal)
P Shane Lechler (FA Oakland - two year deal)
LS Lonie Paxton (re-signed to two-year deal)

Draft
TE Chase Coffman (Draft Pick)
DL Ndamkong Suh (Draft Pick)
CB Alphonso Smith (Draft Pick)
S Patrick "Eugene" Chung (Draft Pick)

Hey...half an hour until I can go home...awesome.

Glad you got it done before the deadline!

Losing Seymour would hurt more than people think, but I am open to trading him if absolutely necessary.

This looks very optimistic to me, not sure we can sign all those players but I like it.

Nice job.

 

[billdog3484]

For those who think the Patriots should get younger, this is the year. With the cap restrictions they are going to need a monster draft.

The theme for the 2009 offseason will be "Prepare to be underwhelmed". No block buster signings, the core of the team remains and they should be in the upper class of the league.

i agree 100%. i would love to add Suggs if he ever became available, but i am not sure we can do it. if we get a first round pick for cassel, which i believe we will get (and possibly a 3rd), we can really get young this offseason. if we can pick up an OLB, OL, and DB in the first 2 rounds, that would be amazing (and we have another 2nd rounder). we have such a great opportunity this offseason to totally reload and get younger, more talented and faster. im really excited about our future. maybe we could trade one of our 2nd rounders for a 1st rounder next year and consider picking Brady's eventual replacement in the '010 draft who would be ready by '013 or '014 when Brady turns 36/37.

 

[bakes781]

I believe Kevin O'Connell was selected in the 3rd round last year with the idea that HE is Brady's eventual replacement.

 

[Box_O_Rocks]

...Seymour refused to re-structure and I had to cut him.

:ugh: igsfly: