Browns officially request permission to interview Pioli [Update: Granted]

[Fencer]

Cleveland is about as good as it's going to get for him. As said above, reasonably supportive ownership and fans. Enough offensive talent that bringing in McDaniels makes sense. RAC available for an Assistant Head Coach job, which would be perfect to pair w/ McDaniels. (RAC seems to have stayed classy enough that that would actually work.)

I hope he stays here even so, his mixed track record in recent drafts and contract negotiations notwithstanding.

 

[mgcolby]

We'll probably see a similar statement like this one soon: Statement from Patriots V.P. of Player Personnel Scott Pioli

If Pioli didn't leave and take $3 mil per year for 5 yrs from the Seahawks and he didn't take the job from the team he grew up following (NY Giants), I don't see him going anywhere this time either. I'm also assuming that he signed a 5 yr deal w/the Pats back in 2005 when Seattle came calling: Patriots ink extension with Pioli

Pioli and BB have constantly driven in the point to their players that it's not about money, it's about winning and working with people you respect. I think Brady illustrates that point in this piece: All Things Scott Pioli: Story Archive




Imo, Pioli stays.

I think Pioli stays or at least I hope he does. But IMO, Pioli would only go to a situation where he had total control to include naming his coach. Seattle had Holmgren and the Giants had Coughlin. Two coaches that have been GM/Coaches before and have strong personality not to mention big egos.

Why go to a situation where you may end up fighting with your coach. Cleveland is a clean slate situation and it may be tempting for him.

 

[BPF]

I think Pioli stays or at least I hope he does. But IMO, Pioli would only go to a situation where he had total control to include naming his coach. Seattle had Holmgren and the Giants had Coughlin. Two coaches that have been GM/Coaches before and have strong personality not to mention big egos.

Why go to a situation where you may end up fighting with your coach. Cleveland is a clean slate situation and it may be tempting for him.

Good point on the Browns situation being a chance for him to have a fresh start where he can hire his own coach and set up the organization as well but you may be forgetting some of the details on those past job offers. He would have had complete control with those as well.

The Seahawks were coming off a 9-7 season and a 1st Rd loss in the playoffs and the news around that time was that Holmgren was doing too much and they wanted someone to run the show. He could have kept Holmgren or fired him, Pioli would have complete control.

On the Giants, they were coming off an 8-8 season and a 1st Rd loss to the Eagles and the rumblings were that after a 2-6 finish to the season that Coughlin was out. This was after they went 11-5 the previous season but were shut out at home in the 1st Rd by the Panthers 23-0. Coughlin might be entrenched there now but at that point criticism was coming from all around and players were even openly criticizing him to the press.

Nice read on the Pats philosophy for those interested, from Jan 30, 2005: Concord Monitor - Patriots winning on the cheap

 

[tedylb]

Everyone has a price (I know I do), but I think SP may stay, even if he is offered a lot more than he's making now because...

1. He's at the top of his profession in NE, getting very little heat i from its intrusive media and fans.
2. All things being equal, who would pick Cleveland over NE as a place to live, work, raise a family?

I'm guessing the major motivator for him to move is the challenge of turning crap into gold. They do have great fans there, and if SP did turn the team around, he'd be an immortal up there with Paul and Jim Brown and Otto Graham. Maybe it's wishful thinking, but I don't think it's enough to call the moving vans.

 

[BradyFTW!]

Cleveland is about as good as it's going to get for him. As said above, reasonably supportive ownership and fans. Enough offensive talent that bringing in McDaniels makes sense. RAC available for an Assistant Head Coach job, which would be perfect to pair w/ McDaniels. (RAC seems to have stayed classy enough that that would actually work.)

I hope he stays here even so, his mixed track record in recent drafts and contract negotiations notwithstanding.

Two overpaid, unproven QBs, high-paid TE and WR who may or may not be headcases, no first round pick.

I don't disagree with what you pointed out, but there's another side to it, too.

 

[Rob0729]

Cleveland is about as good as it's going to get for him. As said above, reasonably supportive ownership and fans. Enough offensive talent that bringing in McDaniels makes sense. RAC available for an Assistant Head Coach job, which would be perfect to pair w/ McDaniels. (RAC seems to have stayed classy enough that that would actually work.)

I hope he stays here even so, his mixed track record in recent drafts and contract negotiations notwithstanding.

I think pairing McDaniels and Crennel with Crennel in the supporting role is a recipet for disaster. Crenel is far too popular with the Browns players (by most accounts) and too experienced to be working under a first time head coach in Cleveland. I think the only way he could come back to Cleveland and be an assistant to a head coach is under an experience head coach with a lot of authority (ie Cowher).

 

[mgteich]

The other side to taking a GM job is that there are personnel issues to solve?

Two overpaid, unproven QBs, high-paid TE and WR who may or may not be headcases, no first round pick.

I don't disagree with what you pointed out, but there's another side to it, too.

 

[mgcolby]

Good point on the Browns situation being a chance for him to have a fresh start where he can hire his own coach and set up the organization as well but you may be forgetting some of the details on those past job offers. He would have had complete control with those as well.

The Seahawks were coming off a 9-7 season and a 1st Rd loss in the playoffs and the news around that time was that Holmgren was doing too much and they wanted someone to run the show. He could have kept Holmgren or fired him, Pioli would have complete control.

I think firing Holmgren would have been a PR nightmare for the organization. But obviously that is simple conjecture on my part. Who knows what would have happened.

On the Giants, they were coming off an 8-8 season and a 1st Rd loss to the Eagles and the rumblings were that after a 2-6 finish to the season that Coughlin was out. This was after they went 11-5 the previous season but were shut out at home in the 1st Rd by the Panthers 23-0. Coughlin might be entrenched there now but at that point criticism was coming from all around and players were even openly criticizing him to the press.

Nice read on the Pats philosophy for those interested, from Jan 30, 2005: Concord Monitor - Patriots winning on the cheap

I remember that, good points nonetheless. I was just pointing out what I thought might have steered him away. Another poster above made some good points about the Lions job, but who knows. It is an interesting discussion, although one I wish we weren't having. But you can't blame a guy for atleast considering breaking out on his own.

Just an FYI for those considering RAC as part of the coaching staffi if Pioli went to cleveland: According the Plain Dealer RAC isn't interested in coming back to the Browns in any capacity other than the HC. So I don't think he would be able to get RAC back and I would be shocked if Pioli would even consider Mangini for a position on the staff.

 

[DaBruinz]

Two overpaid, unproven QBs, high-paid TE and WR who may or may not be headcases, no first round pick.

I don't disagree with what you pointed out, but there's another side to it, too.

I think that Derek Anderson is a proven commodity. He's a step up from a jag. Kellen Winslow, i believe, is on his way out due to options in his contract. I think you are incorrect about the draft pick, though. I believe they still have this years.

Also, being that Crennel was just fired from Cleveland, its highly unlikely that he'd return there in any capacity. Since Savage is gone and Cowher turned down the position, there aren't a lot of candidates out there. Particularly if Pioli rejects the deal.

 

[Sean Pa Patriot]

Exactly.

Losing Pioli would be a HUGE blow to the Patriots. Not an insurmountable one, but damn, it would hurt.

I think if Pioli leaves its a huge organization blow, We could be near the end of what has been something special, that is why ever game counts..

 

[BPF]

I think if Pioli leaves its a huge organization blow, We could be near the end of what has been something special, that is why ever game counts..

I think it would be a blow but with BB and Kraft ownership one we could overcome. The NFL is all about about succeeding in a changing environment. Teams/organizations have to not only plan for change, but also plan for what they want to get out of those changes if they do happen. Is there a plan in place if Pioli does depart? I bet there is. Also BB is not afraid to lead through change, so I feel confident that the Pats will continue to be succesful.

 

[SVN]

Exactly.

Losing Pioli would be a HUGE blow to the Patriots. Not an insurmountable one, but damn, it would hurt.

if he is offered a bill parcells kinda role to run everything in the org , he might take the challenge.

 

[VJ11]

Granting permission for an interview is nothing more than the usual courtesy. Kraft has granted permission to other teams for interviews in the past. And in all cases, Pioli did the interview and then concluded that it wasn't the right situation for him, for various reasons which have been mentioned in earlier messages in this discussion.
The Cleveland situation could be very interesting: roster needs some serious work, finding a new HC who can see eye-to-eye with Pioli, and diving into the scouting dept to prepare for the draft. I could see trouble with finding the right HC, and I don't know how well the Browns college scouting dept is organized.
He has the luxury of turning every job down that doesn't seem to be perfect, since he has a (more or less) perfect situation going on in New England.

 

[BelichickFan]

Scout.com: New England Show the Hot Ticket

"We have been told that Belichick expects Pioli to leave the NE organization - soon."

FWIW the guy who the info came from has a solid track record.

I wonder if Belichick would be interested in Phil Savage who's a solid personnel guy but needs Belichick to show him how to keep his mouth shut

 

[BradyFTW!]

The other side to taking a GM job is that there are personnel issues to solve?

Right, but if you don't have draft picks, how are you going to solve them? Dimitroff is being hailed as a genius right now, but don't you think things would be a little different if he hadn't had the draft pick that made him able to make a great decision in picking Matt Ryan?

Whoever ends up GMing the Browns won't have this opportunity, since Savage traded picks away to win this year. Instead, he ended up with a roster full of underperformers, question-marks at practically every position but LT, and a lack of draft picks to fix the problem.

 

[blackglass3]

I just don't get the Mangini part. Who in thier right mind would hire him?

 

[Deus Irae]

Scout.com: New England Show the Hot Ticket

"We have been told that Belichick expects Pioli to leave the NE organization - soon."

FWIW the guy who the info came from has a solid track record.

I wonder if Belichick would be interested in Phil Savage who's a solid personnel guy but needs Belichick to show him how to keep his mouth shut

Given the email situation, I'm not sure Savage is congenitally capable of keeping his mouth shut.

 

[BradyFTW!]

How many of us knew who Dimitroff was before last year? Maybe some of you did, but I honestly didn't. My point, I guess, is that even if Pioli does leave, I'm sure that there's someone capable in-house who can do the job pretty effectively.

 

[BelichickFan]

Given the email situation, I'm not sure Savage is congenitally capable of keeping his mouth shut.

I know, he does have a Belichick connection from Cleveland, though, and is a highly regarded player personnel guy. Unfortunately he also seems to like the limelight and he may not easily be able to remove himself from it.

 

[AzPatsFan]

Re: Browns officially request permission to interview Pioli

whoever signs pioli will have to give him 100% control of the organization......and the owner will have to play the part of a half-drunk, non-meddling fan of the team

jerry jones/dan snyder/ other meddlers with strange habits like not talking in front of camera's need not apply............the owner will really need to be non-existent in day to day operations (other than the checkbook)

in my opinion, likely places for pioli might include: chiefs, seahawks, packers......and do not be suprised to see crennel the coach wherever pioli winds up.........part of the problem with the browns was that crennel wasn't always on the same page as savage.......the duo could do some damage somewhere else......

the good news about crennel getting canned (as well as mangini) is that there are 2 roster of 3-4 defenses that may be converted to 4-3, making certain types of players the pats covet more available......it was not a good year for the ultimate success of 3-4 teams this season

I hadn't noticed. Besides the Pats and Steelers, and Baltimore but not exclusively, and the Dolphins and Cowboys who else is there there that plays the 3-4, beside the Browns and Jerks??

Does that cover most of the top half of the defensive clubs in the league or not?