Cassel vs. the Vaunted Vet Backup

[TheGodInAGreyHoodie]

Re: Cassel vs the Vaunted Vet Backup

Lets be realistic. What has Cassel done that ANY other crap QB can't do? The throws he makes are essentially the "easy stuff": Screens, slants, dump offs. The knock on him is that he is incapable of (or just sucks at) doing the stuff that guys get paid money to do, like create time in the pocket, make down field reads, deliver the ball in traffic, interprete coverages QUICKLY and make good on field decisions.

By the way, I judge the Pats on the upper 25% of what the other teams are doing, not the bottom 75%. So lets compare him to the top backups: Garcia, Ferrotte, Carr, Collins, etc. I would take ANY ONE OF THEM over him. The ONLY THING he has going right now is knowledge of the system. PERIOD. And this is BB's fault. We should have been carrying a veteran the last 4 years.

PS He also is at the helm of a group of guys that were one of the most prolific offenses in history. Keep that in mind when comparing him to Brady of 2001. Welker/Moss vs. Troy Brown/Patten, Watson vs. Wiggins...

Yes, the Patriots have talent. But so do the Cowboys. Brad Johnson couldn't win with a wr like TO.

What can Cassel do that say Sage Rosethal can't do? Protect the f'en ball.

Just out of curiosity who should the Patriots not signed to pay this Vet. The guys you listed cost at least $1 million more than Cassel. So do we not sign Welker or not sign Moss last year to pay for this back up QB?

 

[Nunchucks]

Re: Cassel vs the Vaunted Vet Backup

Yes, the Patriots have talent. But so do the Cowboys. Brad Johnson couldn't win with a wr like TO.

What can Cassel do that say Sage Rosethal can't do? Protect the f'en ball.

Just out of curiosity who should the Patriots not signed to pay this Vet. The guys you listed cost at least $1 million more than Cassel. So do we not sign Welker or not sign Moss last year to pay for this back up QB?

Wade Philips+Jerry Jones+Owens vs Bill Belichick

Cassel has thrown interceptions and fumbled the ball, so your comparison isn't very good....besides...what can Sage do that Matt can't do? Read NFL defenses, make reads, keep his eyes down field and throw the ball deep with confidence..

Lets not also forget that the Texans are a far cry from the patriots in a lot ofways.

 

[Lampshade]

Re: Cassel vs the Vaunted Vet Backup

Lets be realistic. What has Cassel done that ANY other crap QB can't do? The throws he makes are essentially the "easy stuff": Screens, slants, dump offs. The knock on him is that he is incapable of (or just sucks at) doing the stuff that guys get paid money to do, like create time in the pocket, make down field reads, deliver the ball in traffic, interprete coverages QUICKLY and make good on field decisions.

By the way, I judge the Pats on the upper 25% of what the other teams are doing, not the bottom 75%. So lets compare him to the top backups: Garcia, Ferrotte, Carr, Collins, etc. I would take ANY ONE OF THEM over him. The ONLY THING he has going right now is knowledge of the system. PERIOD. And this is BB's fault. We should have been carrying a veteran the last 4 years.

PS He also is at the helm of a group of guys that were one of the most prolific offenses in history. Keep that in mind when comparing him to Brady of 2001. Welker/Moss vs. Troy Brown/Patten, Watson vs. Wiggins...

The first paragraph is precisely the criticisms levelled at the newly starting Tom Brady.

Other than experience what do Frerotte and Kerry Collins have that Matt Cassel doesn't? Frerotte is completing 57% of passes, and Collins 56%. David Carr? Really? Jeff Garcia is not a backup.

 

[Lifer]

Re: Cassel vs the Vaunted Vet Backup

Lets be realistic. What has Cassel done that ANY other crap QB can't do? The throws he makes are essentially the "easy stuff": Screens, slants, dump offs. The knock on him is that he is incapable of (or just sucks at) doing the stuff that guys get paid money to do, like create time in the pocket, make down field reads, deliver the ball in traffic, interprete coverages QUICKLY and make good on field decisions.

By the way, I judge the Pats on the upper 25% of what the other teams are doing, not the bottom 75%. So lets compare him to the top backups: Garcia, Ferrotte, Carr, Collins, etc. I would take ANY ONE OF THEM over him. The ONLY THING he has going right now is knowledge of the system. PERIOD. And this is BB's fault. We should have been carrying a veteran the last 4 years.

PS He also is at the helm of a group of guys that were one of the most prolific offenses in history. Keep that in mind when comparing him to Brady of 2001. Welker/Moss vs. Troy Brown/Patten, Watson vs. Wiggins...

So you named 4 backups you'd rather have..out of 32. That is a pretty darn good backup QB. 4-2 with a QB rating of 86.8.

dare to say not ANY "crap QB" can do that.

Name me 16 or more backup QB's that are better, and back it up with something, like stats, and then maybe you would have even a chance at having a point.

 

[Iron Helmet]

Re: Cassel vs the Vaunted Vet Backup

Yes, the Patriots have talent. But so do the Cowboys. Brad Johnson couldn't win with a wr like TO.

What can Cassel do that say Sage Rosethal can't do? Protect the f'en ball.

Just out of curiosity who should the Patriots not signed to pay this Vet. The guys you listed cost at least $1 million more than Cassel. So do we not sign Welker or not sign Moss last year to pay for this back up QB?

Sage Rosenfels can make down field throws. Sage was responsible for moving the offense WITH HIS ARM. Not with dump offs and screens which rely on someone other than the QB to make a play. He made plays. Cassel has made 1 or 2 plays in 6 games.

Your arguement that 1 million would be the difference between signing Moss/Welker is assinine. Its more like whether they would sign a guy like Lynch or that LB from the Jets we cut...or how about not signing Antonio Bryant? I think I'd live without them to sleep better at night that THE MOST IMPORTANT POSITION on the field is in good hands.

 

[Nunchucks]

Re: Cassel vs the Vaunted Vet Backup

The first paragraph is precisely the criticisms levelled at the newly starting Tom Brady.

Other than experience what do Frerotte and Kerry Collins have that Matt Cassel doesn't? Frerotte is completing 57% of passes, and Collins 56%. David Carr? Really? Jeff Garcia is not a backup.

!) That simply isn't true, the crisitism leveled at Brady at the start of his career was he couldn't throw the ball deep and he had a weak arm.

2)hall of fame WR, pro bowl WR, hall of fame coach..IDK that might make a difference or two.

Don't get me wrong, I am rooting for Cassel, I want him to suceed, but lets not mislead ourselves

 

[Clonamery]

Re: Cassel vs the Vaunted Vet Backup

!)

Don't get me wrong, I am rooting for Cassel, I want him to suceed, but lets not mislead ourselves

You're funny....ALL of your posts belie that fact, missy.

 

[Nunchucks]

Re: Cassel vs the Vaunted Vet Backup

You're funny....ALL of your posts belie that fact, missy.

I am just posting what I see and what I think. I don't think Cassel is a very good NFL caliber QB ATM, I think that there were better options available at the beginning of training camp.


I root for Cassel when he plays, I want him to do well, I cheer loudly when he throws the ball or even throws the ball away instead of take a sack.

Just because I am critical doesn't mean I want him to fail. I want him to suceed, because I love the Patriots.

 

[Iron Helmet]

Re: Cassel vs the Vaunted Vet Backup

So you named 4 backups you'd rather have..out of 32. That is a pretty darn good backup QB. 4-2 with a QB rating of 86.8.

dare to say not ANY "crap QB" can do that.

Name me 16 or more backup QB's that are better, and back it up with something, like stats, and then maybe you would have even a chance at having a point.

When he is throwing dump offs, screens and slants....hell, my local High School QB could do that. Like I said, talent wise he has shown nothing other than accuracy within 10 yards. The stat Monday night was that his is like 25% over 10 yards...then you wonder why he can't move the ball...smoke a bone!

 

[Lampshade]

Re: Cassel vs the Vaunted Vet Backup

!) That simply isn't true, the crisitism leveled at Brady at the start of his career was he couldn't throw the ball deep and he had a weak arm.

2)hall of fame WR, pro bowl WR, hall of fame coach..IDK that might make a difference or two.

Don't get me wrong, I am rooting for Cassel, I want him to suceed, but lets not mislead ourselves

1. I'm sorry, but this is another thing you are misremembering. Up until 2004 fans from all other teams were saying Brady can only throw screens, Brady is only successful because of YAC.

2. 5 game starter. That also makes a difference.

 

[Nunchucks]

Re: Cassel vs the Vaunted Vet Backup

1. I'm sorry, but this is another thing you are misremembering. Up until 2004 fans from all other teams were saying Brady can only throw screens, Brady is only successful because of YAC.

isn't that what I said?

 

[ctpatsfan77]

Re: Cassel vs the Vaunted Vet Backup

How many teams in the league have the talent, the attitude in the locker room and the coaching staff that the Patriots have?

How would those vet QBS perform on the Patriots? I don't know.


Cassel has done enough to bring the Patriots to 4-2.....hopefully he can overcome his obvious faults as he learns how to play the position in the NFL.

Well, Steve Young and Ron Jaworski were convinced after Monday night that Cassel has the tools to be "a very good QB in this league," and they see signs of improvement as the season has progressed.

 

[patchick]

Re: Cassel vs the Vaunted Vet Backup

By the way, I judge the Pats on the upper 25% of what the other teams are doing, not the bottom 75%. So lets compare him to the top backups: Garcia, Ferrotte, Carr, Collins, etc.

When it comes to backup QBs, I think quality works the opposite of how you suggest. You court highly paid backups when you don't have confidence in your starter -- and as a top backup, you look for situations where you're likely to have a chance to play. Therefore a Brady or Manning isn't likely to have a Collins or Garcia behind him.

 

[Iron Helmet]

Re: Cassel vs the Vaunted Vet Backup

Yeah...and I remember Brady looking like Cassel

His release was quick, his read were quick, and there were times when he took the whole team on his shoulders and carried the day to a victory. See Chargers game...he threw like 55 times. If we are in a position where Cassel needs to do this, my confidence level is very low. I hope he proves me wrong, but based on what my eyes see, I am just calling it like I see it.

 

[patchick]

Re: Cassel vs the Vaunted Vet Backup

I think that there were better options available at the beginning of training camp.

Fair enough -- who?

 

[Seacoast Fan]

Re: Cassel vs the Vaunted Vet Backup

From Reiss's mailbag:

Entering Monday night's game, 12 NFL teams had called on a backup quarterback to either start a game, or enter a scoreless game in the first quarter. Eight of those teams have losing records in those situations. So I think it's clear that when teams have to go to their backup, it's usually bad news.


Wait, could you take this a little slower....lets see...when team loses its starting QB and has to use a backup...its usually ...what?? Bad news?? Jeez, go figure....

 

[Nunchucks]

Re: Cassel vs the Vaunted Vet Backup

Fair enough -- who?

I think Tim Rattay would have been a solid choice. Tim Hasselbeck, Trent Green was available I think. I don't know if any of these guys would have beat out Cassel, but to bring them in to compete at the start of training camp would have been a good move IMO.

There were quite a few others that could have competed for the backup job as well. sorry if I don't have a comprehensive list of guys available. I know the Patriots did have a list and decided not to bring these people in...I believe they took a calculated risk and one that would have proven an excellent one considering..

 

[Nunchucks]

Re: Cassel vs the Vaunted Vet Backup

From Reiss's mailbag:

Entering Monday night's game, 12 NFL teams had called on a backup quarterback to either start a game, or enter a scoreless game in the first quarter. Eight of those teams have losing records in those situations. So I think it's clear that when teams have to go to their backup, it's usually bad news.


Wait, could you take this a little slower....lets see...when team loses its starting QB and has to use a backup...its usually ...what?? Bad news?? Jeez, go figure....

I didn't realize that Patriots fans made excuses...the team certainly doesn't. Why don't you go and tell the Patriots that "its okay, Brady went down, you don't have to do well" and see how they react.

 

[Iron Helmet]

Re: Cassel vs the Vaunted Vet Backup

From Reiss's mailbag:

Entering Monday night's game, 12 NFL teams had called on a backup quarterback to either start a game, or enter a scoreless game in the first quarter. Eight of those teams have losing records in those situations. So I think it's clear that when teams have to go to their backup, it's usually bad news.


Wait, could you take this a little slower....lets see...when team loses its starting QB and has to use a backup...its usually ...what?? Bad news?? Jeez, go figure....

Did you fall asleep during math class? 8 out of 12 have losing records. That means 4 don't. 33%. I judge BB and this organization against that 33%. Not the bottom 66%. With your attitude, we'd be the Lions.

 

[TheGodInAGreyHoodie]

Re: Cassel vs the Vaunted Vet Backup

I didn't realize that Patriots fans made excuses...the team certainly doesn't. Why don't you go and tell the Patriots that "its okay, Brady went down, you don't have to do well" and see how they react.

Wow!

Are you stupid or just trying to be an a-hole.

Nobody is make excuses for having a winning record or being in playoff contention. But nobody promised a 16-0 season either.