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weswelker#83 · 11-17-2008, 10:12 AM

How an Amazonian tribe turned a missionary into an atheist
A RIVETING and hugely satisfying report on BBC Radio 4 today tells the story of a missionary who was charged by an American missionary group with taking the Gospel to the little understood Pirahãs tribe in the Amazon – only to realise how ridiculous his faith in Christianity was.

The Freethinker How an Amazonian tribe turned a missionary into an atheist

and
The power of speech | World news | The Guardian

Lifer · 11-17-2008, 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by weswelker#83

How an Amazonian tribe turned a missionary into an atheist
A RIVETING and hugely satisfying report on BBC Radio 4 today tells the story of a missionary who was charged by an American missionary group with taking the Gospel to the little understood Pirahãs tribe in the Amazon – only to realise how ridiculous his faith in Christianity was.

The Freethinker How an Amazonian tribe turned a missionary into an atheist

and
The power of speech | World news | The Guardian

I agree, faith in Christianity, or any "religion" is indeed ridiculous. Faith in Jesus Christ is what matters.

***Born_a_Patriot*** · 11-17-2008, 01:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lifer

I agree, faith in Christianity, or any "religion" is indeed ridiculous. Faith in Jesus Christ is what matters.

I have faith in God. Jesus is no more real to me than Santa Claus.

Lifer · 11-17-2008, 01:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Born_a_Patriot

I have faith in God. Jesus is no more real to me than Santa Claus.

Why is it when people who dont believe in Jesus, they call it ridiculous or question the persons intelligence. Athiests are free to believe what they want, as do people who believe in God but not Jesus, as do Jews, as do Muslims, but you very rarely hear a Christian calling those people stupid or ridiculous.

If people are on such strong footing with their beliefs, why the need to ridicule or to spend more time tearing down a belief instead of promoting their own?

Believe what you want, but id be more apt to consider your position if you told me something positive about why you believe what you do instead of whats so stupid about mine.

And by the way, I tell my Christian friends the same thing, maybe i dont do it perfectly, but now I try and focus on the Good news of Jesus Christ rather than telling others the Bad News of their ways.

But maybe im assuming too much. Perhaps Wes will post his personal testimony of how athiesm has changed his life. Then it wont be just a person slamming something, it would be positive exchange of sincere beliefs and ideas.

weswelker#83 · 11-17-2008, 07:45 PM

The Guardian article was very informative.
It was interesting as to why he gave up his faith; and the repercussions of that decision were very sad, but predictable.
It was also interesting to see how his work dismissed a major theory on linguistics by a leading academic, and how that academic would not concede that he may be wrong.

This explores faith on so many levels: the faith of the academic in his own work, the faith that the missionary lost, not to mention the faith of his wife that couldn't cope with conflict.

There is even a stab at consumerism, which now threatens tribal life. And the question as to who has the more advanced lifestyle.

Quote:

"It's wrong to try and convert tribal societies," he says. "What should the empirical evidence for religion be? It should produce peaceful, strong, secure people who are right with God and right with the world. I don't see that evidence very often. So then I find myself with the Pirahã. They have all these qualities that I am trying to tell them they could have. They are the ones who are living life the way I'm saying it ought to be lived, they just don't fear heaven and hell."

***Born_a_Patriot*** · 11-17-2008, 09:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lifer

Why is it when people who dont believe in Jesus, they call it ridiculous or question the persons intelligence. Athiests are free to believe what they want, as do people who believe in God but not Jesus, as do Jews, as do Muslims, but you very rarely hear a Christian calling those people stupid or ridiculous.

If people are on such strong footing with their beliefs, why the need to ridicule or to spend more time tearing down a belief instead of promoting their own?

Believe what you want, but id be more apt to consider your position if you told me something positive about why you believe what you do instead of whats so stupid about mine.

And by the way, I tell my Christian friends the same thing, maybe i dont do it perfectly, but now I try and focus on the Good news of Jesus Christ rather than telling others the Bad News of their ways.

But maybe im assuming too much. Perhaps Wes will post his personal testimony of how athiesm has changed his life. Then it wont be just a person slamming something, it would be positive exchange of sincere beliefs and ideas.

I never questioned your intelligence, but perhaps you were talking in general. I have no problem with people believing what they want to believe.

Christ doesn’t make sense to me. But we can live that discussion for another thread. If you start one up on why you believe in Christ I will tell you why I don’t.

Synovia · 01-30-2009, 02:23 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lifer

Why is it when people who dont believe in Jesus, they call it ridiculous or question the persons intelligence. Athiests are free to believe what they want, as do people who believe in God but not Jesus, as do Jews, as do Muslims, but you very rarely hear a Christian calling those people stupid or ridiculous.

If people are on such strong footing with their beliefs, why the need to ridicule or to spend more time tearing down a belief instead of promoting their own?

Believe what you want, but id be more apt to consider your position if you told me something positive about why you believe what you do instead of whats so stupid about mine.

And by the way, I tell my Christian friends the same thing, maybe i dont do it perfectly, but now I try and focus on the Good news of Jesus Christ rather than telling others the Bad News of their ways.

But maybe im assuming too much. Perhaps Wes will post his personal testimony of how athiesm has changed his life. Then it wont be just a person slamming something, it would be positive exchange of sincere beliefs and ideas.

He never slammed you or questioned your intelligence. He said he didn't believe.

You seem to take a lot of things personally that aren't aimed at you.

Wildo7 · 01-30-2009, 02:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lifer

Why is it when people who dont believe in Jesus, they call it ridiculous or question the persons intelligence. Athiests are free to believe what they want, as do people who believe in God but not Jesus, as do Jews, as do Muslims, but you very rarely hear a Christian calling those people stupid or ridiculous.

If people are on such strong footing with their beliefs, why the need to ridicule or to spend more time tearing down a belief instead of promoting their own?

Believe what you want, but id be more apt to consider your position if you told me something positive about why you believe what you do instead of whats so stupid about mine.

And by the way, I tell my Christian friends the same thing, maybe i dont do it perfectly, but now I try and focus on the Good news of Jesus Christ rather than telling others the Bad News of their ways.

But maybe im assuming too much. Perhaps Wes will post his personal testimony of how athiesm has changed his life. Then it wont be just a person slamming something, it would be positive exchange of sincere beliefs and ideas.

Atheists don't "believe" anything. They don't "believe" in faith. To assign generalizations to a group of people whose only common attribute is that they lack a belief in the supernatural is fallacious.

I don't need "atheism to change my life." I don't look for answers and pick them based on which one makes me the happiest. I care only about the truth.

Our society is inundated with religious propaganda. The only "positive" that can be touted about that is the intellectual freedom that comes with rejecting things just because others say they are so.

We don't have to play your game. We aren't a competing sect or religion. The christian persecution complex is quite entertaining though.

Lifer · 01-30-2009, 02:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Synovia

He never slammed you or questioned your intelligence. He said he didn't believe.

You seem to take a lot of things personally that aren't aimed at you.

I was speaking in general, these threads do not live in a vacuum. Maybe he can speak for himself.

anyway, im so glad these threads have been brought back to life. nothing like going over stuff talked about before thanksgiving.

Lifer · 01-30-2009, 02:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Wildo7

Atheists don't "believe" anything. They don't "believe" in faith. To assign generalizations to a group of people whose only common attribute is that they lack a belief in the supernatural is fallacious.

I don't need "atheism to change my life." I don't look for answers and pick them based on which one makes me the happiest. I care only about the truth.

Our society is inundated with religious propaganda. The only "positive" that can be touted about that is the intellectual freedom that comes with rejecting things just because others say they are so.

We don't have to play your game. We aren't a competing sect or religion. The christian persecution complex is quite entertaining though.

its a good thing you never "assign generalizations to a group of people", Wildo