Michael

Do you play poker on line? If so where and what is your take on it?

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HAMMERMILL

I play on ABSOLUTEPOKER,The most.
Have tried many of the others.
If just playing for fun sure,If playing for real money it must be done face to face my opinion.
It might be fun if a table could be reserved for "patsfans posters only"
Just for bragging rights(or maybe small dollars for the upkeep of the site or a agreed upon charity(such as miguels)Just a thought

Michael

When I play I play on pokerstars. I've tried all the major ones over the years but, pokerstars has the most free play. I have played 1000s of hours in casino poker rooms. When I lived in Las Vegas I played at The Orleans every day. The C0cktail waitresses use to bring me my S.Pellegrino with slice of lime without even asking me. That's when you know you've spent too much time in a poker room LOL. I still play at Foxwoods but, not nearly as often. Since it's an hour drive away.

The reason I asked the question was that I am convinced on-line poker is rigged. Yet, very few agree with my assessment. Which surprises me when you see the number of bad beats you see on-line. And how there is ALWAYS one seat that will win a ridiculously high percentage of the hands. People always say it happens in real poker too. And my experience is it happens sometimes but, not often. And certainly not every time you sit at a table. I played last night and one seat (and I'm not exaggerating here) won 15 out of the first 20 hands dealt. In another game one seat was dealt a straight flush and 4 of a kind 2 hands later. You will also go an hour without seeing a single pocket pair from anyone. then you are dealt QQ. And surprise 3 other players are dealt pocket pairs in the same hand and usually the one with 77 or 99 hits a set on the flop. The way on-line poker turns extraordinary events into the norm just baffles me how people can not think it has to be rigged.

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HAMMERMILL

Have lost with quad kings on line,but i still don't think it's rigged.
I do think the cards go in cycles,and you have to be patient (saving chips for that)
I too lived in vegas for a while and survived on cash games alone.
Just my opinion(on-line) but when your catching(over bet)when your not wait for someone else to do that.
Much harder to judge on line(almost have to play limit poker at a no limit table)for early play.
Still don't think it's rigged(although there can be exceptions)but still think the best poker is face to face.

Michael

Just played in a freeroll. I did not get 1 playable hand dealt to me. All 85 72 offsuit etc. Less than 10 minutes into it I get dealt JJ. I knew it was a set up but when the software is set to set you up you're going to lose no matter what. Notice that not only was the deal a complete set-up but the one player who had been winning (note stack) won again. But, it's random.

PokerStars Game #7663911299: Tournament #38701490, 200+15 Hold'em Pot Limit - Level I (10/20) - 2006/12/29 - 15:07:52 (ET)
Table '38701490 241' 9-max Seat #9 is the button
Seat 1: marcpool (1230 in chips)
Seat 2: Me [Name Changed] (1400 in chips)
Seat 3: dwpwife (2090 in chips)
Seat 4: slimpappy (1470 in chips) is sitting out
Seat 5: burnszy (1470 in chips) is sitting out
Seat 6: T.S. Elliot (1080 in chips) is sitting out
Seat 7: mike_earl (1480 in chips)
Seat 8: rumnet (1390 in chips)
Seat 9: Jack Doggie (1470 in chips) is sitting out
marcpool: posts small blind 10
Me [Name Changed]posts big blind 20
*** HOLE CARDS ***
Dealt to Me [Name Changed] [Jc Js]
dwpwife: raises 40 to 60
slimpappy: folds
burnszy: folds
T.S. Elliot: folds
mike_earl: raises 150 to 210
rumnet: calls 210
Jack Doggie: folds
marcpool: folds
Me [Name Changed]raises 700 to 910
dwpwife: calls 850
mike_earl: raises 570 to 1480 and is all-in
rumnet: calls 1180 and is all-in
Me [Name Changed]calls 490 and is all-in
dwpwife: calls 570
*** FLOP *** [Qh 2h 4d]
*** TURN *** [Qh 2h 4d] [6s]
*** RIVER *** [Qh 2h 4d 6s] [4c]
*** SHOW DOWN ***
dwpwife: shows [Kc Kd] (two pair, Kings and Fours)
mike_earl: shows [9s 9d] (two pair, Nines and Fours)
dwpwife collected 160 from side pot-2
Me [Name Changed]shows [Jc Js] (two pair, Jacks and Fours)
mike_earl is sitting out
dwpwife collected 30 from side pot-1
rumnet: shows [Td Qd] (two pair, Queens and Fours)
burnszy has returned
dwpwife collected 5570 from main pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 5760 Main pot 5570. Side pot-1 30. Side pot-2 160. | Rake 0
Board [Qh 2h 4d 6s 4c]
Seat 1: marcpool (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 2: Me [Name Changed] (big blind) showed [Jc Js] and lost with two pair, Jacks and Fours
Seat 3: dwpwife showed [Kc Kd] and won (5760) with two pair, Kings and Fours
Seat 4: slimpappy folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: burnszy folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: T.S. Elliot folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: mike_earl showed [9s 9d] and lost with two pair, Nines and Fours
Seat 8: rumnet showed [Td Qd] and lost with two pair, Queens and Fours
Seat 9: Jack Doggie (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)

The table then closed.

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sdaniels7114

Is there a way to stop one person from using multiple accounts and proxies to control 4 of the 5 seats at a particular table? It seems to me that if you stumble into that situation, you're going to get cleaned out and I don't see how the house could prevent it.

Michael

No there isn't. And that is another reason I would never play for real money on-line. You better believe there are groups from Russian mafia to frats here in the US that are all playing together. Either in the same room using a router and several computers or in different locations and talking via phone or IM. The poker sites should only allow you to choose what game you want to play and then randomly sit you. That would at least cut down on that. But, as long as they're using a stacked deck I don't think they really care who plays and where they play.

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Miguel

I used to play online. But I realized that I could read people's tells at home games pretty well so now I only play in home games or casinos.

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Keegs

I have been playing poker online for a while now.
Probably 4 years or so.

I've played at Pacific, Partypoker, Paradise and now Full Tilt.

Make a little money here and there but nothing great, unfortunately


it is NOT rigged.

The reason you see so many bad beats and ridiculous hands is b/c online you see so many more hands and get dealt so many more hands an hour. Online poker is several times faster than live poker, thus u see more hands, and the bad beats and ridiculous hands will come sooner and sooner.

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Michael

I've heard that rationale before. It still wouldn't explain why you constantly see 3 to 5 players all get pocket pairs and/or AK at the same time. After an hour of none getting a pocket pair suddenly you see this:


It also doesn't explain why 1 or 2 out of the 9 seats at EVERY table will win 50% or more of all hands dealt. People love to say they have seen that happen in real game too. And I agree. In the 1000s of hours of play in casino poker rooms I have seen people get hot. They win hand after hand. But, it was never the norm. On-line there is ALWAYS 1 or 2 seats at every table that just win hand after hand no matter how bad their starting cards or how few outs they have (i.e. only way they can win is to get one of two As left in the deck. And bingo A on the river).

Take a look at these hands in a row.

PokerStars Game #7719275204: Tournament #39200136, 300+20 Omaha Hi/Lo Pot Limit - Level XI (600/1200) - 2007/01/01 - 20:55:41 (ET
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Salty Wampus: shows [Ah Js 6d 2c] (HI: two pair, Aces and Deuces; LO: 6,4,3,2,A)
KAINER7: mucks hand
Salty Wampus collected 11700 from pot
Salty Wampus collected 11700 from pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 23400 | Rake 0
Board [2h Ac 7d 4d 3c]
Seat 1: der-sturm (small blind) folded on the Flop
Seat 2: wotrab (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 3: NE_Pats_54 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: jeanfe folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: KAINER7 mucked [4s 9s 9h 3h]
Seat 7: adman4 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: JonEThunders folded on the Flop
Seat 9: Salty Wampus (button) showed [Ah Js 6d 2c] and won (23400) with HI: two pair, Aces and Deuces; LO: 6,4,3,2,A

PokerStars Game #7719301061: Tournament #39200136, 300+20 Omaha Hi/Lo Pot Limit - Level XI (600/1200) - 2007/01/01 - 20:57:04 (ET)
Salty Wampus collected 12075 from pot
Salty Wampus: shows [4c 9c Js 2h] (HI: three of a kind, Nines)
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 12075 | Rake 0
Board [9s 6s Ts 9d]
Seat 1: der-sturm (button) folded on the Turn
Seat 2: wotrab (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 3: NE_Pats_54 (big blind) folded before Flop
Seat 4: eyefish2good folded on the Turn
Seat 5: jeanfe folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: KAINER7 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: adman4 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: JonEThunders folded on the Turn
Seat 9: Salty Wampus collected (12075)

PokerStars Game #7719331174: Tournament #39200136, 300+20 Omaha Hi/Lo Pot Limit - Level XI (600/1200) - 2007/01/01 - 20:58:43 (ET)
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Salty Wampus: shows [3c 3d 9d 7s] (HI: a straight, Six to Ten)
KAINER7: shows [Jd 3s Td 4c] (HI: a pair of Tens; LO: 8,7,6,4,3)
Salty Wampus collected 22175 from side pot
KAINER7 collected 22175 from side pot
adman4: shows [3h 5h As 2c] (HI: high card Ace; LO: 8,7,6,2,A)
Salty Wampus collected 27542 from main pot
adman4 collected 27541 from main pot
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 99433 Main pot 55083. Side pot 44350. | Rake 0
Board [6s 8h Tc 7d Qh]
Seat 1: der-sturm folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: wotrab (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: NE_Pats_54 (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 4: eyefish2good (big blind) folded on the Flop
Seat 5: jeanfe folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: KAINER7 showed [Jd 3s Td 4c] and won (22175) with HI: a pair of Tens; LO: 8,7,6,4,3
Seat 7: adman4 showed [3h 5h As 2c] and won (27541) with HI: high card Ace; LO: 8,7,6,2,A
Seat 8: JonEThunders folded on the Flop
Seat 9: Salty Wampus showed [3c 3d 9d 7s] a

PokerStars Game #7719431029: Tournament #39200136, 300+20 Omaha Hi/Lo Pot Limit - Level XII (1000/2000) - 2007/01/01 - 21:04:11 (ET)
Salty Wampus collected 17900 from pot
Salty Wampus: shows [Qs 3s 9h Ac] (HI: a straight, Eight to Queen)
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 17900 | Rake 0
Board [Ts Qc 5d Jd 8c]
Seat 1: der-sturm folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 2: wotrab folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: NE_Pats_54 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: eyefish2good (button) folded on the Turn
Seat 5: jeanfe (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 6: KAINER7 (big blind) folded on the River
Seat 7: adman4 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: JonEThunders folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 9: Salty Wampus collected (17900)

PokerStars Game #7719469063: Tournament #39200136, 300+20 Omaha Hi/Lo Pot Limit - Level XII (1000/2000) - 2007/01/01 - 21:06:17 (ET)
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 158700 | Rake 0
Board [Jc Ts Jh 3s 9c]
Seat 1: der-sturm mucked [As Th 5d Ah]
Seat 2: wotrab folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: NE_Pats_54 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: eyefish2good folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 5: jeanfe (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 6: KAINER7 (small blind) folded on the Flop
Seat 7: adman4 (big blind) folded on the Flop
Seat 8: JonEThunders folded on the Flop
Seat 9: Salty Wampus showed [8s 2s Jd 3c] and won (158700) with HI: a full house, Jacks full of Threes

PokerStars Game #7719541041: Tournament #39200136, 300+20 Omaha Hi/Lo Pot Limit - Level XII (1000/2000) - 2007/01/01 - 21:10:08 (ET)
*** SHOW DOWN ***
Salty Wampus: shows [Ts Th Ad Td] (HI: a full house, Tens full of Nines)
der-sturm: mucks hand
Salty Wampus collected 130800 from pot
No low hand qualified
*** SUMMARY ***
Total pot 130800 | Rake 0
Board [8h 9h 2d 9d Tc]
Seat 1: der-sturm mucked [7c Jc 5h Jh]
Seat 2: wotrab folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 3: NE_Pats_54 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 4: eyefish2good folded before Flop
Seat 5: jeanfe folded on the River
Seat 6: KAINER7 folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 7: adman4 (button) folded before Flop (didn't bet)
Seat 8: JonEThunders (small blind) folded before Flop
Seat 9: Salty Wampus (big blind) showed [Ts Th Ad Td] and won (130800) with HI: a full house, Tens full of Nines

You can't say with any certainty that "it's not rigged". I can't prove that it is. By my experience with real play with a real deck vs. what I see on-line has me convinced it is either rigged or at the very least very flawed and not remotely random.

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