The 2013 Prospect Thread

[Snake Eyes]

Originally Posted by Merril Hoge's Tie Knot

The new guy Joe Kruger

Joe Kruger vs BYU (2012) - YouTube

Very nice, he's got a nice jump off the line and is a handful for the O-linemen.

[manxman2601]

Originally Posted by mayoclinic

But Mackenzie says he sucks.

I'll tell you what I see in him which I don't like, and I saw it again in the Fiesta Bowl. When he rushes the passer, he only tries to speed rush the OT which means that he flies pass the QB but can get so far downfield that sometimes he's out of camera shot. Nick Perry did the same sort of thing in video I saw last year. Didn't like it then either. That's not necessarily a bad thing in and of itself, but I think that'll lead to some struggles in the NFL a) because QB's release quicker and he needs time to get back up to the QB and B) because NFL LT's will be able to sustain the block for longer. It also means that OC's can take advantage of the huge space he creates.

As a DE I'm not all that keen on him. as a 3-4 OLB I rate him slightly higher because he can at least drop into coverage. You wouldn't want him setting the edge though. As a 4-3 OLB, I think he's much much better because the assignments better suit his skillset; rush the passer, drop into coverage, chase down runners.

[manxman2601]

Originally Posted by Merril Hoge's Tie Knot

Sorry Manx, Joyner is NOT declaring.

https://twitter.com/Warchant_DC/stat...58770754551808

That's fine. Actually hoped he'd go back. In my mock for next year.

[mayoclinic]

Nice write up on Kent St. OL Brian Winters:

Kent State left tackle Winters set to begin pursuit of NFL career following GoDaddy.Com Bowl - The Record Courier

[mayoclinic]

Originally Posted by Merril Hoge's Tie Knot

Where would you play him Mayo?

Originally Posted by Snake Eyes

He won't be a DE at the next level but he will be able to neutralize a dominant TE in the passing game.

Originally Posted by manxman2601

As a DE I'm not all that keen on him. as a 3-4 OLB I rate him slightly higher because he can at least drop into coverage. You wouldn't want him setting the edge though. As a 4-3 OLB, I think he's much much better because the assignments better suit his skillset; rush the passer, drop into coverage, chase down runners.

I agree, I wouldn't use him as a full time line person. He doesn't have the strength or edge setting ability, and bulking him up to 275# or so would take time and would probably impair his fluidity. His best asset is his movement in space, and he's probably best as a 4-3 SLB. NE Patriots' Draft compared him to Mathias Kiwanuka, and that's probably not a bad starting point, though Jordan is much more fluid. I'd use him in space and move him around, drop him back. Put him on the line on occasion, but only situationally.

My problem with Jordan is that I've always loved his skill set, but I'm not sure that I would use a 1st round pick on him. Top 50, certainly. But I tend to want a more "complete" player in the 1st Then again, Seattle used a top 15 pick on Bruce Irvin, so it all depends on how a team sees value. There's no doubt that his skill set can create mismatches, and that may be enough value.

[manxman2601]

Originally Posted by mayoclinic

So do you think Minter may bump Ogletree down a few spots? Ogletree is a more freakish physical talent, but Minter is more of a pure physical ILB for a team like the Ravens looking to establish an inside presence. The Bears could look at Ogletree as an Urlacher replacement, but they've pretty much said that they want to establish their offense.

Dane Brugler has Minter going 29th to Houston in his most recent mock. Neither Brugler nor Rob Rang have Ogletree going in the 1st round. Interesting.

2013 NFL Mock Drafts - CBSSports.com - NFLDraftScout.com

Originally Posted by mayoclinic

I agree, I wouldn't use him as a full time line person. He doesn't have the strength or edge setting ability, and bulking him up to 275# or so would take time and would probably impair his fluidity. His best asset is his movement in space, and he's probably best as a 4-3 SLB. NE Patriots' Draft compared him to Mathias Kiwanuka, and that's probably not a bad starting point, though Jordan is much more fluid. I'd use him in space and move him around, drop him back. Put him on the line on occasion, but only situationally.

My problem with Jordan is that I've always loved his skill set, but I'm not sure that I would use a 1st round pick on him. Top 50, certainly. But I tend to want a more "complete" player in the 1st Then again, Seattle used a top 15 pick on Bruce Irvin, so it all depends on how a team sees value. There's no doubt that his skill set can create mismatches, and that may be enough value.

I quoted these two together because I think they're similar in nature. for the same reason you're not keen on taking Jordan in the first, I'm sort of there on Ogletree too. The reason why I have Minter ranked ahead of Ogletree is that Minter is a MLB, wither in a 3-4 or 4-3. He can play every down and is the main guy in the LB corps. Ogletree probably doesn't have the strength to play MLB in the NFL and will get lost playing in the box. He's a WLB in a 4-3 at the NFL level. I think he's a player you can get creative with and use him on most downs but you don't want him as a key component at stopping the run. He's a playmaker and his athleticism is outstanding but not great value as a first round pick for the Pats.

So whilst Jordan and Ogletree are very different prospects, they are also very similar in their respective values to the Pats.

[mayoclinic]

Originally Posted by Ivan

Dion jordan is going to be well out of reach come Draft day.

Originally Posted by manxman2601

I quoted these two together because I think they're similar in nature. for the same reason you're not keen on taking Jordan in the first, I'm sort of there on Ogletree too. The reason why I have Minter ranked ahead of Ogletree is that Minter is a MLB, wither in a 3-4 or 4-3. He can play every down and is the main guy in the LB corps. Ogletree probably doesn't have the strength to play MLB in the NFL and will get lost playing in the box. He's a WLB in a 4-3 at the NFL level. I think he's a player you can get creative with and use him on most downs but you don't want him as a key component at stopping the run. He's a playmaker and his athleticism is outstanding but not great value as a first round pick for the Pats.

So whilst Jordan and Ogletree are very different prospects, they are also very similar in their respective values to the Pats.

I've sort of seen it that way. I also wonder whether those kind of playmakers - like Bruce Irvin last year - have more value to a team with most of its pieces already in place looking to add a versatile, athletic guy who can create mismatches, than to a team needing a core building block.

The Pats have most of the foundation pieces in place, assuming Talib stays. Adding a "wild card" like Ogletree or Jordan who can create mismatches wouldn't be a bad thing.

[mackenzie45220]

Originally Posted by Merril Hoge's Tie Knot

http://img843.imageshack.us/img843/3...30103at742.png

He plays nickel corner all the time. I'm shocked you didn't know that.



Like I said, it's difficult.



Werner plays on the across from the RT, Nixon is the LT vs Florida St.

Still, 106th O-line

[mackenzie45220]

Originally Posted by patsfaninpa

What site has that kind of stat breakdown?

I looked at game logs, and looked at O-line rankings on the NCAA website, and did it myself

[mackenzie45220]

Originally Posted by Merril Hoge's Tie Knot

http://img843.imageshack.us/img843/3...30103at742.png

He plays nickel corner all the time. I'm shocked you didn't know that.



Like I said, it's difficult.



Werner plays on the across from the RT, Nixon is the LT vs Florida St.

I haven't finished the Stanford game, but I didn't see him play it in the first quarter.
Actually, come to think of it, I'm not 100% sure I saw Stanford come out in a 3 receiver set in the first quarter. That may have something to do with it.