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One of the things we have not done well as a society is look at the "legacy" costs of war, grew up with a lot of really messed up WW II vets... recently buried one who was involved in the liberation of Auschwitz. There is a lot that he could not talk about..
My fa in law, had horrific experiences in Korea.. and it haunted him until his death..
Lost a lot of friends in Viet Nam, and bent elbows with a few when they came back.. a lot have serious ghosts from that experience. A lot of these guys died younger than they should have...
Now this, wonder if suicides were always there or if this is a new phenomenon.. better reporting?? Or just a result of these endless wars and failiing safety nets.
__________________ "Being the best doesn't mean you always win. It just means you win more than anyone else".. tweet from Kurt Warner to Tom Brady.
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This thread isn't about the media or war protestors.
Mods, perhaps you should moderate and keep the hijacker from his usual crap in this thread.
(Feel free to delete this post if you actually clean this thread up)
The thread is about Military Suicides, if we were not over in that godforsaken rotten part of the world fighting a war we will never win I don't think these young people would be killing themselves.
We can fight the war on terror right here at home using all the power we have to "keep the terrorists out" TO HELL WITH THEIR CIVIL RIGHTS GOD DAMN THEIR CIVIL LIBERTIES use every single bit of the anti terrorist resources we have to keep the dirty filthy killers out of our country, use the troops to keep our Borders our Airports and our Sea Ports free of the Savage Dogs that want to kill you and all of your children, Profile Them, Torture Them and Wiretap Them, never ever allow another 9/11 to happen.
Stop The Wars
Close Gitmo (send them back to ride their donkeys)
Thats What they wanted Bush to do.
__________________
Harry Boy (Genius)
In The Absence Of Law And Order Society Will Surely Destroy Itself
Yes, it is, and you want to talk about everything else, because of your warped, partisan point of view.
So as the OP originally wrote:
"So sad......
Quote:
Active-duty military suicides surge
Friday June 8, 2012
WASHINGTON -- Suicides are surging among America’s troops, averaging nearly one a day this year -- the fastest pace in the nation’s decade of war.
The 154 suicides for active-duty troops in the first 155 days of the year far outdistance the U.S. forces killed in action in Afghanistan -- about 50 percent more -- according to Pentagon statistics obtained by The Associated Press.
The numbers reflect a military burdened with wartime demands from Iraq and Afghanistan that have taken a greater toll than foreseen a decade ago. The military also is struggling with increased sexual assaults, alcohol abuse, domestic violence and other misbehavior.
Because suicides had leveled off in 2010 and 2011, this year’s upswing has caught some officials by surprise.
Active-duty military suicides surge - Berkshire Eagle Online "
I'm curious whether screening has become more permissive due to our demand for troops, and whether that might have anything to do with it.
Demand was high until around 2008, when the wars were quieting down and the economy hit the skids. Now, it seems everyone wants in. Demand is down and supply is up. My recruiter told me that they met their 2011 recruiting goal in May (the first time since the Civil War and this is in New York, a traditionally very tough state to recruit). When I went through MEPS, it was standing room only, and the military is being very selective.
Anyway, the problem is over-extension. We're fighting two wars and there are a lot of our soldiers and Marines who are doing multiple tours. The word I hear a lot is "stress". There are a lot of stressors in the military, and for most it only gets worse after they get their DD 214s.
------------------ “On a day when they could have had impact players David Terrell or Koren Robinson..they took Georgia defensive tackle Richard Seymour, who had 1 sacks last season in the pass-happy SEC and is too tall to play tackle at 6-6 and too slow to play defensive end. This genius move was followed by trading out of a spot where they could have gotten the last decent receiver in Robert Ferguson and settled for tackle Matt Light, who will not help any time soon.”
One of the things we have not done well as a society is look at the "legacy" costs of war, grew up with a lot of really messed up WW II vets... recently buried one who was involved in the liberation of Auschwitz. There is a lot that he could not talk about..
My fa in law, had horrific experiences in Korea.. and it haunted him until his death..
Lost a lot of friends in Viet Nam, and bent elbows with a few when they came back.. a lot have serious ghosts from that experience. A lot of these guys died younger than they should have...
Now this, wonder if suicides were always there or if this is a new phenomenon.. better reporting?? Or just a result of these endless wars and failiing safety nets.
I choose that one. I read today that there's 1 suicide per day in our military:
Quote:
The 154 suicides for active-duty troops in the first 155 days of the year far outdistance the U.S. forces killed in action in Afghanistan — about 50 percent more — according to Pentagon statistics obtained by The Associated Press.
The numbers reflect a military burdened with wartime demands from Iraq and Afghanistan that have taken a greater toll than foreseen a decade ago. The military also is struggling with increased sexual assaults, alcohol abuse, domestic violence and other misbehavior
Quote:
The reasons for the increase are not fully understood. Among explanations, studies have pointed to combat exposure, post-traumatic stress, misuse of prescription medications and personal financial problems. Army data suggest soldiers with multiple combat tours are at greater risk of committing suicide, although a substantial proportion of Army suicides are committed by soldiers who never deployed.
That doesn't sound like any past wars to me anyway.
There are significant differences IMO, going back to WW1 troops would have been in combat for , 1 year before the war ended, in WW2 3 years at most (Guadalcanal to Okinawa), Korea maybe 24 months. In these wars the action could be more intense but not as many tours of time at the front.
Viet Nam was different there was a more extended time of combat (with varying degrees of US combat involvement. However the military had a lot of conscripts who were in service for 2-4 years and didn't do multiple tours. However there were career military who were exposed to multiple tours.
In the last 10 years this is an all volunteer force with a far greater % of career military. So a far greater % of soldiers have had to do multiple tours, in a high stress area where often it is hard to know the innocents from the enemy and the threat of roadside bombs and attacks where one is waiting to be hit rather than proactively going after the enemy.
This force has also had to abide to rules of engagement that no other army in history has had to deal with, these rules put our troops in harms way to avoid as much as possible harm to innocent civilians.
__________________
"Some guys play in all-star games, some guys don't. I don't know who picks all those all-star teams. In all honesty, I don't know who picks the combine, for that matter," Belichick said. "How does (Miami-Ohio offensive lineman Brandon) Brooks not get invited to the combine? How did Vollmer not get invited to the combine? I don't know. We can't really worry about that. We just have to try to evaluate them the best we can."
There are significant differences IMO, going back to WW1 troops would have been in combat for , 1 year before the war ended, in WW2 3 years at most (Guadalcanal to Okinawa), Korea maybe 24 months. In these wars the action could be more intense but not as many tours of time at the front.
Viet Nam was different there was a more extended time of combat (with varying degrees of US combat involvement. However the military had a lot of conscripts who were in service for 2-4 years and didn't do multiple tours. However there were career military who were exposed to multiple tours.
In the last 10 years this is an all volunteer force with a far greater % of career military. So a far greater % of soldiers have had to do multiple tours, in a high stress area where often it is hard to know the innocents from the enemy and the threat of roadside bombs and attacks where one is waiting to be hit rather than proactively going after the enemy.
This force has also had to abide to rules of engagement that no other army in history has had to deal with, these rules put our troops in harms way to avoid as much as possible harm to innocent civilians.
Good assessment pf. Plus the major role prescription drugs are playing but mostly the fact the American public is so removed from these present-day wars, or it seems like that to me anyway- and for that I fault MSM and "journalists" in general. As long as people have no real and true idea of what's going on over there and what our soldiers are going through, none of it will end.
I remember seeing some footage from Vietnam, footage that had been televised into every American home every night on the 6:00 news and it was horrifying. No wonder the country became galvanized against that war-seeing those boys ripped apart, bleeding, and dying, nevermind seeing it on your evening news-made people stand up and say "enough". We don't see any of that now, in fact we'll probably never see it until 2121. If people don't start waking up to what's happening to our military, and caring about what's happening to our military- we're lost as a society.
Good assessment pf. Plus the major role prescription drugs are playing but mostly the fact the American public is so removed from these present-day wars, or it seems like that to me anyway- and for that I fault MSM and "journalists" in general. As long as people have no real and true idea of what's going on over there and what our soldiers are going through, none of it will end.
I remember seeing some footage from Vietnam, footage that had been televised into every American home every night on the 6:00 news and it was horrifying. No wonder the country became galvanized against that war-seeing those boys ripped apart, bleeding, and dying, nevermind seeing it on your evening news-made people stand up and say "enough". We don't see any of that now, in fact we'll probably never see it until 2121. If people don't start waking up to what's happening to our military, and caring about what's happening to our military- we're lost as a society.
Do you remember the naked Vitenamese girl running down the street right after she was Napalmed??? That was a galvanizing picture..
When you break it down amongst services the numbers are interesting.. why would the Navy and Air Force have more suicides than the Marines???
Gotta wonder about prescription drug use and things like steroids, are they part of this equation???
__________________ "Being the best doesn't mean you always win. It just means you win more than anyone else".. tweet from Kurt Warner to Tom Brady.
The Marine Corps is much smaller than the number of people in the USAF and Navy. If there was a chart with the number of suicides/thousand or something is would give a better relative number.
Don't know if they test for steroids. I know nothing about other drugs that are prescribed.
__________________
"Some guys play in all-star games, some guys don't. I don't know who picks all those all-star teams. In all honesty, I don't know who picks the combine, for that matter," Belichick said. "How does (Miami-Ohio offensive lineman Brandon) Brooks not get invited to the combine? How did Vollmer not get invited to the combine? I don't know. We can't really worry about that. We just have to try to evaluate them the best we can."
Don't know if they test for steroids. I know nothing about other drugs that are prescribed.
Interesting contradiction here:
Quote:
Joining the Military
Are anti-depressants disqualifying?
Anti depressants are disqualifying for 1 year after you stop taking them. You MUST stop with your doctors advice, DO NOT stop on your own. These medications often have to be reduced slowly to lower side effects and reduce risk of relapse. Once you are off and depression free for 1 year get copies of your treatment paperwork, including therapy notes and take them with you to your recruiter. They will submit the documents to MEPS for review. MEPS will either DQ you, allow you to physical and enlist, or allow you to physical with a waiver (most likely).
After two long-running wars with escalating levels of combat stress, more than 110,000 active-duty Army troops last year were taking prescribed antidepressants, narcotics, sedatives, antipsychotics and anti-anxiety drugs, according to figures recently disclosed to The Times by the U.S. Army surgeon general. Nearly 8% of the active-duty Army is now on sedatives and more than 6% is on antidepressants — an eightfold increase since 2005.
So you can't enlist if are currently taking, or have taken within the last year, an antidepressant drug.
But, once you are enlisted, they will prescribe them for you.
One of the more bizarre side effects of most of the newer antidepressant is suicide - especially in young people....and most people enlisting in the military are young....and yet they seem to prescribe them quite freely.
Contributing factor? Someone would have to do a study of those servicemen/women who've committed or attempted suicide and find out if they were taking them or not - which I can't believe someone's not already done.
Unless they have and they're just not releasing the study results.
Last edited by Mrs.PatsFanInVa; 06-09-2012 at 08:10 AM..
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Re: Military suicides on the rise
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