DarrylS

So I guess what George did was ok??? That certainly justifies it..

None of what Saddam did, will ever justify our military response... it was based on pure, unadulterated lies..

__________________
"Being the best doesn't mean you always win. It just means you win more than anyone else".. tweet from Kurt Warner to Tom Brady.

TBradyOwnsYou

The CIA didn't create Bin Laden, he was already a crazy jihadist before us, we just helped train him.
I didn't say the CIA hasn't set up coups or assassinations or anything like that, I said we haven't done it ourselves. Direction action is a completely different ball park.
How do you define "harm the US"? And if we don't interfere with the affairs of other countries, how do we maintain being the most powerful country on Earth?
As for my scenario being inconsistant... how so? I don't recall Burma or Zimbabwe messing with the USA or our allies recently. Why mess with them?
My world view is wreckless and sloppy? I guess if you say so. My view of the world is that it's fcked on tons of different levels.
I think the difference in us is I understand that humanity will never create Eden and that humans have the capability for great evil. Unfortunately, the storybooks don't tell the truth and you can't actually kill with kindness. You need bullets.

Harry Boy

Remember When
YouTube - Democrats on Iraq + WMD's (Weapons of Mass Destruction)

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Harry Boy (Genius)

In The Absence Of Law And Order Society Will Surely Destroy Itself

TBradyOwnsYou

You want to argue about who shot Kennedy next? How about if America should have fought in Vietnam? Or what about what you had for lunch yesterday?
Fun thing is, that no matter what you pick, it'll be the same result. You argueing to no gain. These things all happened in the past. Sure, you might not agree with them, but unless you own a time machine, as I understand physics, you can't change those events. Bush hold a press conference tomorrow saying he's an alien sent from space to invade Iraq and kill Saddam who was a different alien. Would that change the last decade? No.
I don't care if you think the war was "justified" or not. I don't care if you think Bush IS an alien. All I care is that we DID invade Iraq, and we need to move forward from it in the best way possible for America.

DarrylS

Blah, blah, blah same old change the subject, same shyt different day, the bottom line is Bush lied to the American People and many kids died...

Viet Nam, the Iraq fiasco were based on lies from the onset, and never should have happened.. the problem is many believe the lies after the fact that justified the deaths of many of our young men and women.. not to mention the fact that it cost over 723 Billions.. never mind the "legacy" costs..

Iraq should have never happened... Viet Nam should have never happened.. come to think of it am hard pressed to believe any war is ever justified..

__________________
"Being the best doesn't mean you always win. It just means you win more than anyone else".. tweet from Kurt Warner to Tom Brady.

TBradyOwnsYou

Isn't my original arguement that I agree the current Iraq war shouldn't have happened because we should have taken out Saddam in 91?
And ya, I guess I'm doing the "blah blah blah change the subject" thing because argueing about past events gets us no where. Tell me, what do you gain from saying over and over again that Bush lied?
As far as using the deaths of soldiers to try and "justify" your arguement, have you ever served? Have you been in a current war zone? Have you seen the flag be draped over one of these "dead kids" before they are loaded on to a helicopter? You have no idea what the cost is.
The cost is far, far more than you think. But you know what, each and every person who put on that uniform was willing to pay it. We don't expect you to understand it, but we do it anyway.
And for being hard pressed to believe any war is ever justified? Wow. Really? I feel sorry for you.

chicowalker

A few thoughts: wasn't offering assistanceto or training bin Laden a pretty big deal, in retrospect? (ie, I wouldn't say we "just" did that)

re coups: while it's a step removed from doing it ourselves, setting up or assisting in a coup is still a pretty monumental action. I know a lot of people don't like to look at the other side of these issues, but let's think about what our opinion would be of another nation backing anattempted coup here -- I don't think we'd care all that much if they "merely" planned or funded it.

Re. our involvement in other nations' affairs -- we have, since the creation if the CIA, interfered in the governing and elections of severalnations that never messed with us -- in fact, it might be argued that none of them ever did anything to us.

But Darryl, no war is justified (perhaps)? WWII?

Harry Boy

No comments on this.......................
YouTube - Democrats on Iraq + WMD's (Weapons of Mass Destruction)

__________________
Harry Boy (Genius)

In The Absence Of Law And Order Society Will Surely Destroy Itself

Nikolai

This is one of the biggest misconceptions being thrown around out there. Saddam Hussein, yes. Bin Laden, no.

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We get what we deserve.

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“On a day when they could have had impact players David Terrell or Koren Robinson..they took Georgia defensive tackle Richard Seymour, who had 1 sacks last season in the pass-happy SEC and is too tall to play tackle at 6-6 and too slow to play defensive end. This genius move was followed by trading out of a spot where they could have gotten the last decent receiver in Robert Ferguson and settled for tackle Matt Light, who will not help any time soon.”

Nikolai

If the US would have found WMD and the means to deliver them to the US or its interests, I think fewer people would have objected to the war.

Saddam Hussein and Iraqi intelligence hoodwinked our intelligence into believing that they had WMD in order to intimidate Iran, Saudi Arabia and other nations that Hussein perceived as a threat to Iraq. Unfortunately, by the time it became apparent that the intel wasn't backing up the claim, the issue had gained political steam, and nothing short of a "cease and desist" from the intel community would have stopped it. For myriad reasons, the 2002 NIE wasn't that document, and though it contained several caveats about key sources (such as CURVEBALL), the political pressure was on to make it appear that active and deliverable WMDs were indeed present in Iraq, or were being produced. The 2002 NIE contained enough nuggets to convince the hawks and many doves that war was a viable option.

Thar be the pitfalls of the politicization of intelligence. Unfortunately, we've done little to fix that problem (see Leon Panetta vs. Dennis Blair).

__________________
We get what we deserve.

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“On a day when they could have had impact players David Terrell or Koren Robinson..they took Georgia defensive tackle Richard Seymour, who had 1 sacks last season in the pass-happy SEC and is too tall to play tackle at 6-6 and too slow to play defensive end. This genius move was followed by trading out of a spot where they could have gotten the last decent receiver in Robert Ferguson and settled for tackle Matt Light, who will not help any time soon.”