Wolfpack

That's moronic. Ignoring the fact that you didn't provide an iota of support, according to your logic if 30 historians all say he had 1 illegimate child, then "you tabulate all the various claims you come up with something like 30."

Unbelievable
Not really.
You're basic point remains morally and intellectually bankrupt. You rewrote history, made a completely invalid comparison, and think it somehow applies to your hero, John Edwards.

Despite your attempts to change the subject, we're not talking about appreciating his public achievements. We are talking about you saying "I still like him."
Well it certainly didn't make you smile when I called you morally and intellectually bankrupt. Why the change of heart?

Wolfpack

The article on 20/20 last night said that they are arguably deserving of precisely that. Funny how the MSM ignored the Clinton scandal and did everything to ignore The Edwards scandal and it took non-traditional media to expose both of those.

But the MSM sure did make sure we knew everything there was to know about Bristol Palin.

scout

I think what was more revealing then having a baby out of wedlock (bastard?) was the reference that Edwards did not read, kind of like Palin. Though, you'd have to give the nod to Edwards for smarts as he did complete law school.
What's with the comparison to Franklin, when a present day comparison would be good ole' Newt. Who by the way, is still considering the Presidency. Newt also cheated on his cancer stricken wife while bashing Clinton for his extra marital affair. Good one!

Patters

When I say, I like Edwards, I am referring to his politics. I don't know him personally, so I have no opinion in that regard. I have had friends and acquaintances who were fun to hang out with and likable, but who did things in their private lives I did not approve of. As far as Ben goes, there doesn't seem to be much online about his personal life, but this link at least provides evidence of his dalliance:

TIME: Why He Was a Babe Magnet

If you want more info, read his autobiography and you'll find evidence that he was quite the ladies man:

American Creation: Good Ol' Fashioned American Sex Scandals!

"But the scandals don't stop there. Even the beloved Benjamin Franklin, one of America's most celebrated Founders, admitted in his autobiography to having sexual relations "with women of low character." While in England, the youthful Franklin regularly enjoyed sharing his bed with scores of prostitutes. Franklin later stated that it was a miracle he never acquired any diseases!"

As far as illegitimate children go, he admitted to one and others have maintained as many as 13 (for instance, in one letter he referred to a young woman as his daughter, but whether or not he meant that literally is a subject for debate). If you combine all the various rumors, the number is much higher than 13. I suggest you start by reading Franklin's autobiography and then move on to one of the books about Franklin's women. Not all information is posted online.

Wolfpack

Actually, I have read a lot about Franklin, which is why I knew you were completely full of crap when you said he had 30 illegitimate children. You don't have one single shred of evidence supporting your contention. You're just posting links hoping people will think you've supported your statement when there is absolutely nothing in those links that does so.

It always amuses me when someone makes an intellectually and morally bankrupt statement, gets called out on it, and then continues to defend their intellectually and morally bankrupt statement. You would look so much less foolish if you just admitted that you were wrong to make the intellectually and morally bankrupt claim in the first place than you do by continuing to defend something so ridiculous.

Please be aware that I am saying your statement that Franklin had 30 illegitimate children is intellectually and morally bankrupt, not that you personally are intellectually and morally bankrupt. You told me it made you smile when I did that, but apparently it aggrevated you enough to give me an infraction warning.

Patters

Do a search for Ben Franklin and 30 illegitimate children in various forms and you'll come up with a few hits. I don't remember where I read it, but it was a long time ago.

But, since I like Ben regardless of what he did in his private life, let's for arguments sake just stick the most accepted view that he had one illegitimate child and slept around while in Paris (which he admitted). Okay? Would you have liked Ben back then, or would you have been one of those conservatives who was mortified by Ben's behavior?

Again, my only point was that we can like someone for their public good works, even if they made mistakes in their private lives. If you don't want to respond to that point, then have the last word.

But please, Wolfpack, avoid the personal attacks. Those nasty comments you made are personal attacks. This is not a court of law.

Real World

I'd like to say that I had this guy pegged from day 1. A lot of people in here gave me grief over my opinion about him too. The guy is slime.

Scout, Newt is the biggest loser fraud going. I can't stand the guy. He's scum like Edwards. I hope they drag him through the mud.

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"The most difficult subjects can be explained to the most slow-witted man if he has not formed any idea of them already; but the simplest thing cannot be made clear to the most intelligent man if he is firmly persuaded that he knows already, without a shadow of doubt, what is laid before him."
Leo Tolstoy, 1897

scout

I like your non-partisan take on this.

Wolfpack

Excuse me, but you're the one who made the claim and I'm the one who called bullcrap, so you're the one who has to support your own claim. You can't make a ridiculous claim then say "do a search" when called out on it.
Keeping in mind that Franklin's illegimate child pre-dated his marriage, I would not consider that even remotely comparable to the human slime that is John Edwards.
No, your point is to try and redirect the attention from John Edwards by making his actions seem very much like those of Ben Franklin, when the two are miles apart in both time and space.

Wolfpack

Patters is desperately clinging to his Ben Franklin analogy, when you have come along and given us a far better one. Newt Gingrich is a guy who I agree with in a political sense about 99% of the time but, unlike Patters, you'll never see me support him, vote for him, back him, or say anything about him that resembles Patters' "I still like him" speech. I can't stand him, I consider him an embarassment to the right, and I wish he would just disappear.