Fogbuster

The government has so much money they can't keep track of it all. They are paying to people they have no idea who they are.

And on top of that there are humongous USD counterfeiting rings all over the world, from Russia to China to North Korea (their biggest source of green backs) to the FARC narco-terrorists to various mafias.


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"All that is required for evil to triumph is for good to do nothing."

wistahpatsfan

You left out the most important one: Blow the limbs off of children in piss-poor countries for no reason.

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Patters

That's a belief based on almost no facts. Where's the hard evidence showing a level of fraud and incompetence that would allow us to seriously reduce taxes? What would you guess the dollar value of the waste is and where is it?

The Federal Budget, 2004–2009 — Infoplease.com

If we cut all federal benefits spent on illegals, you have to increase enforcement and prisons. I think if you want to cut fraud, you have to invest heavily in investigators. I also think you'd be hard pressed to come up with waste massive enough to seriously affect our taxes. Or do you want to cut the military in half?

To me, it's absurd to believe there's so much waste and fraud in the federal government that our taxes could drop dramatically. After all, our system is quite transparent, and much of the waste and fraud gets caught by an eager media. For instance, the Globe today uncovered about $20k/year of possible fraud by a couple of State pension insiders.

But, I have yet to see a clear analysis of what can reasonably be eliminated to the extent that we'll see massive tax cuts. Our government runs quite well, and there are not huge savings to found (except possibly in the military).

tanked_as_usual

I'd like to see evidence that our government runs quite well.......there is waste at every level.........to deny that is to be extremely naive as you are...........everywhere you look it exists.......you either dont notice it or are simply just used to it........I see it everywhere, and our government is run brutally bad.....

BTW, were you saying how well our government was run a year ago????

Patters

What I see is that government is far more transparent than business and the government chooses its workers from the same pool as does business. To my knowledge there is no difference in Americans who work for government and Americans in the private sector, so it's reasonable to assume that corruption is at similar levels. Are there things that can be improved? No doubt about it. It's just as unlikely that every federal agency is running in peak form at the same time as it is unlikely that every bank is running in peak form at the same time. Some screw up more than others, but government employs a lot of people with private sector backgrounds in business roles, so its overall level of performance should be similar to business levels (especially given that government is far more transparent). I find your whole line of reasoning common and illogical.

Under Bush, our government ran well, but his policies were bad -- they were often costly and generally not beneficial. Also, under Bush, I was for pretty much what I'm for now. More social spending, a more progressive tax structure, and a better job paying our bills and maintaining our credit ratings.

tanked_as_usual

so you are basically refusing to even look and just tell yourself things to make yourself feel better......I can tell you right now that nowhere in private industry would you have a situation like the road crew details the state police in MA get.......the state pays out $120-130 per hour for those state and local police officers you see sitting in there cars ad road work locations........instead of having the work crew provide their own details like in all other states.......state people argue it is safety, but none of the police are actually trained in any kind of road work detail, so it is obviously a built in way for the cops to get double time for doing nothing....just one example, but the idea to funnel back money to public employees is widespread no matter how much the cost overrun is.....

you defy logic......private business has to make money to survive....the public sector is guaranteed a revenue stream which automatically sets up a situation of massive waste.........you can wish that it is not there all you want, but public projects (big dig) are efficiency disasters where every layer of government involved grabs endless amounts of cash........you then have private people like Bob Kraft who implement projects like Gillette on time and on budget.....something that NEVER happens in the public sector

you can choose to believe what you want.......but these are simple truths......

if someone ran a business the way things are run in the public sector, the business would either cease to exist or the person would be fired

Fogbuster

Some states (NY, NJ, Ma, CA, others) governments are run like a mafia. The tax-payer cannot control it because the corrupt officials won't allow it. You would need to over-throw about ten crime "families" in NY to change the way those states scam the tax-payers. See: the Sopranos, et. al.



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"All that is required for evil to triumph is for good to do nothing."

DarrylS

The Sopranos were not real...

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tanked_as_usual

neither is the 11000 sq ft house you say the bush's bought

Patters

Okay, that's one example and Patrick has introduced new rules that should save the state around $7 million. That's about $1/person/year.

Massachusetts Eliminates Police Detail at Road Construction Sites - 9/24/2008 - Associated Construction Publications

You need many more examples than that one to demonstrate that there can be a major reduction in our income taxes.

Our political process is what ensures a level of responsibility in the public sector.

Private business may have to make money in order to survive, but that's not the mission of the private sector. The mission of the private sector is to increase shareholder wealth. A large number of the companies that are struggling now took advantage of the good times to reward not only their to executives, but their top shareholders who were in the best position to buy and sell strategically.

Most public sector projects work fine. That's why you never read about them. The ones that become a mess naturally make the news. I live in Cambridge, and I've seen numerous public projects going on -- new sewers, new sidewalks, repaving of roads, etc. -- and these projects appeared to proceed smoothly and without delay.

Many businesses fail and go bankrupt. The business world has no better a track record than government, but of course government is not allowed to fold. And again, unlike business, government records are open; that's why you can't find a Bernie Madoff or AIG sized example of incompetence and corruption in government. Those things get found out.

I'm sure you can find millions of dollars of potential savings in state government and billions in federal government, but I think the overwhelming proportion of the budget can't be cut much without affecting critical services. Again, I think people like you take for granted the incredible costs of running a nation as big as ours. I'm 100% for cracking down on waste an inefficiency, and I like the public private model where each puts pressure on the other to control costs, but I don't think there are massive savings to be had that could reduce taxes.