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http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/16/us/16nsa.html?_r=1&hp
So much for the rule of law, so much for privacy, so much for due process. This is pretty much all about a powerful government claiming more power. The republicans really screwed us by implementing this, and Obama is seriously screwing us by not gutting it.
Quote:
Several intelligence officials, as well as lawyers briefed about the matter, said the N.S.A. had been engaged in “overcollection” of domestic communications of Americans. They described the practice as significant and systemic, although one official said it was believed to have been unintentional.
No, there's no potential for abuse there. Sorry, it was an accident guys, I swear!
How do we excuse this nonsense any longer? Oh yeah, the al qaeda bogeyman.
Last edited by apple strudel; 04-16-2009 at 08:23 AM..
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Re: NSA intercepts far exceed limits set by congress
Quote:
Originally Posted by apple strudel
http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/16/us/16nsa.html?_r=1&hp
So much for the rule of law, so much for privacy, so much for due process. This is pretty much all about a powerful government claiming more power. The republicans really screwed us by implementing this, and Obama is seriously screwing us by not gutting it.
No, there's no potential for abuse there. Sorry, it was an accident guys, I swear!
How do we excuse this nonsense any longer? Oh yeah, the al qaeda bogeyman.
Just curious: what are you so worried the NSA will hear you say????
//
__________________
"All that is required for evil to triumph is for good to do nothing."
Re: NSA intercepts far exceed limits set by congress
if some NSA guy wants to jack-off while my GF tells me what she wants to do to me, more power to him.........other than that, nothing I say on the phone will pique their interest in any way........
its like a speed trap.........everybody has to drive through it....but only the speeders need to worry
Re: NSA intercepts far exceed limits set by congress
[QUOTE=apple strudel;1348228]http://www.nytimes.com/2009/04/16/us/16nsa.html?_r=1&hp
So much for the rule of law, so much for privacy, so much for due process. This is pretty much all about a powerful government claiming more power. The republicans really screwed us by implementing this, and Obama is seriously screwing us by not gutting it.[QUOTE]
Change You Can Believe In Check this:
Quote:
." This is a brand new, extraordinarily broad claim of government immunity made for the first time ever by the Obama DOJ -- all in service of blocking EFF's lawsuit against Bush officials for illegal spying.
Re: NSA intercepts far exceed limits set by congress
You know Apple (and you may be surprised by this) I kind of agree with you here. While I think we have good evidence that our intelligence capabilities at home and abroad were insufficient prior to 9/11, it seems like allowing secret programs lends itself to abuse of those programs. I think we've seen it with coercive interrogation, and now with wiretaps (whether accidental or not). The problem as I see it is that the government allowing the rules to be broken in certain cases encourages the people doing the work (interrogators/guards or wiretap monitors) to abuse the system beyond the ground rules the gov't tries to lay out.
I think we need to come up with ways to make intelligence gathering more efficient without just bypassing established regulations put in place to prevent the very abuses/mistakes we've seen. The old system wasn't good enough, but the new one creates new problems as it solves old ones.
And tanked, come on, I hate speed traps and electronic monitoring of the roads! If the cops want to give me a speeding ticket, they should have to catch me fair and square!
Re: NSA intercepts far exceed limits set by congress
Quote:
Originally Posted by tanked_as_usual
if some NSA guy wants to jack-off while my GF tells me what she wants to do to me, more power to him.........other than that, nothing I say on the phone will pique their interest in any way........
its like a speed trap.........everybody has to drive through it....but only the speeders need to worry
1) It's none of their business. 2) There's no need for them to know it. 3) The potential for abuse is vast. Think listening to your political opponents. Think business interests. It is all about concentrating power.
Edit: just because you and your girlfriend are OK giving up your rights doesn't mean I am. I expect a right to privacy. Especially since there's no reason for anybody to listen to my calls since I'm pretty much a working, tax-paying citizen.
You guys need to re-read 1984. Thought crime and all.
Last edited by apple strudel; 04-16-2009 at 01:00 PM..
Re: NSA intercepts far exceed limits set by congress
Quote:
Originally Posted by apple strudel
You guys need to re-read 1984. Thought crime and all.
I'm with you and Stokes here. While I think 1984 is referenced way too much by people in situations where they are simply trying to discredit someone with a differing political POV, this is too eerily reminiscent for sure. I don't think it means that we're headed there anytime soon, but we need to stay vigilant against overly authoritarian and fascistic practices, because you do NOT want them creeping into our society.
Re: NSA intercepts far exceed limits set by congress
Quote:
Originally Posted by STFarmy
I'm with you and Stokes here. While I think 1984 is referenced way too much by people in situations where they are simply trying to discredit someone with a differing political POV, this is too eerily reminiscent for sure. I don't think it means that we're headed there anytime soon, but we need to stay vigilant against overly authoritarian and fascistic practices, because you do NOT want them creeping into our society.
You may be right, it's a bit lazy, but I think that it's relevant to reference 1984 in this case for a few reasons.
1) Big Brother spied on its own citizens.
2) 1984 and much of Orwell's writings are based on his personal experiance with totalitarian regimes in countries like Burma.
We should have a thread on Orwell. He was an awesome socialist and fought with POUM in the Spanish Civil War.
Re: NSA intercepts far exceed limits set by congress
People really need to start putting all these events together ,open their eyes and see not just the events themselves but the trend those events blatantly show. You'd have to be deaf,dumb and blind not to see where we're going, that or in utter and total denial.
It's not even a partisan issue. People also really need to stop spending all their time on mainstream media headlines and other fluff, and start paying attention to the "in other news" sections. Meanwhile while you were out,45 new laws were passed...
NSA intercepts far exceed limits set by congress
Check this:
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