Fogbuster

Accidently shot a young thug who had been apprehended; the cop's gun went off by mistake; the cop had no intention of shooting anybody. It is on youtube. [Don't watch youtube if it bothers you, but know that others will and draw their own conclusions.]



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"All that is required for evil to triumph is for good to do nothing."

Holy Diver

I saw that...I ride the BART, so its kindof a big deal out here.

The kid was cuffed, he was on his stomach, not going anywhere. I believe it was an accident, but that doesn't matter.


NO RIOTS HAPPENED!


I was driving home from work the other night on the bay bridge, the entire time reminded of those poor officers wrongful deaths while serving th epeople by the 100+ police riding in formation in front of me.


I know you don't live out here, and understand the diversity as well as the struggle that many cultures have in this area. But to witness both of these horrible events and to see the public restraint as far as rediculous outrage goes is quite a step froward for us in the bay area, and elsewhere.

These things happen from time to time. Its best we learn from them than cause more chaos.

Fogbuster

The cops are out there for a show of solidarity. If law and order break down, America is in very big trouble. I may not like the fact that tax-payers are probably picking up the tab for this huge police turn-out, but it's better than having all the punks of the world think they can just do what they want. Total chaos is not a good thing.


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"All that is required for evil to triumph is for good to do nothing."

DarrylS

not sure what video you watched.. but Grant was subdued, the officer stood up pulled his gun and shot him in the back... does not look accidental to me.

YouTube - Bart Police shooting in Oakland KTVU report

They have already charged the cop with Homicide..

Ex-Transit Cop Johannes Mehserle Arrested in Oakland Shooting - ABC News

__________________
"Being the best doesn't mean you always win. It just means you win more than anyone else".. tweet from Kurt Warner to Tom Brady.

Fogbuster

Thanks for the links!! I learned something new: the guy who got shot was not only attempting to fight with the police, he was also out partying with his gang, while leaving his 4-year old daughter at home.

In any case, the officer clearly did not intend to shoot the guy. It is obvious from his body posture and entire demeanor that he is more surprised than anyone over what had happened. Nor did any of the other cops expect anybody to be shot at this point. It was clearly an accident. Opinion is that the officer thought he was holding his taser, not his gun; of course, a very bad mistake, but not a sign of pre-meditated harm intended. All the videos confirm this.

YouTube - POLICE SHOOTING AT BART STATION - OSCAR GRANT

YouTube - BART Shooting - UPDATED!!! NEW angle of the shooting!!!!

This view shows the most detail; listen to the mob screaming from the beginning, before anybody even got hurt: YouTube - Viewer Discretion-Full Footage of Oakland Man Killed By BART Cop


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__________________
"All that is required for evil to triumph is for good to do nothing."

DarrylS

Because he left his daughter home, has a criminal record it is justified to shoot someone in the back??.. whether he intended to shoot or not is not the issue.. he drew his gun on a man lying face down in cuffs and shot him.. it is pretty cut and dry.. FYI the officer has chosen not to say anything.. this video is one of the most incriminating ever shot.. there is not excuse for what he did.

Even if he drew his lazer and shot Grant while he was subdued and face down, he would still probably have criminal liabllity.. there is no justification for this level of force..

__________________
"Being the best doesn't mean you always win. It just means you win more than anyone else".. tweet from Kurt Warner to Tom Brady.

PatsFanInVa

He's "more surprised than anyone," huh? I think the people on the train and the platform, and of course, the victim himself, were at least as surprised. The phrase you're looking for is "as surprised as anyone" here.

I see that the news anchor has telepathically determined this and advised us to believe it. What it looks like to me is a man shot a subdued man in the back. His reaction could as easily have been "Aw I shouldn't a oughta done that" as surprise. Or for that matter, mock surprise.

By the way, here in America we do have penalties for leaving a 4 year old daughter alone at home -- which I will believe, by the way, when I see it from a reputable news source. Leaving the 4-year-old with a sitter, a family member, etc. is not the same thing, and that's the sort of nuance you've proven incapable of grasping in the past. Regardless, those penalties do not include summary execution.

Now: I do not defend the guy that shot the cop, and I do not think I am judge and jury of the cop that shot the defenseless face-down guy.

I do, however, think that the people of Oakland have connected point A to point B, hence the importance of context. The idea of a police force is to create a monopoly of violent means, to be concentrated in the hands of people whose behavior is predictable, responsible, and lawful. That is why they are held to a high standard: it jeopardizes the rest of the force, and the legitimacy of the state apparatus, if they are incompetent or reckless.

PFnV

Fogbuster

I'm sure the courts will hash this out without the need of your input, but since you offer your take on what happened I will say, yes, it was clearly excessive force; but the circumstances need to be -- and most definitely WILL BE -- brought out: these guys were causing significant trouble; they were fighting, apparently -- no mention yet with whom they had been fighting; they got arrested but persisted in giving grief to the officers; there was a crowd, most likely heavily liquored up on New Year's Day, and they were also noisily aggravating the situation, not giving the officers any peace of mind.

Add it all up, and add a 2-year cop trying to deal with a 22-year old fighting to free himself from several other cops' attempts to restrain him, and you get a train-wreck waiting to happen. The cops' faces clearly indicate their total surprise at the shooting; completely un-planned accident under aggravating circumstances.


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__________________
"All that is required for evil to triumph is for good to do nothing."

DarrylS

Cut away from all of the fluff and extenuating circumstances, the reality is quite simple the kid was restrained and the cop went for a gun.. either tazer or handgun.. he shot the kid in the back.. all he had to do is pull his cuffs. this is very serious stuff and cannot be rationalized.. pretty sure the FBI will be involved and no matter what you believe this guy will do some serious time..

__________________
"Being the best doesn't mean you always win. It just means you win more than anyone else".. tweet from Kurt Warner to Tom Brady.

Mabeyitstrue

"Accidentally shot a young thug"

lol wow 2 things,

1. Accidentally shot him? so when a cop shoots someone on the ground cuffed its an accident? lmfao god damn, your about as sharp as a marble.
Don't quit your day job lol

2.Young thug? How do you know he's a thug? cause he's black? lol good to know racism is alive and well

Fact of the matter is, you like me don't know jacksh%t about this case cause we where both not there and both our information comes from a third party.

Don't act like a know-it-all :banned:

"The guy who got shot was not only attempting to fight with the police, he was also out partying with his gang, while leaving his 4-year old daughter at home."


"The guy who got shot was not only attempting to fight with the police"

Sure he was lol, Hey the sky is falling!!!!! better get to my cave soon before its too late lol

"he was also out partying with his gang"

Is it illegal to hang out with other ppl in a large group?

"while leaving his 4-year old daughter at home"

Oh god, plz stop.....People who live in glass houses should not throw stones