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Old 08-10-2007, 10:23 PM   #41
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Default Re: Pats/Bucs postgame notes

First, no injuries. Good news.

Cassel looked good enough, especially with third string receivers.

Faulk just played terrific. Flawless receiving, great running. Still a weapon.

I didn't learn much at all about the receivers. Washington? I don't know how you can project anything on him, based on a couple late plays. First, Moss and Stallworth didn't take the bus down. Second, they were throwing to the backs, at least early in the game. Also, with Watson, Thomas, and Brady all staying home, not much to learn about the tight ends. Mills failed to make enough of an impact in the spotlight - he was behind Rivers (who did look like Graham on one play in his #82 jersey.)

I thought the starting OL looked terrific. Great push, big pocket, lots of time, of course against a vanilla front. That was Nick Kaczur getting the start, by the way.

Tampa Bay put up more rushing yards than passing, but most of that was against the last string in the fourth quarter. Neither team broke 125 yards passing. Not much offense anywhere in this game.

On DL, Mike Wright was a monster. Big tackles, big pressure, big sack, great game. Santonio Thomas was probably the most impressive back-up. (Note that he's not a linebacker...) Kareem Brown showed some speed, coming around from the weak side to run down the running back downfield later in the game.

Where was Pierre Woods? Didn't notice him. Justin Rodgers looked OK, good pressure a couple times, picked up a fumble and made a lot of tackles. He may have done as much to make the team as anyone. Lua made a few hits downfield, but also read the play wrong and made the wrong first step, opening up the middle for a crossing route on the Tampa Bay touchdown. He didn't step up and stuff anything.

Meriweather was pretty much on the field for every play, at least on defense, mostly at outside cornerback. Welcome to the NFL, rookie, it's 108 and you're playing every snap in preseason. He showed good attitude, but not too many big plays, and was clearly being targeted. Gay looked good, and made some good plays against the run. Glad to see that Hobbs was not returning kicks. Richardson got a lot of looks at corner as well. Where was James Sanders?

On special teams, no Josh Miller. Baugher and Malone were both in positions to drop the ball inside the 10, but special teams always let the ball bounce in. As noted, Anam is an idiot. He not only ran down the entire field out of bounds, he ran outside the yard-wide white chalk mark. Good thing he didn't knock over a coach. Gemarra Williams had a terrific run-back, but I can't imagine he can make the team. He was returning kicks next to Willie Andrews. Gostkowski kicked one out of bounds, giving the ball to the Bucs on the 40 to start the second half, and edged in a 23-yard field goal.

Game went quick, but seemed sort of slow.
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Old 08-10-2007, 10:25 PM   #42
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Default Re: Pats/Bucs postgame notes

I'm going to disagree with you on this one Ray. I wasn't that impressed with Lua, but I was with Rogers, especially since this is his first experience as a LB, IIRC. He made a nice move on his sack (albeit against a RB) and set the edge well a couple of times. Just because a team runs successfully outside its not necessarily the fault of the OLB.

As I've stated on many occassions, its a 3 year process at MINIMUM to convert a college DE into a well rounded NFL OLB. What I saw from Rogers is the kind of instinct and ability that makes me think in a couple of years he could make that transition successfully. Certainly not a lock to make the team, but better than I expected.
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Old 08-10-2007, 10:26 PM   #43
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You may not know diddley, but you are one of my favorite posters. Rodgers got run around all night. You forgot to mention that Lua got faked out of his jock on the TB TD. In fact, the entire linebacking core just could not make a play. The Pats front generally holds their ground, but the LBs do not step up. Tampa threw over the middle at will as well. Other posters have been praising Meriwether, but I saw him miss tackles including one which would have been a ten-yard loss. The team to me just looked flat. I do not recall one truly hard hit or one pass deflected. As for Rcihardson, hhe had that pass thrown to him but dropped it. I can't believe the coaching staff would be happy with the team's effort this evening.
Well thank you very much. I'm humbled. I try to think "what is BB looking for" and of course I'm hypercritical of the young linebackers because I wonder about the future there.

To your other comments--I know the Meriweather play youir talking about and I'm of two minds on it. Seems like he blew a tackle. On the other hand he blew up the play with his quickness and allowed the D to catch up with it.
Penetration like that is disruptive on its own so I'm not reallycritical.

On the Richardson play, I have to disagree. He had great position and forced the receiver to play defense. It would have been an ESPN highlight had he caught it and the receiver was hacking away, while he was in a distorted position.

I don't use the name RayClay for nothing. He always made the D play first, interceptions second. Not like that fancy pants Haynes guy (although he was pretty good too).
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Old 08-10-2007, 10:33 PM   #44
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I'm going to disagree with you on this one Ray. I wasn't that impressed with Lua, but I was with Rogers, especially since this is his first experience as a LB, IIRC. He made a nice move on his sack (albeit against a RB) and set the edge well a couple of times. Just because a team runs successfully outside its not necessarily the fault of the OLB.

As I've stated on many occassions, its a 3 year process at MINIMUM to convert a college DE into a well rounded NFL OLB. What I saw from Rogers is the kind of instinct and ability that makes me think in a couple of years he could make that transition successfully. Certainly not a lock to make the team, but better than I expected.
Doesn't someone have contain responsibility?

If the outside linebacker obviously moves inside and the running back goes for 15 yards with nobody outside, what else am I to conclude?

Somebody blew an assignment big time. Since I was staring at him and saw him move to the inside, I assumed it was him.

Talking about the 4th quarter, I believe when they ripped off some big gains.

Am I wrong when I say that in the Patriots defense, a linebacker who makes the play by leaving his area of responsibility gets chewed out?
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Old 08-10-2007, 10:34 PM   #45
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Not really. If you blow your assignment to go for the ball, you flunk the test in this system.

It's all about doing your job. You get negative, not positive points, even if you make the tackle, when you leave your area of responsibility.

I welcome other comments on this.
I totally agree here and think this goes without saying. But a young player in a completely new system will lean on instincts more to make up for their lack of knowledge of the defense. Sometimes this will burn you, and sometimes it will work. It is at this time where knowledge and experience are low where you can see more of the players raw ability and instincts, and I'm not saying he was great or anything, simply that he showed enough to intrigue me. The learning process is not always going to be pretty, and it sounds like your expectations for a low round rookie linebacker in his first game making the switch from DE might be a little too high.
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Old 08-10-2007, 10:36 PM   #46
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Default Re: Pats/Bucs postgame notes

I bet with Walt Coleman as the ref John Gruden was glad it was a preseason game.
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Old 08-10-2007, 10:37 PM   #47
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And this three year stuff is horse feathers.

Don't let anyone get outside. Let the other players do their assignments.

The reason it takes a while is they instinctively try to make a play.

It's simple. Execute your assignment and the coach won't blame you if the run goes inside you. You have to trust the coaching staff on that one.

Don't execute your assignment and you won't get three years.

Do you think they want to revisit the TBC mistake?
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Old 08-10-2007, 10:46 PM   #48
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I totally agree here and think this goes without saying. But a young player in a completely new system will lean on instincts more to make up for their lack of knowledge of the defense. Sometimes this will burn you, and sometimes it will work. It is at this time where knowledge and experience are low where you can see more of the players raw ability and instincts, and I'm not saying he was great or anything, simply that he showed enough to intrigue me. THe learning process is not always going to be pretty.
I agree 100%, that's why I say I was jumping to conclusions.

It must be funny to be in these camps when the rook was all over the field and thinks he was MVP. Boring Bill tells him he should have stayed here and not made that tackle.

He showed good athletic ability. Now, will the lightbulb go on? Will he trust the coaching staff and resist the urge to leave his responsibility and "make the play"?

I'm also convinced there's a graduate school on the BB defense where guys like Bruschi, Rodney and Vrabes are allowed to improvise and switch because they know the D so well.

Gotta walk before you can run, though.
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Old 08-10-2007, 10:54 PM   #49
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And this three year stuff is horse feathers.

Don't let anyone get outside. Let the other players do their assignments.

The reason it takes a while is they instinctively try to make a play.

It's simple. Execute your assignment and the coach won't blame you if the run goes inside you. You have to trust the coaching staff on that one.

Don't execute your assignment and you won't get three years.

Do you think they want to revisit the TBC mistake?
I know TBC didn't end up playing too well in the playoffs, but I hardly think what we got out of a 7th rounder, who played dirt cheap for a few years, constitutes a mistake. If we get semi-okay depth play out of Rogers at minimum price and he's good enough to make the squad for the next 3 or 4 years, that'll be fantastic? Am I hoping for more than that? You bet. But "mistake" seems strong there.
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Old 08-10-2007, 10:59 PM   #50
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First, no injuries. Good news.

Cassel looked good enough, especially with third string receivers.

Faulk just played terrific. Flawless receiving, great running. Still a weapon.

I didn't learn much at all about the receivers. Washington? I don't know how you can project anything on him, based on a couple late plays. First, Moss and Stallworth didn't take the bus down. Second, they were throwing to the backs, at least early in the game. Also, with Watson, Thomas, and Brady all staying home, not much to learn about the tight ends. Mills failed to make enough of an impact in the spotlight - he was behind Rivers (who did look like Graham on one play in his #82 jersey.)

I thought the starting OL looked terrific. Great push, big pocket, lots of time, of course against a vanilla front. That was Nick Kaczur getting the start, by the way.

Tampa Bay put up more rushing yards than passing, but most of that was against the last string in the fourth quarter. Neither team broke 125 yards passing. Not much offense anywhere in this game.

On DL, Mike Wright was a monster. Big tackles, big pressure, big sack, great game. Santonio Thomas was probably the most impressive back-up. (Note that he's not a linebacker...) Kareem Brown showed some speed, coming around from the weak side to run down the running back downfield later in the game.

Where was Pierre Woods? Didn't notice him. Justin Rodgers looked OK, good pressure a couple times, picked up a fumble and made a lot of tackles. He may have done as much to make the team as anyone. Lua made a few hits downfield, but also read the play wrong and made the wrong first step, opening up the middle for a crossing route on the Tampa Bay touchdown. He didn't step up and stuff anything.

Meriweather was pretty much on the field for every play, at least on defense, mostly at outside cornerback. Welcome to the NFL, rookie, it's 108 and you're playing every snap in preseason. He showed good attitude, but not too many big plays, and was clearly being targeted. Gay looked good, and made some good plays against the run. Glad to see that Hobbs was not returning kicks. Richardson got a lot of looks at corner as well. Where was James Sanders?

On special teams, no Josh Miller. Baugher and Malone were both in positions to drop the ball inside the 10, but special teams always let the ball bounce in. As noted, Anam is an idiot. He not only ran down the entire field out of bounds, he ran outside the yard-wide white chalk mark. Good thing he didn't knock over a coach. Gemarra Williams had a terrific run-back, but I can't imagine he can make the team. He was returning kicks next to Willie Andrews. Gostkowski kicked one out of bounds, giving the ball to the Bucs on the 40 to start the second half, and edged in a 23-yard field goal.

Game went quick, but seemed sort of slow.
Woods & Alexander didn't play. I think I read on Reiss's blog.
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