PatsFanInVa

All the usual suspects aside (McDaniels, BB, Brady, Pioli, the Krafts, the O Line, injuries, the game plan, etc.,) I personally am not freaked out by a 6-3 start. What lends the chicken-littles credence, however, is the uncharacteristically "open" nature of some of the Pats' own comments this year (at least, as I've heard them.)

Obviously, we've heard from Seymour, who mentioned being "outcoached," and mentioned he wasn't getting enough reps. We've heard from Brady, who's criticized the "sand pit," (though he had the grace to wait until the field turf decision was announced,) and IIRC made some minor disparaging remarks when Branch did get let go. At least in the Brady case, he's always started with himself when it was time to pass blame around, in fairness.

Then there's the whole Posture Watch contingent, the people (notably announcers) who want to decide Brady's state of mind based on body language. Not to mention the recently dubbed "Felger-Killin Corey Dillon."

Here's what this post is not: A slam on any of these guys for feeling frustration. Here's what this post is: an open question on the possibility of a "burnout" effect -- coming to terms with the fact that they've bought into the system lock, stock, and barrel, and that they're expected to behave as always, when the team is not dominating, and when the front office -- for all their business acumen -- tends to treat personality and loyalty as nonexistent.

The FO is right, of course -- that is the state of the sport at the moment, and they had a great deal of success by realizing that fact early, making ruthless cuts when players were unaffordable luxuries. Bledsoe. Law. Patten. Now WillieMac, Adam, Branch, and Givens. It's likely Pats players know they're right. But that doesn't stop it from having a mental effect.

So here's the question: just as the Pats have always played as more than the sum of their parts, could we be seeing a disruption that you could phrase as the removal of that synergy effect? As in, the individual talent level is still high, but the ability to adapt has gotten ablated away until individuals are just emotionally raw?

Or as has been posited elsewhere, is Bridget Moynahan just necessitating too many late nights and possibly performance enhancing substance use with some sort of game day side-effects on Brady's part?

Okay that last part was totally tongue in cheek... (mmmmm... Bridget Moynahan... tongue in cheeeeeek...) Uh, as was that last last part. But the question is serious:

We know the Patsfans posters are showing frustration (yeah yeah especially newbies...) But is the team showing burnout effects?

That said/asked - whatever's broke will look fixed if/when we win the next two. So goddammit don't start chicken little hating back at me.

PFnV

Pats726

This is possible..I think we all look to connect the dots and find the missing pieces. ALl of that is possible...but there is so much we do not know...and what we do not know will in fact give this whole issue weight or not. All of what you said is true..about Seymour, Brady....Vrabel and TroyB all have said other things as well..but I don't know if this is really all true or not. Is the fact that more is out there this year a sign of what is going on inside?? What if it's not necessarily MORE, but that more is out there...and that in past years there's been just as much or more dealt with internally..just that the
windows and doors were shut tighter???
The proof may be in the pudding..the way the last 7 games are played and how much momentum this team has going into the playoffs. Football is an emotional game and whatever is said, the last two games were full of frustration; games that were close full of could have beens/should haves/whys and if onlys.....if you think the newbies are frustrated..I think BB and the coaches and players are more so exponentially.
There may be a "burnout effect"..or some x factor in the chemsitry of it all that is not there..but as much as one looks at the last two games, one must not forget the Vikings and Bengals games. and not be looking at it from the aftermath of their collapses but with what it looked like on the other side..the impossible trip to Cinci and the Vikes, almost unstoppable in the Dome. These were two very impressive wins.
In balance, I still feel this team is a work in progress that will evolve more in the next games. If the team comes together and gains momentum like last year, a playoff run may be very possible. If the team sputters and does not, then one and done may be what the team will do in January..or even worse, see a Mangini led Jet team take them down. I don't think that is probable, but worst case senario..and in the minds of many...VERY possible.
It's great to speculate and connect the dots and find the missing pieces, but I think so much is unknown, it may be impossible to nail it all down. More is out there this year and with back to back losses..totally unexpected, it all may add up to some sort of negative mirage or maybe that balck cloud IS really a storm. Time will tell.

SVN

more than burnout its the pressure this team faces day in day out since the last 4-5 yrs...Everyone expects nothing less than a SB,nothing less than BB outsmarting people and i dont mean us fans but every media outlet every analysis ask,"can pats win SB again?"...
Playing at such a high level for such a long time with constantly changing personnel takes its toll on everyone...Even the 49ers in the 80's went through 2-3 yrs downtime before Rice came in and they won a couple more championships...Right now dynasty is judged in terms of championships not in terms of how long someone can sustain a winning team over a length of time and certainly that pressure can get to anyone...they are human

Tunescribe

If there is such a thing, it would point to need for a regime (coaching) change, wouldn't it? I highly doubt it, based on the mere fact that these are very young men in their twenties and early thirties who are pampered athletes making huge sums of money. They should be resilient by nature and, if emotionally mature (which is never a given since they don't live in the "real" world like you and I), should be approaching their jobs professionally. Think about it: Even if they go all the way to the Super Bowl, they still get essentially five months off every year to "decompress" (save for mini-camps and off-season conditioning requirements). If any of these kids feel burned out, they don't love what they do and are in the wrong job.

Patfandango

Some good points but I don't think burnout is an issue. There is enough turnover that includes hungry veterans (Seau and now Testaverde) that come here with leadership skills and want a ring. I think this has been a deliberate strategy over the years (Cox, Harrison, Dillon etc). The vets have been more vocal this year but I think that Seymour and to some extent Brady are trying to step up to fill the void left by Willie. Hobbs is just vocal and his comment on being mentally fatigued in the 4th quarter was troubling. I also think we all tend to forget how much of a struggle other years have been during the season (except perhaps 2004 when we were just overpowering). I think were progressing and there have been some hard lessons this season that warns this team that playing less than their best jeopardizes victory. Let's see how the playoffs go. I like our experience in T shirt games.

satz

I do not know where you guys get your info.I was PVN every day and the WEEi shows on comcast on demand [its free] .Anyway , hobbs was nearly in tears when he said it was his fault the pats lost to the JETS .I have seen him talk smack a few times before but this is the first time he took the blame and did not look happy.
seymour is seymour he is all cool and the people who speak in the locker room not happy or look frustrated .

I think seeing someone talk in video vs radio outputs a different vibe.i expect a good run from now and even if they do not win the SB as a fan i do support them as the future is bright.

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MoLewisrocks

Tell you what, I think in an organization where the system has always been credited for allowing a sum of the parts team (they can just plug in the next guy on the depth chart...) to achieve dynasty status, it's only natural for the players to feel that maybe in those seasons where the sum of the parts appear to be out of synch or aren't getting it done perhaps the system should be subject to as much criticism as the talent immediately is. After all, part of the system is a disciplined financial component that determines the level of talent that will be acquired or retained.

Veteran players who remain here have bought in - though not quite as blindly as some in the fan base and media. They still believe players play and coaches coach and while the best talent cannot necessarily achieve success absent a viable system (See Redskins, Washington, 2002-2006), the most brilliant system cannot consistently succeed without a certain level of talent capable of executing within it (not to mention on occasion a boatload of luck and a hefty dash of karma - See Patriots, 2001).

The system is relying on a higher percentage of players this season who have little or no foundation in the system than at any time since 2001. And the team was already coming off a season where loss of talent due to injury seemed to stress the system to the point it simply could not overcome it. In all honesty while we pulled it together late last season it was barely enough to succeed against weak competition. The FO made some moves in the offseason designed to upgrade or restock the roster, but they were unable to make some others and in the final analysis even lost a couple of players nobody was anticipating losing. The additions vs. the subtractions may have resulted in little more than a net wash to date due to inexperience in the system. And that may be grating on the veterans of the 2005 team who spent this offseason with avenging that season on their minds.

There are coaching questions this season on both sides of the ball which is one more side than was being questioned by players and fans midway through last season. Are the players executing inconsistently or are the game plans unimaginative or insufficient or not agressive enough. Or is it because we lack personnel or are those personnel simply not performing as they should have been expected to - or are they not being put in a position to succeed. BB has lost a lot of his support system over the last three seasons - Weis, Crennel, Davidson, Mangini and even Saban who was his defacto scheme consultant through three superbowl runs. Is it possible the AFC teams we face as rivals are catching up to Belichick's schemes or his ability to adapt those is suffering from a talent drain of its own.

Don Banks is on WEEI now and he's contending that within that locker room the acknowledged leading problem on offense remains lack of consistent execution of routes. And he too is questioning the apparent unwillingness or inability of the coaching staff to make adjustments to opponents whose game plans against us seem to be right on.

So if there is a burnout factor at work as a component in this teams performance this season, perhaps it's not related to individual desire to play championship football so much as frustration at feeling that that desire is being undercut to a large extent by circumstances out of the relm of the players control.

ChockBlkr

I don't think the players are "burnt out" on the base philosophy of the organization.
The one consistent thing that I've noticed after every loss this year is that the players seem to be somewhat baffled as to why they really lost. Every player seems to feel that they did what was expected of them as far as their abilities could allow. I agree with them.
I think that every player has a good working knowledge of the playbook and their own personal responsibilities. I think this is a very solid team talent wise, but as always, there are no "superstar" athletes on the team.
It just seems, whether by design or not, that the players are very often being put into situations where an above average performance is required for them to be successful and more often than not, they haven't been successful. IMO this is causing the frustration that the players are feeling and it doesn't seem that the coaching staff is adjusting to problem.
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5 Rings for Brady!!

The stuff about the players complaining is being overplayed in the media and also at this site somewhat.

Seymour repeated exactly what his coach said, word for word, after the loss. Nothing more. They got outplayed and outcoached. Exactly what Belichick said.

Brady has been his usual self. People that say he just isn't himself need to take all the hits that Brady has taken, and then get up and play some more. Brady has yet to back down, although his execution has suffered under pressure. He is human, after all.

The veterans may feel frustrated, but it is being overplayed in the media right now. These guys are not robots, and I'm gald that they feel frustrated when they lose.

kurtinelson

Agreed. Belichick has said this every time the team loses.

I disagree. I have no numbers to back this up, but it seems that this is the most inaccurate Brady has been in his career - even on downs when he is not under pressure from the rush.

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