mikey

David Givens - 7th round!

Adam Vinatieri - Undrafted!

Where is their sense of gratitude??

Who would have heard of a David Givens or an Adam Vinatieri if not for the Patriots??

Who took the risk and gave them the opportunities?

And this is how they repay us??

They should have done what Brady and Bruschi did: take a paycut and stay with the team.



.

Feep_FLA

I see your point and honestly feel your pain. But each player is an individual person/player. I don't hold any grudges and definately don't feel they "owe" their team anything. Just my take.

Pats726

Why don't you add Andruzzi and Patten to the list...neither was drafted..both left...

AndyJohnson

I think they do owe the Patriots a thank you.
By being part of this organization, their value on the market has risen to more than the Patriots think they are worth.

If Givens and Vinatieri played for other teams the rest of their career, BB would be signing them because their percieved value would be less than what they would contribute here.

Its kind iof like this.
By being a PAtriot the rest of the league thinks you are better than you are.
If oyu are a Cardinal or a Lion the rest of the league thinks you are worse than you are.


You cant just measure it in stats, but I will to simplify the point.

If David Givens is a 70 catch WR for Tom Brady, and a 50 catch WR for Steve McNair, and Joe Blow is a 50 catch WR for Steve McNair but would be a 70 catch WR for Tom Brady, Givens gets paid like a 70 catch guy, and Joe Blow gets paid like a 50 catch guy. We end up with the 'same player' and get him a lot cheaper.

What would you do in that case if you were either guy?

The evidence of this is how many FAs we sign are better here than they were on their last team, and a huge majority of those that leave arent as good where they go as they were here.

We take other teams 'castoffs' and other teams go after our FAs. Yet we keep winning. The same player is better here than elsewhere and worse when he leaves. OF COURSE we turn over the roster, because we keep the talent level about the same at a lower cost. Add in our drafting prowess, and sometimes the better replacement is in the wings already.

An analogy to baseball.
Leo Mazzone is regarded as a genius pitching coach.
The Braves take a sucky pitcher from another team and e becomes a good pithcer paid like he is bad.
A Bravers pitcher becomes a FA, and teams line up to sign a great pticher. They lack the coaching and he becomes a decent pitcher at a very high price.

363839

These are great points, Andy.

Has there ever been an era in NFL history where Patriots players were so sought after?

Isn't it beautiful?!

AndyJohnson

Willie McGinest is a clutch, big play guy.

What does Cleveland get out of him when they are rarely in the position to have a clutch big play?

Think about the game winning, game changing plays Willie has made here.

What would the general opinion of Willie be in he was playing on a 6-10 team, and didnt have the players around him to create the big play opportunities

Pats726

Great point AJ...absolutely...and there is nothing wrong with it..It's just that fans have to understand this..be prepared when players leave and know there are players that are comparable or better that are undervalued all around the league. The trick is to find them...and so far BB/SP have done a solid job...last year wasn't a good one..but still that is OK...Take a look at all the years..not one like some short sighted people.

OldEnglandPatriot

I imagine the players feel that if the Patriots hadn't drafted them (Givens) or picked them up (Vinatieri) then they would have made it somewhere else.

You've got to have that sort of self-belief to be an NFL player, I imagine.

jczxohn1

What amazes me is how quickly Pats FA's get picked up at above-market rates and how seldom they make the Pro Bowl. With 3 new BB-tree coaches in the league, I guess it isn't too surprising.

__________________
Felger started his question, "Correct me if I'm wrong," BB quickly interjected, "I can't wait--"


``The officials now are evaluating the players and their performance, I mean, that's great,'' Belichick deadpanned. ``I can't say how much that means to me, really.''

IcyPatriot

It's called freedom and the desire to reach and be rewarded for your hard work. It's why some people are more successful in life personal/work than others.

They owe us no more than we owe all the other players who toil away and get cut in an instant. This is where I have a big problem with the people who say athletes owe this and owe that.

We're not there when their friends get cut, maybe causing financial problems or financial ruins. Living away from their families to get ahead and coming home empty handed. We don't see all that anguish...they do and thus they take the money when they can.

It's Athletic Capitalism at it's most rewarding...they deserve it.